Rope stuck at anchor during rappel

We were rappelling from a flat summit, using a rope threaded through two chains. Both my partner and I have successfully finished the rappel only to discover that the rope cannot be pulled down from either end. First, we thought it got into a crack, but when people at the top had no issue pulling it up at the anchor, we realized that the rope was pinched by the chain links. 

Previously, we were spoiled by rappelling off mossy hooks and rappel rings and rarely used chains. The latter seem tend to pinch the rope especially if an anchor is located on the flat or slabby surface. We were super lucky to have somebody on top to help us and the people on the ground who could radio them. Otherwise, extracting the rope or ascending the rope would be a pickle. Next rappel definitely checking the chain anchor for possible jams. 

The advent of curated rap anchors, assumed to be well-placed and equipped, means that a practice from the bygone days has practically disappeared: having the first person down test whether or not the rappel can be pulled.  This used to be SOP, but now it is common to assume all that shiny hardware must have been installed so as to eliminate any problems.  Indeed, it is becoming increasingly common to install the rap devices of the entire party before anyone raps, making it impossible to test whether the ropes will pull.

Most of the time, the ropes do indeed pull.  Every now and then, someone discovers the utility of testing the pull before everyone is down.

Great answer, however, people also like to line up on rappel lines before starting the rappel, so to make cross checks and avoid possible mistakes, which makes testing impossible. 

I have had to ascend a rope more than once for similar reasons. Still, if most folks are rapping through without issue, it is likely just a matter of using a little extra care when threading the rope through the chains.

Before threading through the last link of each chain, insure each chain has no twist from end to end. This way, the last links are more likely to align to present the largest collective opening for the rope to pass through. Perhaps you did this.

For chains on a horizontal summit,  it can also help to think through how the particular orientations of the end links will play together as the rope is pulled. And shorter chains can be the worst, even to the point of squeezing the rope between the misaligned end links or between a link and the rock. For the latter, reversing direction of pull can help for single rope raps - though you tried this.

And as you and RGold both said, group protocols can prevent the first down doing a test pull. Otherwise, the test pull is a good habit to get into early. I did not. :-/

Another thing to watch for (personal experience, alas) is when there is a significant lip out away from the rappel anchor and you are using two ropes tied together. The rope may start to pull just fine, then as the knot hits the lip you are then unable to pull the ropes any farther. Part of the solution is to use the simple overhand knot as it tends to slide more easily over obstacles. The other thing (which we should have done) is to move the knot away from the actual anchor and put it just past the lip so that the ropes will pull. This may make it a bit more awkward to get on rappel, but better than not having the ropes pull at all. Also, had we (as suggested above) had the first person down check the pull, we would have seen the issue immediately. Ended up ascending the ropes and wasting 30 minutes. One of those lessons learned...

EDIT: I guess this is the Sport Climbing Forum... so not likely to be tying two ropes together for a rappel.

Always a good idea to carry the top rope solo kit jusssst in case. 

In this situation, I'd have had my partner put their belay device on the opposite side of the rope from the one I'm climbing. TRS up the single strand, unfuck the situation, and rap down

rgold wrote:

The advent of curated rap anchors, assumed to be well-placed and equipped, means that a practice from the bygone days has practically disappeared: having the first person down test whether or not the rappel can be pulled.  This used to be SOP, but now it is common to assume all that shiny hardware must have been installed so as to eliminate any problems.  Indeed, it is becoming increasingly common to install the rap devices of the entire party before anyone raps, making it impossible to test whether the ropes will pull.

Most of the time, the ropes do indeed pull.  Every now and then, someone discovers the utility of testing the pull before everyone is down.

Would you mind fleshing this out a little more, if there is more to elaborate on? Would the first person pull a couple armfuls, just to see it runs, and then shout up "all good"? What would the person up top be able to do if the rope didn't run?

Orion Belt wrote:

Would you mind fleshing this out a little more, if there is more to elaborate on? Would the first person pull a couple armfuls, just to see it runs, and then shout up "all good"? What would the person up top be able to do if the rope didn't run?

Yes, the first person down pulls only a little to see that it’s working. If it’s not working the upper person fixes the problem. An example of a fix would be to add slings or cordage to extend the rappel point below the edge of the horizontal lip on top. This would require the upper person to pull the rope all the way up, removing it from the original anchor, fixing up the anchor, then resetting the rope through the new anchor. The lower person could then perform another test pull if you can get the ends of the rope to the bottom for them to reach. 

Other folks have pointed out some good practices. I also often pre-rig my raps, but there's benefits from doing test pulls as well. Be mindful not to get trapped in the mentality that there's only one way to do something.

Another thing to consider is if you're using an appropriate anchor. Other user groups besides climbers use bolts, too. You mention a flat summit. I wonder if you were using a highlining anchor that was never meant to be rappelled from or perhaps an anchor meant only for rigging a TR using a static line.

Finally, you should lower from mussy hooks; that's what they're for.

Ivanchenko Vladimir wrote:

Otherwise, extracting the rope or ascending the rope would be a pickle.

Ascending the rope should not be “a pickle”.  As Chris S. Says, one partner fixes rope, other one ascends. Knowing how to ascend a rope is an essential skill. 

Daniel Joder wrote:

Another thing to watch for (personal experience, alas) is when there is a significant lip out away from the rappel anchor and you are using two ropes tied together. The rope may start to pull just fine, then as the knot hits the lip you are then unable to pull the ropes any farther. Part of the solution is to use the simple overhand knot as it tends to slide more easily over obstacles. The other thing (which we should have done) is to move the knot away from the actual anchor and put it just past the lip so that the ropes will pull. This may make it a bit more awkward to get on rappel, but better than not having the ropes pull at all. Also, had we (as suggested above) had the first person down check the pull, we would have seen the issue immediately. Ended up ascending the ropes and wasting 30 minutes. One of those lessons learned...

EDIT: I guess this is the Sport Climbing Forum... so not likely to be tying two ropes together for a rappel.

The last person can rap over the lip and then move the knot over the lip while still on rappel.   BITD I published an article in Climbing on how to do this.  

As Rgold says, the current generation of "climbers" have a very narrow set of skills.

Lots of great advice here. Another tactic that I’ve used on stuck ropes or poorly placed rappel anchors is to move as far away from the cliff base as possible while pulling the rope. This helps to lessen the friction against the cliff face or ledges. 

Ivanchenko Vladimir wrote:

Great answer, however, people also like to line up on rappel lines before starting the rappel, so to make cross checks and avoid possible mistakes, which makes testing impossible. 

I've been puzzling over this statement. I'm not sure of what you mean by 'people like to line up on rappel lines before...'. If you mean that people are waiting in line for their turn turn to rap, that still shouldn't prevent the first person down from giving a test pull before the next in line starts. What is necessary is that everyone be aware of what the plan is, and that a communication protocol on how to proceed is agreed upon before the first person rappels. Even if the rope pulls after the first person is down, it is still possible that a subsequent 'descender' could do something that creates a problem, so this requires that everyone in the group maintain good situational awareness and be prepared to do follow-up test pulls if a potential problem arises.

If you are saying, as I believe that you are, that all the members of the party are actually getting themselves attached to the rap rope before the first person starts down---that is a system that I have not observed occurring, except maybe in certain guided situations. While, as a previous poster mentioned, it is wrong to be too rigid about such things, I don't think this should be a routine approach for a number of reasons--though maybe appropriate in ideal circumstances if there are only two members of the party and the second one down is very inexperienced.

Another situation where the rope can get stuck, even after a successful test pull, is when the end of the rope wraps tight around the anchor while it is being pulled down. I have seen this happen twice. It is most likely to happen when using thin ropes ( common these days) and the person pulling the rope gives it a sharp tug at the end of the pull down ( something again quite common). If this tug happens a bit too early it will cause the remaining rope to whip around and potentially wrap itself tight around the anchors. To prevent this, it is best to maintain a steady pull throughout the process.

The other easy solution - just leave two of your old biners, gates opposed, and rap off those.  I've done that at critical raps where the chains had unusually small links.  Most people following you won't steal the biners, since it saves them from having to feed the rope, and they will get used over and over.

Alan Rubin wrote:

I've been puzzling over this statement. I'm not sure of what you mean by 'people like to line up on rappel lines before...'. If you mean that people are waiting in line for their turn turn to rap, that still shouldn't prevent the first person down from giving a test pull before the next in line starts. What is necessary is that everyone be aware of what the plan is, and that a communication protocol on how to proceed is agreed upon before the first person rappels. Even if the rope pulls after the first person is down, it is still possible that a subsequent 'descender' could do something that creates a problem, so this requires that everyone in the group maintain good situational awareness and be prepared to do follow-up test pulls if a potential problem arises.

If you are saying, as I believe that you are, that all the members of the party are actually getting themselves attached to the rap rope before the first person starts down---that is a system that I have not observed occurring, except maybe in certain guided situations. While, as a previous poster mentioned, it is wrong to be too rigid about such things, I don't think this should be a routine approach for a number of reasons--though maybe appropriate in ideal circumstances if there are only two members of the party and the second one down is very inexperienced.

Another situation where the rope can get stuck, even after a successful test pull, is when the end of the rope wraps tight around the anchor while it is being pulled down. I have seen this happen twice. It is most likely to happen when using thin ropes ( common these days) and the person pulling the rope gives it a sharp tug at the end of the pull down ( something again quite common). If this tug happens a bit too early it will cause the remaining rope to whip around and potentially wrap itself tight around the anchors. To prevent this, it is best to maintain a steady pull throughout the process.

I agree with all this but want to add that the practice of "stacking" (on the rap ropes all the remaining people after the first) is becoming increasingly popular.  Sort of goes hand in hand with using an extended (off the belay loop) rap setup, autoblock backups and possibly a fireman's belay with all the subsequent rappers.  Yes it makes the most sense with inexperienced people but the idea of buddy checking everything - even with equally experienced people is gaining popularity.  I doubt any of those techniques were common - or even a "thing" back in Rgold's or Alan's day.  Sorry for the thread drift but I'm curious how many old timers have adopted and/all of these practices - Alan?

Lots of things you can do wrong, lots you can do right (many of which discussed in this thread). But even when you do everything right (which you should for the most part) you’re only decreasing the odds of a stuck rope, not eliminating them:

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/111508445/what-snagged-your-rap-ropes

In addition to many things mentioned already, I like to carry a micro/nano traxion (could also be a prussik loop) to help persuade stuck ropes down. You can use it for progress capture to really build tension on the rope, and/or for getting your entire body weight on it.

Also it occasionally can help if your partner pulls hard on the non-pull strand and releases it quickly, timed with you pulling hard on the pull strand. The non-pull strand can “spring” up, releasing some weight/friction, which might be enough to help you through the jam. Flicking the non-pull strand out can also achieve a similar effect. 

OP where was this? And why rap off of mussy hooks in the past, they are specifically installed so that you can lower off. 

I haven't had to rap on a sport route in years other than new routes where it was still being developed or multipitch climbs where it is typical to rap.

Eric Engberg wrote:

I agree with all this but want to add that the practice of "stacking" (on the rap ropes all the remaining people after the first) is becoming increasingly popular.  Sort of goes hand in hand with using an extended (off the belay loop) rap setup, autoblock backups and possibly a fireman's belay with all the subsequent rappers.  Yes it makes the most sense with inexperienced people but the idea of buddy checking everything - even with equally experienced people is gaining popularity.  I doubt any of those techniques were common - or even a "thing" back in Rgold's or Alan's day.  Sorry for the thread drift but I'm curious how many old timers have adopted and/all of these practices - Alan?

First things first, Eric---"... back in  Rgold's or Alan's day"---and when, differently, was 'your day'/-you ain't that much younger, as much as you wish it to be otherwise.

But, to answer your question--none of them, except some ( occasional--should do them more frequently) 'buddy checks', for me---and the very occasional, circumstance-dependent 'fireman's'. I very much prefer simplicity, especially involving such inherently problematic situations as rappelling, and most of the techniques you mentioned add normally unnecessary complications that could actually increase the risk ( too much clutter and too many items of equipment to worry about and potentially distract--and possibly block being able to see a problem at the anchor). Sure, there can be specific circumstances when such systems are reasonable to utilize, but not as a matter of routine.

The 'stacking' on rappel ropes that  you mentioned, and that, I presume, OP also referenced, is one approach, that I do find to be troubling. I see a number of problems with that method. It exponentially increases the 'clutter' , confusion, and distraction at the rap point, probably slows things down more than being more efficient, seems very hard to set-up in all but the most ideal rappel situations ( for instance, where the anchor point is below the the stance level), prevents test pulls as mentioned in the OP, and also hinders any rope adjustments that the first one down may need to do while descending--a very common scenario. Just doesn't seem worth it and unnecessary, unless all the others are very inexperienced rappellers. And, if the latter is the situation, except with guides, the party probably shouldn't be in that situation in the first place---if at all possible, folks should practice rappelling in controlled circumstances prior to launching out on such climbs---similar to the discussion on another thread about not having novices be responsible for cleaning sport anchors.

Alan Rubin wrote:

First things first, Eric---"... back in  Rgold's or Alan's day"---and when, differently, was 'your day'/-you ain't that much younger, as much as you wish it to be otherwise.

But, to answer your question--none of them, except some ( occasional--should do them more frequently) 'buddy checks', for me---and the very occasional, circumstance-dependent 'fireman's'. I very much prefer simplicity, especially involving such inherently problematic situations as rappelling, and most of the techniques you mentioned add normally unnecessary complications that could actually increase the risk ( too much clutter and too many items of equipment to worry about and potentially distract--and possibly block being able to see a problem at the anchor). Sure, there can be specific circumstances when such systems are reasonable to utilize, but not as a matter of routine.

The 'stacking' on rappel ropes that  you mentioned, and that, I presume, OP also referenced, is one approach, that I do find to be troubling. I see a number of problems with that method. It exponentially increases the 'clutter' , confusion, and distraction at the rap point, probably slows things down more than being more efficient, seems very hard to set-up in all but the most ideal rappel situations ( for instance, where the anchor point is below the the stance level), prevents test pulls as mentioned in the OP, and also hinders any rope adjustments that the first one down may need to do while descending--a very common scenario. Just doesn't seem worth it and unnecessary, unless all the others are very inexperienced rappellers. And, if the latter is the situation, except with guides, the party probably shouldn't be in that situation in the first place---if at all possible, folks should practice rappelling in controlled circumstances prior to launching out on such climbs---similar to the discussion on another thread about not having novices be responsible for cleaning sport anchors.

I always assume I am much younger - based on looks alone :-).  But seeing as we both predate the Stitch plate I suppose it is of little concern.

Oh and knotting the ends - that is one I am actually am likely to do if I am more then 1 pitch up or don't have a clear view or good communication with the ground.  But all the other "best practices" I admit I am usually negligent with.  Will use an autoblock if the friction is iffy - skinny or wet ropes.  Will extend if I am wearing bulky clothing or trying to take down a big pack or something that hangs straight off the device (ride the pig).  Would be very reluctant to stack subsequent rappers before I launch.  If they were very nervous or inexperienced I would tend more towards trying to lower them.  All these things do add time and complexity so there is always a tradeoff - but I'll admit that if they are your standard practice the added "cost" will be insignificant.  

Pre-rigging rappels seems to be generally considered safer than not doing it. (And it seems to be the AMGA and IFMGA standard at this point..?)  My wife and I do a ton of rappels with this method (spending 2mo in EPC this year will do that), and I can certainly say it is extremely efficient and clean to set up.  We easily rig and buddy-check in a matter of about 30 seconds.  If the method is new to a climbing team, sure, it may feel as cumbersome as any other new thing, but it certainly is not slow, cluttered, or distracting when the team is used to it.  

Specifically regarding stuck ropes, pre-rigging with ATCs allows rappellers to safely only use 1 end knot.  I've personally had a lot more end knots get stuck in stuff than I have had pulling issues that could have been resolved by pull testing.  

Here's a great article:
https://www.alpinesavvy.com/blog/the-benefits-of-the-pre-rigged-rappel
It does outline the potential downsides of pre-rigging too.  However, none of those are serious safety risks. 

Also, it is not like one must choose to either always pre-rig and never pull test, or never pre-rig and always pull test.  If there is obviously a dubious rappel that looks like it will cause a rope jam, one can always choose to do the pull test instead of the pre-rig.  

For the OP's situation, it's a good reminder to be super precise in how the rope is threaded through the anchor and how the chains are oriented, along with direction of pull.  Unless you were on something fairly obscure, it is unlikely that most parties are getting their ropes stuck on that specific anchor, so it was probably some sort of orientation issue.  In the event that I am 100% certain that friction is my only issue and the rope won't budge, I'll rig a klemhesit with my 3rd hand to the rope and use my bodyweight to pull.  (Again, I'll only do that if I am 100% certain that the only issue is friction.) 

I was pre-rigging rappels in the '60's when climbing with my (then) wife and we had to do multiple raps.  We didn't have today's gadgets; I think we were using carabiner brakes, which can be set up in suboptimal ways.  I had to go first to get everything ready at the next station, and she wasn't really experienced enough to be up there by herself rigging a rappel with all those carabiners.  I should add that in those days I don't think anyone was using tethers---they certainly weren't a regular thing.  When you unroped to rappel, you were usually just standing around on the ledge.  So I got her all set up to rappel, tied an overhand in both ropes a bit below her, clipped that overhand to the anchor, and rapped first.  She would be secured while I was rappelling.  When her turn came, she'd undo the overhand and rap.  There was always a chance of forgetting to take the carabiner on the anchor, but that never happened to us.

Sixty years later, this method has been "rediscovered" and trumpeted as an innovative tech tip for modern pre-rigged rappels when the second has to stand off to the side of the anchor and so can't be subjected to the rappel load.  What's old is new.

My sense is that the pre-rigged rappel is now pretty common, and I use them if I happen to be with relatively inexperienced climbers (and I'm confident we can retrieve the ropes).  With experienced friends, just about never, but there is a case to be made for better safety (more eyes on the rigged devices, especially if it is dark and stormy, support of others and all their gear if a device is dropped while being threaded) and (slightly) increased speed (everyone rigs simultaneously and only the first person to rap has to struggle with rope weight while threading their device).  I'm pretty sure pre-rigging is SOP for guides, as it should be, and  I think pre-rigging may also be good for the mental health of the first person down.  Have you ever been that person and then waited for what seemed like an eternity for your partner to set up and start descending? Amirite?  At least with pre-rigging you are all together and can see what's happening.

The issue remains of testing the pull and having the person still at the anchor watch what happens and possibly make adjustments.  If the anchor is on a vertical wall above a small ledge, there shouldn't be a problem.  If the ledge is big with the anchor far back from the lip, or if the anchor is on a horizontal surface and the rope has to bend over a lip, then testing the pull is more advisable.  If two ropes are being used and the knot has to be dragged over a lip, then the nowadays pretty standard EDK is called-for and the last person down should drag the knot down over the lip when they descend. (Warning: this makes the rope ends uneven; better be certain there's enough rope!). The simplest way to drag a knot is to grab those nice long tails left after the knot, feed them through the biner holding the device, and grip them while paying out rope to rappel.

A note for pre-riggers: each climber should be attached to the anchor with a tether as well. This probably won't matter most of the time, but there will be times when the stance is narrow or just footholds when the climber(s) waiting to rap are fully or partially hanging on the rappel lines. What's keeping them in place is the fireman's belay effect of the current rappeller's weight. When the rap lines are unweighted, anyone hanging on them will start to zip down if they aren't independently tethered. This is unlikely to add to the day's fun.