Aiders - how many steps is best?

OK, quick question with any luck. I've been offered some Metolius 8 step aiders at a fair price. Most other sets that I see are 5 or 6 steps. Is 8 too many or should I not worry too much? 

I'm planning a couple of Fisher Towers ascents this spring and maybe a couple others in Arches while I'm in the area. I'm not climbing hard...C2/3 at most.

Much obliged

C3 fisher tower lol

As a weak coward, I can tell you I prefer more steps than less. Makes it easier to make small movements……which is why I will never be fast or good. Pros and cons.  My favorite are these Camp 10 steps.

But above all….you need a spreader bar. If those Metolius don’t have one make your own or pass on those.

Not a fan of the ladder type aiders, can’t keep your center of gravity close enough to the aider to prevent your feet from sweeping out continually, or being pushed into the wall, or tree.

I liked 2 pairs of 8step ladders, myself.  And 4 different colors. I could reach high enough to make a short ladder too high to step up into.  Sucks when youre too high.  I thought the metolius 8step were the cats pajamas.

Not a fan of spreader bars, myself. Unnecesarry shin bangers.  Was always curious about Russian aiders.

If youre going to the Fishers, l have z pitons, sawed angles, and large angles for hand placements l am offloading. Also a 1/4" removeable bolt thats useful there

Aid is scary

Eric Craig wrote:

Hey Russ, if you read this,  am I still on your shit list? 

You flatter yourself. I have no idea who you are, but if you are on the list, you are in vast and great company.

Eric Craig wrote:

Well, there you have it, between this post here and the identical one under big wall climbing, you have a variety of answers. And mostly from experienced to extremely experienced wall climbers. So they are all good answers. 

My walling experience dates from 1974-1998. I 've never used the ladder type, but the basic 6 step pattern with longer steps low and shorter steps high I expect is very efficient, and no doubt why they are popular. The 5 step "etrier " style is what I was using mid '80's - '90's and obviously is still popular.  If I were going buy some now, I would get one of these two types, and get just 2 of them. (And I might do that,  because I am starting back up, at this advanced age, just not sure yet how far I'm gonna be able to take it). The main thing for you is to just pick a set up, maybe even the 8 steppers, and learn how to make it work.  Try to keep it simple. No one set up is the best for everything. 

Hey Russ, if you read this,  am I still on your shit list? If not, are you still making stuff? I want a nice trim swami belt/ leg loop set up. Like you made 35 or so years ago.??????? I'll buy you a case of beer. 

Hi Eric. You're right - lots of good replies from folk who know what they're talking about. I have limited experience, maybe five Fisher ascents and a few in Arches (and The Nose back in the day) so any and all advice is gratefully received. 

Shouldn't matter if you top step correctly ;) 

The key to smooth, fast, and good aiding is to always climb as high into the ladder as possible, and then place as high as humanly possible.

Landon McDowell wrote:

The key to smooth, fast, and good aiding is to always climb as high into the ladder as possible, and then place as high as humanly possible.

Actually it’s not (at least not for the specific type specified by the OP) but this is MP, so we’ll carry on.

Actually, you, like many of the "folks" here on MP, need 12 steps.

Overall height of aiders is a more valuable metric as a step isn’t a standardazied height. Really tall people probably will want taller/longer aiders. Longer aiders are also nice for steeps, down aiding, and traverses. 

Steve McGee wrote:

Actually, you, like many of the "folks" here on MP, need 12 steps.

With my height and ape, I could probably use that many. ;). Really though, I’d love to try the camp 10 step at some point… but my custom Metolius/Skot’s modified are the shiznit, so I’ll stick with those.

I vaguely remember reading somewhere that Fred Beckey had 100' aiders

Christian Hesch wrote:

Actually it’s not (at least not for the specific type specified by the OP) but this is MP, so we’ll carry on.

Odd. I must be doing it wrong...

I got 6 steps, and that seems sufficient. But I guess it is the length of the aider that matters... I got Aideers https://www.aideerclimbing.rocks/theaideer.html and the lowest step is very low. I like to hang out there being scared, but I do not think I would like a longer ladder. With those six steps you are way below the gear and longer would lead to more entanglements.

Landon, at risk of thread derailment (ha, who am I kidding)… the OP spec’d C1/C2 as primary use, thus the fastest way for them to aid is typically going to be keeping the ladders on the piece, rather than moving the ladders from piece to piece. It takes significantly more time to move ladders from the lower piece to the upper piece, than it does to simply bump the piece/ladder combo upwards. Upwards can mean as little as 1ft, but if it’s enough to mean that it enables doing the same thing with the other ladder, it’s worth it - and faster than trying to force a “top step” with every placement

This is most easily accomplished in splitter cracks but, with some creativity, can be done on routes w/ irregular protection. Try it sometime on a 12b (or whatever is a few grades above freeing for you) fingers crack and see what you think after making 14 straight moves w/ blue and yellow totems, never removing the ladders from their respective cams. You might like it :) 

 Obviously this only works on easy C1/C2, not A3 type stuff.

That is fun to hear. In my experience the fastest way have been to stand in the ladder, place an intermediate pice to clib an adjustable fifi to, only to alow me to top step and get a high placement, and then move a ladder. I´m not good at aid climbing, but moving everything while being on the rock seem very out there. I would normaly move from one ladder to the other? Perhaps I did not understand that at all...

Martin forgive me for derailing.

Has anyone ever stood on a yates spreader bar, many times when on low angel terrain I have wanted to do so but by my judgment got the best of me!

Has anyone ever stood on a yates spreader bar, many times when on low angel terrain I have wanted to do so but by my judgment got the best of me!

I’ve done it, but only on lower angle (*85?), wouldn’t be real excited about it on steeper stuff. Skot’s modified spreader is the shit though, it’s flat and handles stepping on it very well