Horizontal cracks and cams

Hello to all I just wanna start this post out by saying try and keep the judgment to a minimum.

I just started guiding for a camp and they have a questionable rack of a lot of different sizes of tri cams. They were re slung by someone in town and have no ratings or dates on them. This is problem number 1 for me.

Problem number two is that I was instructed to set up up top rope systems on these tri-cams for the campers to climb. Initially, my thought was to ask for 6 -black diamond number two cams to replace their traditional anchor system away from the tri-cams. Three cams for each anchor, because there are two routes here they have been setting up with various tricams. But now I’m concerned about the cams in the horizontal cracks. Am I better off just getting a new set of tri cams for this anchor? Or is top roping on cams in horizontal cracks OK? The direction of pull would be close to 90 degrees. I haven’t ever top roped groups of people on just tri cams for anchors so this is just a bit foreign to me so any and all insight would be great. Just trying to do the best thing for myself and the campers to keep everyone safe now and in the future. Thank you :)

Any way you could take a quick anchor course from a guide? A day out building anchors with a guide before the campers show up (ideally at your top roping site) would be a super experience plus you would get a good idea of the specific gear you really need. I know you said you are “guiding” for this camp but the nature of the question leads me to believe you meant that in a more general sense. If I’m off base on that, my apologies. It’s just really important to make sure you have bomber anchors when campers are doing the dangle and thrash for hours.

As to your question, cams could certainly work in a horizontal crack, but it depends on how you set up the anchor, how deep you can set the cams, where the cliff edge is relative to your anchor, pull direction, etc. Pictures of your situation might help.

EDIT: Forgot to ask, why six cams all of the same size (#2)?

Are you always setting up top ropes at the same spot for the campers?  Maybe working with someone that is experienced in bolting to put in anchor bolts would make more sense.

Share photos of the gear and the placements. Likely get lots of good tips.

Tricams in the cam placements can be hard to judge as they can walk at different directions of pull.

Especially if you are belaying from the bottom and the pro can't be visually watched I would add another type of pro. ---Bolts, pins, cams, stoppers. Which  will depend on your experience setting them and the ethics/ management of the climbing site.

Get onsite help if at all uncomfortable.

Yeah bolts have been chopped numerous times here. Previous guides at the camp say it’s the industry standard in the area to use the tri cams for top roping, I’m just trying to bring the camp up to date because yeah the tri cams walk on me a lot! (and like I mentioned, the slings have no ratings and no one knows when they were last re slung ) I’m more so curious to know if cams placed in horizontal cracks with the force top roping can give pulling downward at a 90 degree angle. Which am I better off with? New cams? Or new tri cams. I have been suggesting more top rope friendly areas but they really like looking glass rock.

to user: six twos because that’s the horizontal crack size…. And they have a limited budget. And it’s two routes so three cams per anchor. 

Daniel Joder wrote:

...As to your question, cams could certainly work in a horizontal crack, but it depends on how you set up the anchor, how deep you can set the cams, where the cliff edge is relative to your anchor, pull direction, etc. Pictures of your situation might help...

I was going to comment on this point as well:  cams in horizontal cracks must be set fairly deep to hold. If near the lip, torque on the head can pop them out. Tricams might be better in shallow horizontal cracks, but their placement must be more precise than cams.

This whole scenario -- uncertainty about anchors that are being used to toprope a bunch of kids -- gives me the shivers! As others have mentioned, please do have someone with trad-anchor experience inspect your anchors in person, if at all possible. If you are really unsure of the anchors, it might be best to walk away than be responsible for a kid's injury.

Thanks for your opinions. Not sure how much you think a summer camp climbing guide pays but the amga rock guides aren’t banging down the doors over here.  I’d hope that maybe you’d just appreciate the fact I came here to ask a question to BETTER the situation. Instead of just answering a simple question, peer to peer, you assume I have no experience. So thanks for that. Probably should have asked this question on the woman’s rock climbing page to be taken seriously.