Big toenail brusing after first attempts at crack climbing?

My local gym has a few cracks to practice on and I'm starting to get the hang of the slabier crack, but I've noticed my big toenail on one of my feet is bruising. Is this normal or is my technique just really bad?

What shoes are you using? If they’re really soft that could contribute

I've never encountered it.  There usually shouldn't be pressure bearing down on top of the toenail, but maybe you'd get that if you're using aggressively downturned shoes.

Pieter Beerepoot wrote:

What shoes are you using? If they’re really soft that could contribute

Air Tommy's, TC pros

Grayson G wrote:

Air Tommy's, TC pros

$215 on gym shoes!!

My toenails get more abuse from edging than crack climbing. 

Michael Abend wrote:

$215 on gym shoes!! 

Maybe they are outside shoes, too? Would that be OK with you?

FrankPS wrote:

Maybe they are outside shoes, too? Would that be OK with you?

I use cheap shoes for all my climbing. But that’s because I’m weak and my shoes are not my limitation. I just think it’s silly to use such expensive shoes in the gym, on walls made out of sandpaper. 

Michael Abend wrote:

$215 on gym shoes!!

My toenails get more abuse from edging than crack climbing. 

I couldn't find the black diamond Alex Honnold edition climbing shoes, so I figured getting the TC pros would be good enough. The green color almost matches my Alex Honnold signature BD solution harness too!

Michael Abend wrote:

I use cheap shoes for all my climbing. But that’s because I’m weak and my shoes are not my limitation. I just think it’s silly to use such expensive shoes in the gym, on walls made out of sandpaper. 

Maybe he's using his TC Pros to practice on his crack climbing, then switching back to his cheaper shoes for sandpaper wall climbing. That's what I do.

Is that OK with you?

What sort of crack are you working? Width, etc...? I'm presuming "toe jams" but that's just a guess. If so, don't crank so hard on your big toe. And don't be surprised if you lose the nail.

Grayson G wrote:

My local gym has a few cracks to practice on and I'm starting to get the hang of the slabier crack, but I've noticed my big toenail on one of my feet is bruising. Is this normal or is my technique just really bad?

Climbing friend, it is normal.

 Dipping your toes and fingers in the crack is, hmmyah, most unpleasant and painful at all times. Most peoples theys only resorting to this type of self flagellations and self hatred after they can no longer gain the necessary meat for getting stronger on the hard moves of bouldering type, and must coast on "technique" while driving fossil fuels massive vehicles long distances for  "adventure" and because they "love the outdoors"

Aleks is back!

With no data about your experience- I can imagine a scenario where someone without climbing experience goes into a gym for the first time and sees a bunch of folks bouldering in uber tight fitting, down-turned shoes with all 10 toes knuckled over.  This new climber might think this is what everyone does and goes to buy the tightest fitting shoes they can tolerate.  

I have no idea, but if you are relatively new to climbing I recommend making sure your shoes really fit.  Gym shoes especially, for me, are comfort fit.  I can just BARELY wiggle my toes when I'm wearing my gym shoes.  If you're toes are scrunched up and jammed into shoes, even TC Pros, you are asking for foot injury.  As other have said, you shouldn't really be putting a ton of pressure on the tops of your toes when struggle-bussing up an easy gym crack.  

If your shoes are very comfy fit, then maybe it's just bad luck that you scrunched the toe in question while trying to learn to jam for the first time.  Keep working on it and eventually jamming won't be as painful (still painful) as you learn the nuance of making your shoes and hands work efficiently in this style.

I can only give my experience. I think you are asking, "in general, does one develop bruising on hands and feet from crack climbing?".  In my 100 years of crack climbing experience outside, I would say no, I rarely if ever develop any bruises.  However, in my 50 years of experience climbing artificial cracks (wood crack machines, gym cracks), I will very occasionally develop a slight bruise.  In my case, the back of the hand and the top of the feet, not the toe. But that is probably more because I am 150 years old, not because of technique.

My guess is that the bruising is more the result of the shape of your particular foot in your particular shoe, than in any "bad" technique. Yes crack climbing can be painful on your feet, inside more than out, but bruising is not that normal.  The pain is more about nerves screaming at you that this is unnatural. That gets extinguished very quickly.

I also would urge you to use another pair of shoes for gym cracks, which will destroy most shoes.  And also to wear a performance sock not be barefoot. My gym crack shoes are things I have retired from outside because they won't take another resole.  Right now I'm using a pair of old moccasyms. If your gym sells their old rental shoes, maybe you could find something there that fits well.

But the other thing I would say is that there may be no reason to continue to torture your feet in that gym crack is that size is horribly painful to you. Switch to a chip or hold if there is one nearby for a move or two or more. In my view the real benefit to gym cracks is that they work your crack climbing muscle groups, which are very different than face climbing groups.  Once you climb outside and you know HOW to use your feet and hands in a cracks of various sizes, you don't really forget it.  It's like riding a bicycle. The reason I do laps on the hand crack size in my gym in the winter season is just to keep those specific back muscles from getting weaker.  I use the off fingers crack for the ringlocks, not because I need practice at doing a ringlock, but because I can feel it working some very odd tricep muscle position.  It's particularly valuable to practice laybacks in the gym, since those muscle groups are so different from face climbing. As far as feet, maybe others will have had a different experience, but I never notice any leg or foot part that gets weaker if I have a lapse in crack climbing.

In terms of technique, you'll get more good benefit from going out to the Grotto or Lover's Leap for a couple of days than from forcing yourself to do an artificial crack that is too painful on your feet.

Grayson G wrote:

My local gym has a few cracks to practice on and I'm starting to get the hang of the slabier crack, but I've noticed my big toenail on one of my feet is bruising. Is this normal or is my technique just really bad?

I think I know that "slabier crack" (in Belmont) and will say that it is a crack that hurts! It gives off the impression that it'd be a good beginner crack because of its low angle, but it's carved in such a way that the bottom 1/3 emulates pin scars. They don't really teach the common jamming technique, but pin scars typically hurt (the 1st pitch of Serenity Crack came to mind). For true beginner hand cracks, you might want to go to Sunnyvale gym. 

That said, I believe people respond to hand/foot pressure differently, and there are hyper responders. It can be invisible -- the same amount of pressure causes more pain for some people (hyperalgesia is real); or it can be structural/visible -- bumps and deformed joints appear regardless of good or poor technique. I could very well be a wimp with poor technique, but I seem to belong in this club. It'd be unfortunate if you are one of us, however, there might be a few things you can try:

• trim your toenails down, like, really down, especially if they are thick.
• switch to true hand cracks that require jamming instead of front stepping, for lack of better word, as needed in pin scars.
• wear much roomier shoes with thick socks while practicing to alleviate some front pressure on the toes. Trust me, in true hand cracks, you don't need tight climbing shoes for secure jamming. 

All in all, I think while practicing crack climbing techniques, it is important to reduce/eliminate pain by all means (think comfy shoes, hand jammies, tape, pads, etc.) because pain can be very distracting and defeats the purpose of skill building.

Good luck!

Your shoes may be too tight. Moccs are much better to learn crack with, since they bag out and you can wiggle toes into cracks better, allowing better weight distribution across the foot

Mei pronounced as May wrote:

 (the 1st pitch of Serenity Crack came to mind). 

Mei, it's funny you mention that pitch.  That came into my mind as the rare crack where my feet hurt.  And calves screaming from the low angle because it's always at the very beginning of the season and they're not acclimated yet. I have a memory of looking down at my partner one time on that pitch and saying "my brain is screaming Jump Jump just to stop the pain".

Thanks for all the responses everyone, @Mei got it right, I am referring to the crack on the slab wall at Movement Belmont. My shoes fit nice and comfy, not loose, not tight either. I've got some more time in on the crack and was able to make it much less painful. I'm starting to get a better idea of what parts of the crack are going to make good or bad jams. I also figured out you can rotate your hand 180deg and potentially get a better hand jam, which has been a game changer. I'm really enjoying crack climbing so far and have found opportunities to use hand jams on some of the gym routes that run close to the cracks. 

Michael Abend wrote:

$215 on gym shoes!!

My toenails get more abuse from edging than crack climbing. 

For me at 210lb, the stiffer soles are a big help in a lot of ways. Your toenails would probably feel better if you did have stiffer soles, and just from that comment alone your claim that your shoes don't hold you back doesn't ring true. I also didn't pay full price for my TC's--you are aware that sales exist, right?

Why do you even feel the need to reply with snarky comments if you don't have anything to contribute?

On topic, I'd say the size cracks you're trying probably cause more pressure on that spot, or it could be a technique issue. Is the crack only big enough that you can only jam your toe in, or are you just torquing in a way that puts pressure on the toenail? One of the most important tips someone gave me with crack climbing is to drop your heel. It feels weird at first, but it shifts most of your weight from your toes back down to your heel through the rand of the shoe. It's massively more comfortable and much more efficient. If you're not already doing this, I'd say the toe pain may be from putting your weight down onto your toes instead of back onto your heel. This may not work for finger-size cracks.