Max weight hangs vs grade climbed

I’m curious what is the average here, or what defines strong vs weak fingers for the grade climbed. So what’s the most weight you’ve hung on a 20mm edge vs your outside grade sport and boulder? 

Mine is 65lbs at 165lbs and outdoor grade of 13c and v9/10

jessie briggs wrote:

I’m curious what is the average here, or what defines strong vs weak fingers for the grade climbed. So what’s the most weight you’ve hung on a 20mm edge vs your outside grade sport and boulder? 

Mine is 65lbs at 165lbs and outdoor grade of 13c and v9/10

If you are curious, you would get a better picture looking at Power Company or Lattice charts, based on their assessments of multiple climbers, instead of a dozen random responses here.

For example:Power Company blog--scroll down for charts

I know I have seen Lattice charts somewhere on Instagram maybe, too lazy to search, but they are not very different from the charts in the link above. 

My max hang (7s, 20mm edge, half crimp) is 32 lbs @ 135lbs, max outdoor grade 5.12c, V7. Lattice and the like (e.g. this online finger strength calculator) always claim that my fingers are very weak for the grades I climb. According to my Lattice results (screenshot here) I'm one standard deviation in finger strength below the average of people climbing my grades, and hanging 60lbs would put me at average, which seems like ridiculously much. If I could hang 60lbs I'd probably be sending 13s. I would actually say crimpy climbs are my strength, and I wouldn't describe myself as having particularly good technique, so who knows. 

Personally I think the Lattice data is just skewed by hangboard fanatics who don't actually climb very much.

The Lattice data is probably the "best" you'll find, but is skewed by people who are good at training and bad at climbing. My results were pretty similar to Prav's. They think V6 climber should only climb 12-, which is just another reason to be skeptical.

But I can also see why. I took the lattice assessment at the end of spring season in 2021, when I had a rare opportunity to work remotely and live at the Red for the season. Which means that I hadn’t bouldered or touched a hangboard for couple months, and rarely needed to pull on anything as small as 20mm. Of course my max strength sucked, and was probably the lowest it ever gets to be, in the course of the year, while my power endurance/climbing fitness was great, probably at/near its peak!

OR have fun trying to climb harder and your body will adapt. These numbers are only a correlation, not a prediction. 

These companies test large amounts of people who have already sent these grades, then roast you that your fingers need to be X to send Y, sell you a cookie cutter max hang program to get X fingers, then when you don't send Y this season, sell you another premium coaching package to tell you that you "wow you're already strong enough to do this, you just need to climb more, footwork, better tactics, yada yada"

but for comparison I can hang 120% BW one armed on a 8mm. Working on getting my first V5 on a Hueco trip August 2024 that I have really high hopes for and will in no way be a let down.

Brian Hagerty wrote:

Comparison is the thief of joy.

Usually attributed to T.R. 

It is also significant hindrance to progress in many endeavors, aside from training. 

I was just curious as I don’t really train and only climb pretty much. I find any structured training to be boring, and mostly just enjoy moonboarding for indoor climbing. Sometimes I feel like I’m either heavy, or have weak fingers for the grades I can climb, so I was wondering where others lie in the spectrum to see if I should actually hang on a board every now and again. I don’t think climbing in the red really helps all that much with finger strength. 

I'd agree with others that the power company climbing and lattice data are way off as predictors of redpoint ability via strength metrics.  There was recently a good article along those lines: https://www.climbing.com/skills/what-metrics-really-matter-for-climbing/  

Who knows, but my money is that their data set is mostly made up of their clients.  People who hire coaches for strength training are probably more likely to be stronger than they are savvy (technique, tactics, grit, etc) for various reasons and therefor using their metrics, you need to be way stronger than actual reality would suggest. (I've got pretty much identical metrics to the OP and I'm pretty sure Lattice and Power Company both say I should be sending somewhere in the 5.12 range)  I'd agree to that geography plays a huge role too because certain types of strength are more or less relevant depending on the area we're talking about.

My thought on these type of metrics is they are pointless  There are calisthenics athletes out there who can do handstands on one finger, pull-ups with 300+ lbs on them etc but that does not mean they are strong rock climbers simply due to those metrics.  I’ve climbed with people who can’t even hang on a campus rung at body weight but can go outdoors and climb a 5.12 easily.

Also +65 @ 165 for 7s 20mm

13b max, most 12cs/ds are sendable within a day. Some are not…

I consider myself pretty weak compared to the people I climb with.

Currently @180lb +55-60lbs maxhang on 15mm (I think? the smallest 4f crimps on Metolius Simulator), was up to +75lb when I was hangboarding a lot last winter.

However, my max redpoint was 12c and it was quite hard for me (last summer). This seems in line with Power Company charts, but I do get an impression that it's more than typical and I need to learn to climb...

I've done 120% on a Lattice 20mm edge but can barely do bodyweight on Beastmaker 1000 lower outside edge (18/19mm but "equivalent" according to lattice).

V5 (pretty solid, five outdoor ticks and outdoor V4 flash) and 12a (one pillow soft route)

Currently trying to progress past the "I did one pillow soft 12a" to a more well rounded mid grade sport climber.

Adam W wrote:

My thought on these type of metrics is they are pointless  There are calisthenics athletes out there who can do handstands on one finger, pull-ups with 300+ lbs on them etc but that does not mean they are strong rock climbers simply due to those metrics.  I’ve climbed with people who can’t even hang on a campus rung at body weight but can go outdoors and climb a 5.12 easily.

Agree. There’s also ridiculous measurement error in the bigger datasets — grip position, hang duration, what constitutes failure, etc. I just don’t think they’re at all useful. Better to assess based on what you actually struggle with in terms of moves / grips / routes. The comparison to others adds basically nothing to that.

Dunno. Its worth something.

15 years ago (although Australia is a bit behind) my mentor (the best climber in our group) barely dragged his ass up a 12a and it was a culminating acheivement. We used to "just climb" then go to the pub and drink LOTS of beer and eat chips.

Bouldering was a tiny scene, a few people had those ugly Metolius resin hangboards to do a few pullups on, but the idea of adding weight was unheard of.

Now, my old kayaking buddy (who I took up his first easy multipitch) climbs 5.13 and is COMPLETELY ripped like a bodybuilder, and crazy mythical routes I had only heard of getting one or two ascents, are getting onsighted on people's rest days.

Like at the crag last weekend this guy (who seemed a fairly solid 5.13 climber) tweaked his shoulder a bit so did a classic five pitch testpiece 11d as a rest day.

It's effing crazy how well everyone is climbing. Really, I'm jealous. All this stuff is clearly working.

I’m 165 lbs and I’ve hung 110lbs on 20 mm edge for 7 s’ on a tension board. Best RP is 13- and V9 Boulder. I can’t say I have any new perspective on the OP. All this info brings up more questions than answers for me. According to power co. And Lattice my finger strength is well over qualified for the grades. I also route set full time for work so training is a challenge to balance with work, climbing and performance. I’m sure if I changed jobs my grades would significantly increase. I have a lot of outdoor climbing experience so I don’t think my “gym climbing” time is a limiting factor. I’m curious if anyone else falls into this camp as well.

At the end of the day climbing is a skill based sport before strength and power.

Adam W wrote:

My thought on these type of metrics is they are pointless  There are calisthenics athletes out there who can do handstands on one finger, pull-ups with 300+ lbs on them etc but that does not mean they are strong rock climbers simply due to those metrics.  I’ve climbed with people who can’t even hang on a campus rung at body weight but can go outdoors and climb a 5.12 easily.

The idea is that if you find out your fingers are really strong compared to other people who climb similar grades, then don't put your time and energy into improving finger strength because there is probably lower hanging fruit. Conversely, if they're quite weak then you should spend more time hangboarding. That seems pretty pointful to me.

I weigh 160 and have hung 40# for 7 seconds, that was on an approximately 20mm section of the Rock Prodigy hangboard edge. I've climbed V6 and 12c.

Adam W wrote:

My thought on these type of metrics is they are pointless  There are calisthenics athletes out there who can do handstands on one finger, pull-ups with 300+ lbs on them etc but that does not mean they are strong rock climbers simply due to those metrics.  I’ve climbed with people who can’t even hang on a campus rung at body weight but can go outdoors and climb a 5.12 easily.

I don’t think they are entirely pointless. They just measure one aspect out of many that are required to climb the grade.

I do think these metrics are overused, because they are more easily quantifiable than nebulous aspects, such as “good technique”, or “strong mental game”.

The way I see it, if don’t one scores really high on hanging, it’s not something they need to work on.

Lena chita wrote:

The way I see it, if don’t one scores really high on hanging, it’s not something they need to work on.

This isn’t entirely true, though. You can score very well on a 20mm edge test and still struggle to crimp small holds, for example. The converse is also true—some people score poorly but climb well on small holds and aren’t hindered by the apparent “weakness”. It also doesn’t follow that you’d necessarily be better off training that crimp weakness on a hangboard versus mileage on progressively harder crimp boulder problems.

I need to climb where the OP climbs   

To answer the OP’s questions. I’m at 135-140 lbs and can hang +125 lbs for 5 seconds on the 20mm. Outdoor grades = V9/10 and 5.13a/b. 

Not Not MP Admin wrote:

I need to climb where the OP climbs   

To answer the OP’s questions. I’m at 135-140 lbs and can hang +125 lbs for 5 seconds on the 20mm. Outdoor grades = V9/10 and 5.13a/b. 

Wow is that some sort of slight? I’ve climbed my hardest boulders in Joshua tree, climbed 5.13 on granite, schist, KY sandstone, new river and chatt sandstone. But yeah, lately I’ve climbed a lot in the red, maybe it’s soft and I’m fat. Thanks brah