Cold temps and Glueins

Just curious,

 The documentation for AC100+ says operational down to 15 F.

As its getting into the ice season, anyone have any actual experience with cold rock and doing anything this time of the year? I figure even a warm day, it still might drop temps into the evening many hours after I am done. Anyone notice any issues with nozzles flowing poorly at that temp?

Should I just wait till spring, or just go do it and see what happens on a nice sunny 25 degree day?

That's the rock temperature, not the air temperature, so some estimating of likely rock temperature is a good idea. Also if bolting when really cold, don't miss this in the AC100+ instructions: "For installations in base material temperatures between 14oF and 23oF (-10oC and -5oC) the cartridge temperature must be conditioned to between 68oF and 95oF (20oC - 35o C)."

Not sure on nozzle flow, but at least the nozzle shouldn't set up fast like in high temps!

I've done a bit of glue-in work for ice climbs with AC100+ in direct sun on a warm spring day, kept the cartridge inside my jacket until I started gluing, and I still wasn't overly pleased with the result. The bolts are strong, but they're messy (harder to clean up super viscous glue with a towel), it felt like I needed a ton of pressure on the handle to push the glue out, and it was generally way more hassle than I wanted. I'd like to experiment with Redhead A7+ or Simpson AT-XP this winter, but both have their own specced limits as well. The A7+ specs a cartridge temp of 32F for a 14F substrate temp, which is way more manageable than 65F, but still a bit limited on substrate temp. The Simpson AT-XP is specced down to a substrate temp of 0F, but also specifies a cartridge temp of at least 65F (https://ssttoolbox.widen.net/view/pdf/py8bliny1w/L-A-ATXP0DEG23.pdf?t.download=true&u=cjmyin).

Of all those options, it does seem like keeping the AT-XP at 65F is the most feasible and allows for the greatest flexibility in installation conditions. I'll probably pack it with some hand warmers inside a puffy jacket until it's time for glue.

The Hilti ICE seems like the even better option for cold weather use, but it's so damn expensive and hard to source.

I put AC 100/200 in a cooler with a hot/warm water bottle to keep the glue warm before use. AC 200 is better in cold temps, also has a quicker cure time. Have also brought a jet boil to re heat the water as well.

Great inputs.

 Thanks folks. I can honestly wait till spring IMO, but good ideas if I get motivated on a warmer sunny day.

Matt Z wrote:

I've done a bit of glue-in work for ice climbs with AC100+ in direct sun on a warm spring day, kept the cartridge inside my jacket until I started gluing, and I still wasn't overly pleased with the result. The bolts are strong, but they're messy (harder to clean up super viscous glue with a towel), it felt like I needed a ton of pressure on the handle to push the glue out, and it was generally way more hassle than I wanted. I'd like to experiment with Redhead A7+ or Simpson AT-XP this winter, but both have their own specced limits as well. The A7+ specs a cartridge temp of 32F for a 14F substrate temp, which is way more manageable than 65F, but still a bit limited on substrate temp. The Simpson AT-XP is specced down to a substrate temp of 0F, but also specifies a cartridge temp of at least 65F (https://ssttoolbox.widen.net/view/pdf/py8bliny1w/L-A-ATXP0DEG23.pdf?t.download=true&u=cjmyin).

Of all those options, it does seem like keeping the AT-XP at 65F is the most feasible and allows for the greatest flexibility in installation conditions. I'll probably pack it with some hand warmers inside a puffy jacket until it's time for glue.

The Hilti ICE seems like the even better option for cold weather use, but it's so damn expensive and hard to source.

I second on the fact that the glue is hard to press out of the tube, but after some research, I found out that caulking guns come with different thrust ratios. I bought a Albion B65 26:1 off Amazon and that issue went away immediately. Not the cheapest gun out there, but in my opinion well worth the money. When buying a caulking gun, make sure the ratio is at least 20:1. 

As for cleaning up the squeezed out glue around the hole, I use tongue depressors/ waxing spatulas. Way less mess and no sticky fingers or epoxy all over my gear (even don't wear any gloves anymore).

Tobias Link wrote:

I second on the fact that the glue is hard to press out of the tube, but after some research, I found out that caulking guns come with different thrust ratios. I bought a Albion B65 26:1 off Amazon and that issue went away immediately. Not the cheapest gun out there, but in my opinion well worth the money. When buying a caulking gun, make sure the ratio is at least 20:1. 

As for cleaning up the squeezed out glue around the hole, I use tongue depressors/ waxing spatulas. Way less mess and no sticky fingers or epoxy all over my gear (even don't wear any gloves anymore).

love my milwaukee glue gun.  that said, be aware that a high thrust ratio can bust your cartridge (usually in the form of leaking on the inside at the plunger) if the contents are highly viscous (more likely in cold temps, ie if not warming the cartridge).