Fancy specialized ice tools

I've been nerding out about different high end , designer ice tools. Elite climbs, forecast, kailas... Gotta be some others out there. What do you folks think about these tools? Is it worth spending a thousand bucks? What are pros and cons? Comfort levels? I'm interested to hear any and all opinions concerning these high end futuristic tools . 

Milton Mountaineering had a boutique set a couple years ago. Their website is dead now though. 

I just acquired a used pair of Kailas Entheos, and while they're a huge upgrade from my Vipers (especially dry tooling), I don't think I'm experienced enough to notice a difference vs other similar tools like Nomics or Fuels. Also, I met a guy a few days ago at the crag with Kestrels and he let me swing them, they felt soooo good and lightweight. He also had fresh Krukonogi picks. I think picks make a huge difference. 

Is all that lightweight-ness a pro? So the tool is light be the head still is heavier to get some power into the swing? 

Ira OMC wrote:

Is all that lightweight-ness a pro? So the tool is light be the head still is heavier to get some power into the swing? 

I believe lighter tools are less fatigueing to climb with. But that doesn't mean Kestrels let me climb anything I can't climb with my raptors.

When I think about what could be improved from the tools I I've used extensively,  (x dreams) I think of hooking into mushrooms a little better, ease of changing picks, maybe a more balanced swing? Seems like possibly a lighter tool with a heavier head might be an improvement? A more curved shaft could be nice but perhaps make the tool less versatile... 

A lot of these fancy tools have handled that seem very minimal. I haven't held any but some look very slippery and cold. 

I loaned my Elite Climb Morphos to my friend to climb with for a couple of days in Ouray.

He's climbed with all the usual tools, (X-Dreams, Nomics, Fuels, etc.)  

He called the Morphos "magic tools."  Said climbing ice with them was "cheating."  

Kai Larson wrote:

I loaned my Elite Climb Morphos to my friend to climb with for a couple of days in Ouray.

He's climbed with all the usual tools, (X-Dreams, Nomics, Fuels, etc.)  

He called the Morphos "magic tools."  Said climbing ice with them was "cheating."  

I want to cheat too ;) 

DMM just announced ice tools that looks to be quite fancy, they use the solid milled aluminum approach.

https://dmmwales.com/collections/ice-axes/products/cortex-pre-release

So far I’ve only seen that construction on the Kailas and forecast tools, and I haven’t used either. Can anyone comment on if that type of tool feels any different in use?

Those dmm tools look cool! I’ve also heard that the morphos are like cheating. 

Graham Johnson wrote:

Those dmm tools look cool! I’ve also heard that the morphos are like cheating. 

Those look like they have very similar geometry to the old grivel reparto course / master alloy tools. I always wanted to try them.

I always wondered why they stopped making them. 

I'm wondering what the advantage is if that "skeletor" style of frame? Light and strong I assume? But what's up with the thin bare bones handle? Is that not cold and slippery? 

Making the handle like that requires starting with a big block of aluminium and cutting as much of it away as possible whilst still retaining strength. This allows the product designers / engineers to be almost completely free with their design. You can end up with something very strong if a little heavy. Most mass manufacturers use extruded aluminium for their shafts. This is a lot simpler and cheaper as less material is wasted (I'm assuming DMM recycle it, but that still costs money). Tubes are plenty strong and light but can only be manipulated and bent a limited amount. 

The handle has a layer of rubber moulded directly over the top of the aluminium. Most companies use this technique. 

Ira OMC wrote:

I'm wondering what the advantage is if that "skeletor" style of frame? Light and strong I assume? But what's up with the thin bare bones handle? Is that not cold and slippery? 

I think most of the high end tools are at least somewhat based on competition tools and as such take the approach that you will apply your own preferred grip wrap, I personally prefer the thin profile and wrap with a single layer of tennis overgrip but some people wrap a thick, padded grip.

I have Morphos, love the carbon fiber for cold days, way less cold hands with true carbon tools... I don't suspect you will find better clearance on bulges or easier pick changes than X Dreams, both the Morphos and the Noreasters I would argue have a somewhat less aggressive attack with ice picks than you would be used to with X dreams, to the point I find Noreasters in particular to be scary on the upper grip, in pure ice setup I'd say they swing similar to Grivel tech machines...

I think where you see wildly better performance out of either the morphos or Noreasters would be on hard mixed/dry, morphos are straight cheating and the dry setup Noreasters are close, although they feel super clunky and heavy by comparison.

I've climbed on the other Elite climb tools and find them to be great on ice but a bit flexy for mixed, although this is also my complaint with X dreams but most people don't seem to mind.

honestly, the best pure ice setup I've climbed of all of the fancy tools is a set of X dreams with prototype Beartooth alpine picks, I'd be getting in line for some of those and saving big $

What did you like about those Beartooth Alpine picks over others? Haven't heard of them before. I've tried the Howey Tools picks (definitely more durable than the stock CAMP ones) and Kuznia (not sure if I bought the wrong model but these were horrendous, pretty much unusable on ice from the rebound - felt like I was swinging into a rock). Haven't had a chance to try out Sport-Steinle or Kruk yet but always looking for more options ...

Cole Crawford wrote:

What did you like about those Beartooth Alpine picks over others? Haven't heard of them before. I've tried the Howey Tools picks (definitely more durable than the stock CAMP ones) and Kuznia (not sure if I bought the wrong model but these were horrendous, pretty much unusable on ice from the rebound - felt like I was swinging into a rock). Haven't had a chance to try out Sport-Steinle or Kruk yet but always looking for more options ...

They have a thin profile like the ice-specific Krukanogi's but are much more durable, they displace very little ice, first swing sticks in bulletproof ice, but still do well in unconsolidated snice, something I think a lot of the open angle ice-specific picks don't do well, good profile on the top for using in cane position, generally really refined feel.

Ira OMC wrote:

I want to cheat too ;) 

Morphos are crazy expensive. If you don't own them don't use them or you will need to buy them.

What's the difference between elite climb raptors and morphos? Relative to Nomics, I'm assuming the raptors are a similar shape with similar grip and pick angles? And I assume the morphos are a bit more aggressive closer to ergonomics? Eventually I'd like to get some carbon tools for cold hands. Thanks! 

Jake woo wrote:

What's the difference between elite climb raptors and morphos? Relative to Nomics, I'm assuming the raptors are a similar shape with similar grip and pick angles? And I assume the morphos are a bit more aggressive closer to ergonomics? Eventually I'd like to get some carbon tools for cold hands. Thanks! 

Go with Morphos. They are superior in every way. The raptor deisgn is old news at this point. The Morphos have recently been designed by a really good climber (JJ) and meticulously tested for ice, mixed, and drytooling. You won't regret them!

Christian Donkey wrote:

Go with Morphos. They are superior in every way. The raptor deisgn is old news at this point. The Morphos have recently been designed by a really good climber (JJ) and meticulously tested for ice, mixed, and drytooling. You won't regret them!

There's green (general) and blue (optimized for ice) Morphos. Verti Call website does a good job of explaining the differences.