Edelrid

What is up with all the new Edelrid gear that is 100% directly copied from Petzl? They are coming out with the pinch which is pretty much a gri gri. They have a progress capture pulley that’s a micro Traxion they even have a pulley biner that’s identical to the petzl one and several other products. Did some pattens run out or something? It’s not that big of a deal but for some reason it just kinda bugs me. 

They do have the Ohm.  

And they have some innovations in ropes. 

And the aluminum carabiners with the steel inserts are cool.

Progress capture pullies have been done by many other brands before edelrid "copied" petzl, pulley biners were originally done by dmm, many many other brands have copied the grigri in the past with a spin on it, whether that be Beal, madrock, or edelrid. 

Nothing new under the sun. 

Ehh a little competition is a good thing.  Leads to more innovation.  #Neox

Even the Edelrid Pinch which you mention has several innovations the grigri does not have;  you can connect it to a harness without a carabiner which allows for larger rope movements during clipping, panic function can be disabled if you like, certified for rope positioning, preferred rope feed from the front with additional braking groves which might work better with narrower ropes.

Whether or not these innovations prove valuable has yet to be determined but without this type of competition the products available would have stagnated decades ago.  Imagine if the original ford model A was considered the apex of car innovation.  All cars are basically a frame with 4 wheels, motor, drivetrain, steering and seating.  Everything else is just copying.  :) :) Over time the small changes and selection of better ideas lead to significantly better products.

I agree with you guys competition is a good thing and companies copy each other all the time. Perhaps I didn’t word my post well. I was more asking about the possible behind the scenes reasons that many of Edelrids newer products seem to closely follow the form as well as the function of many older Petzl products. Sometimes this happens when patents run out or even an employee leaves one company and heads to another. The pinch is not a good example but there ares definitely a few that I’ve put pictures of that are more similar to any other competing companies. 

Just you wait until you find out about tube style belay devices, copies everywhere. 

I don’t think just because the products aesthetically look similar means that they are copies. I think what you are seeing is that there just aren’t that many ways to skin the cat. Just look at carabiners, ATCs, cams, etc.

The Spoc is more akin to the Nano Traxion spec wise. The Spoc came out before the Nano.

Pulley carabiners are pretty common among brands for a while now. I can’t imagine there to be an active patent on the basic concept at this point.

The adjustable lanyards are basically just blocking ATCs on short pieces of rope. Petzl did seem to come to the market first with this application (as for as I noticed at least), but Edelrid seems to own the lions share of the market in blocking ATCs with their Jul lineup.

Not to mention Edelrid’s bulletproof lineup, their Protect lineup, etc. I don’t think those guys are just kicking back copying products over there. 

Also the Kong Slyde really got the game going, Petzl just made it more accessible. 

The GigaJul is like nothing else out there, as far as I know. Still needs some refinement but it surprises me that ATCs, Reversos, etc haven't been banned at the crag like the way they have been in gyms (that's a joke, kinda).

Bulletproof carabiners and the GigaJul are game changers. 

To hell with all of you! Follow the link to sign my petition to sue Edelrid and put Tommy Caldwell behind bars for intellectual property theft. www.imrightyourwrong.org

Ok maybe you guys are right. I personally just see more visual similarities between these two companies products that accomplish the same goal than most others. I may also be biased because edelrid is kinda a new company to me. For some reason I had not really seen any of the stuff until the last several years. If you asked me about them ten years ago I don’t think I even knew they existed but these days they really seem to be on fire.

Rexford Nesakwatch wrote:

The GigaJul is like nothing else out there, as far as I know. 

The click up, the mammut smart, the atc pilot, the GigaJul, the megajul, these all use the same concept of using the devices passive geometry to clamp the rope. The slidey thing is really no more than a gimmick, in the sense that it doesn't add new functionality that isn't already widely available. 

This doesn't make it bad there is still argument thst it's innovative, but it definitely isn't like nothing else out there. 

that guy named seb wrote:

The click up, the mammut smart, the atc pilot, the GigaJul, the megajul, these all use the same concept of using the devices passive geometry to clamp the rope. 

Yeah, but you can't rappel on the click up, pilot, or the smart; the smart alpine is too bulky for alpine climbing, and the megajul is too grabby. The last two points are splitting hairs I realize. Maybe a better way to have said it is that Edelrid (IMHO of course) is in the lead now, for me, for one device to do it all. 

And I would have worn through five Reversos in the five years I have been using the same Giga.

Rexford Nesakwatch wrote:

Yeah, but you can't rappel on the click up, pilot, or the smart; the smart alpine is too bulky for alpine climbing, and the megajul is too grabby. The last two points are splitting hairs I realize. Maybe a better way to have said it is that Edelrid (IMHO of course) is in the lead now, for me, for one device to do it all. 

And I would have worn through five Reversos in the five years I have been using the same Giga.

If I have to take one device...its the giga. Way more versatile than any other device.
Its not the greatest at anyone thing for sure, but excellent at all IME.

Regarding the Switch Adjust vs. the Connect Adjust, I got to play with a Switch Adjust the other day and it does actually function differently than the Connect Adjust. Rather than the rotation Petzl's requires to release it, Edelrid's is more a direct pull that seemed to release much more easily. I just got to try it out a few times and don't have extensive experience with it, but it seemed much easier to use than Petzl's.

When it comes to products, it is all about patents. When patents expire for a good design, similar products are designed and released. Nothing to see, just buy.

The axiom is 40-50g lighter than the petzl rollclip (depending on gate variants) and has a much higher efficiency pulley than the dmm revolver.

The spoc has a better cam lockout than the microtrax, despite being closer in weight to the (lockoutless) nano (the spoc doesn’t have sealed bearings though, which is a critical flaw IMO).

What's up with speed buckles, amirite??

Joseph W. Dutton wrote:

 I may also be biased because edelrid is kinda a new company to me. For some reason I had not really seen any of the stuff until the last several years. If you asked me about them ten years ago I don’t think I even knew they existed but these days they really seem to be on fire.

Edelrid has been around for 160 years.  They developed the first kernmantle rope and depending on where you get your history also the modern climbing rope.  They also apparently designed one of the first specifically made climbing harnesses and sewn quickdraws.

And guess who actually manufactures Petzl ropes??

Another fun fact, their North American operations are based in Redmond, OR because Carsten von Birckhahn, who was the manger of Edelrid, came to visit me while I was living there.  He liked it so much he thought it would be a better location than their then current distribution location of Boulder.  Apparently warehouse space is also cheaper in central Oregon... 

Mikey Schaefer wrote:

Edelrid has been around for 160 years.  They developed the first kernmantle rope and depending on where you get your history also the modern climbing rope.  They also apparently designed one of the first specifically made climbing harnesses and sewn quickdraws.

And guess who actually manufactures Petzl ropes??

Another fun fact, their North American operations are based in Redmond, OR because Carsten von Birckhahn, who was the manger of Edelrid, came to visit me while I was living there.  He liked it so much he thought it would be a better location than their then current distribution location of Boulder.  Apparently warehouse spaces is also cheaper in central Oregon... 

Some proper knowledge, love this. 

There's such a thing as a better mousetrap. Look at the plethora of devices spawned by the BD ATC. When something works pretty well, people will try modifications that make it better. If you're just looking at pictures, you can't begin to judge whether something is merely a copy (there's a bazillion Reverso look-alikes out there) or a (probably just incremental) improvement.

I can't comment on the Pinch, but I think the Switch Adjust is an improvement on the Petzl version.