RV vs VAN vs TRUCK?

Hi!

I'm looking for suggestions for a vehicle to use as a climbing crash pad. I'm looking for a set up that makes the most logistical sense, without trading off too much comfort. I will need to cook meals and be living in the thing for probably up to a month at a time max. Mostly using around Red Rocks, Indian Creek, Yosemite. 

Love the idea of an RV, but im assuming that is a pain? Definitely places to park overnight, but to actually get to the crag from RV parking?

Truck with camper?

Trailer?

I know a lot of you have experience in this area, and I would be grateful if you would share any suggestions. Thanks!

Highly highly recommend class B RVs like the Roadtrek. You will spend far less money and get far more amenities than any self converted van. Mine which I bought for $9k and was 19' long and basically looked like a van had a water heater, running water, a toilet, a shower, propane stovetop and fridge, and a freaking FURNACE. 

Ideally I would spend more than that as mine needed some TLC, but $15k and up would get you a sweet great condition Roadtrek. They are decidedly less stealthy but unless you're spending much time in urban areas this isn't a significant concern, and I managed working full time in the SF Bay Area in mine and street parking just fine. 

Access to crags would be similar to any other van.

I thought about this prior to pulling the trigger on a van as well, here are my thoughts. I am certain you will find something that works well for you!  

RV
Pros: (never actually realistically considered this, but probably the most livable option)
Cons: Parking at home is impossible for me. Parking in crags looks annoying at best, and impossible at worst.

Trailer
Pros: Probably the most affordable, all things considered, and there are some kinda cool builds available. You can literally buy one at a dealer and drive off the lot with a full build in the same day. Similarly, you can leave it behind when it's unneeded and drive around with your vehicle as you normally would.
Cons: Storing this at home is challenging for my parking situation personally, but may not be the case for all.  Usually a bit smaller.  You have to get out of the car to get into the living area.  Driving and parking with a trailer is annoying.

Truck + Camper
Pros: Lots of interesting options for prebuilt units. There are a lot of good trucks that can manage their way through a variety of terrains. Cost saving option if you already own a truck.
Cons:  Units you can stand up in tend to be TALL.  The cockpit is not connected to the living area, which means if it's raining, you need to pop in and out.  It also just has a tendency to feel more cramped because of that.  The nicer prebuilt units along with buying a good truck can be kinda pricey.

Van
Pros: Large living interiors with standing heights. Lots of DIY kit options and amazing builders if you go with one of the more common vans. The cockpit is part of the interior of the living area, making for a large living area for the length of the vehicle.
Cons: Will not manage rough terrain as well as a good truck unless there are massive upgrades done. Overall van and build can be kinda pricey.

Looking at the vans, I really considered 2 specific models (both 2022):

Mercedes Sprinter
Pros: Greater length of interior overall. Huge huge huge community with absolutely tons of DIY kits, upgrades, builders, etc. This van drives really nicely, very similar to my SUVs that are far smaller. Really nice build quality and finish. Lots of technology (adaptive cruise control, etc) makes for a very comfortable ride/drive. 4WD models exist. I personally think this van looks cool.
Cons: RWD comes with its nuances, and 4WD models is hard to locate/order. Narrower width overall, requires installing flares to place bed width wise. More expensive overall.  Less available inventory. 

RAM Promaster
Pros: Greater width of interior overall, enough for many to place a bed width wise.
Cons: This van feels, looks, and drives more like a commercial vehicle. The community seems to lean fairly heavily towards full DIY builds, with less kit and builder support.

I ended up going with a Mercedes Sprinter and can't be happier with the choice!  Good luck!

Ricky Harline wrote:

Highly highly recommend class B RVs like the Roadtrek. You will spend far less money and get far more amenities than any self converted van. Mine which I bought for $9k and was 19' long and basically looked like a van had a water heater, running water, a toilet, a shower, propane stovetop and fridge, and a freaking FURNACE. 

Ideally I would spend more than that as mine needed some TLC, but $15k and up would get you a sweet great condition Roadtrek. They are decidedly less stealthy but unless you're spending much time in urban areas this isn't a significant concern, and I managed working full time in the SF Bay Area in mine and street parking just fine. 

Access to crags would be similar to any other van.

As a former Roadtrek owner, I can't like this post enough. I highly recommend them. The price spiked during the pandemic, not sure if the prices are back to normal now. I got one for $20k, which was on the lower end for cost. 

If you are serious about climbing, you will need the independence of a truck, from the Stronghold to the the Canadian Rockies.  If more of a tourist climber, i.e. Indian Creek and Squamish, then a van or rv will do everything you need.  A truck and trailer is much cheaper than a van.  Small 3000lb trailers can be bought for less than $20K easily despite inflation and are easy to repair and maintain.  A Toyota Tacoma or any small pickup or suv pulls them and also servers as your everyday vehicle whether climbing or not.  A Van that will run consistently (diesel probably) and has the systems that a 20' trailer has is quite expensive and attracts more intelligent thieves making accurate assumptions.  Good luck with your choice.

With all things, there are caveats, but here is my 2 cents as a truck/trailer owner.Truck and trailer combo gives you the most versatility, in my opinion, but really its all mission dependent. Trailers are generally more comfortable than vans and have better appliances/amenities. With a topper on your truck you can pretty easily (and cheaply) build out a comfortable shelter and will still be able to get to places most vans/rvs are incapable of. All that said, I've been envious more than once of van-dwellers at a trailhead/parking lot/pull out who were basically "home" whereas I was looking at a drive back to camp.

I cant imagine really getting after it in an RV unless you tow a second vehicle. Trailers are CHEAP. You can find used pop-ups for under 5k that are comfortably towable with a Subaru or light duty pickup. 

This conversation has been going on a long time and the vans won - by a large margin.  It’s not for everyone in every situation, but it’s definitely what the most number of climbers have done.

There is no winner or loser here - it's all about use-cases and matching the tools to the job requirements. The farther off-pavement you want to go the more you will be leaning toward a 4wd truck, imo, despite any comfort compromises. The closer to pavement you trend, the more cush you can go.

I dunno if the vans won. I think climbers took the advice of the social media algorithm rather than thinking for themselves. IMO unless you're living in it truly full time, a built out van is a waste of time and resources. It's a giant vehicle that's a pain to drive, acts like a sail in the wind, and you really can't do much with. Need passengers? Hope they're okay just sitting on the bed in the back.

A truck with camper is the way to go. With a lightweight low profile pop up camper, the footprint is the exact same as the truck, you get the headroom to stand up inside once you set up, and the whole thing doesn't act like a sail. Plus, when you're at home and you need a truck to do normal truck things, you just take the camper off. Haul firewood, haul a couch, sit on the tailgate, you're good to go. And 4wd comes standard, unlike a van where it costs an arm and a leg and breaks all the time. Also you can bring a truck to literally any mechanic in the country and they'll work on it, unlike many vans that are either overly complicated or have proprietary parts.

Dow Williams wrote:

If you are serious about climbing, you will need the independence of a truck, from the Stronghold to the the Canadian Rockies.  If more of a tourist climber, i.e. Indian Creek and Squamish, then a van or rv will do everything you need.  

This gave me a good chuckle. +5

Ricky Harline wrote:

Highly highly recommend class B RVs like the Roadtrek. You will spend far less money and get far more amenities than any self converted van. Mine which I bought for $9k and was 19' long and basically looked like a van had a water heater, running water, a toilet, a shower, propane stovetop and fridge, and a freaking FURNACE. 

 How is this $9k possible?

According to https://roadtrek.com/:
"2023 Zion Slumber ... MSRP STARTING AT $178,010 USD"

Thanks everyone for your input! 

My first couple years of dirtbag climbing in the early 90’s, my girlfriend and I lived out of a Chevy Chevette with a rocket box on top. Slept in a cheap tent, cooked with a 2-burner Coleman on the picnic table, showered occasionally, and climbed a ton. After that I had a mini-van so I wouldn’t have to sleep in a tent, one of those boxy little Toyota rigs. Now, I have what I’d consider ideal; a Nissan NV200, which is their small utility cargo van. Painted white, no stickers, nothing to suggest a climber is living in there.

IMHO, it’s nice to have a rig small enough to park in a ramp or normal sized parking space. Cooking and eating outside has never been a problem for me, and having a shower or toilet seems like unnecessary posh.
I guess I’m still maybe nostalgic for what real dirtbagging is all about. More than just a hashtag…

Dow touched on it above, but consider what you'd rather break into:

A shiny Sphincter, doubtlessly containing a MacBook and maybe a rack of ultralights, and probably owned by some rich kid or...

A beat-up, monkey-s#$t-brown, full-sized truck with camper windows obscured by cardboard, probably containing a greasy toolbag, a half quart of 10/40, and maybe some extra rounds for whatever gun the owner is packing.

I'm not saying these stereotypes always hold true, but thieves make calculated decisions. Moreover, I grew up with some, and many have a perverse Robin Hood ethic about their trade.

And if you're considering Yosemite or the like, consider that the Sierras are full of overgrown bears capable of snapping door hinges. Best not to have a kitchen in your ride in that range.

Me? I built a platform that allows me to sleep spread-eagle in my Fit, and have a blast passing bougie vans on gravel. If clearance is an issue, I pack a tent in my truck.

A V wrote:

A whole lot less of getting stuck way out in the boonies as well... that being said if you find that all of the areas you visit are paved (i.e. you only climb rock at well established mellow areas) then the van wins for your use case. 

I think this is what drives the perception.

Also, vans are just so much better for weekend-warriors going to easy-access crags that they dwarf the population of everything else.

 Finding a method to store a trailer, let alone the learning curve of parking it (little trailers are way more squirrelly than big ones), plus owning a vehicle that can tow it means a trailer is just too much for a lot of folks who aren't about that life already. Small RVs are pretty hard to find, and have (in my opinion) worse handling characteristics than your average van.

So that leaves truck-bed campers and vans. There's no question the truck is better off road (although I did drive Titus canyon in death valley in my sprinter once. Won't do that again...). But the truck is quite a bit worse in town, to say nothing of storing the camper when you don't need it.

I'd say, if you have to be in civilization for a significant amount of time and your ambitions keep you in easy dirt roads, without mud or snow, get the van. Otherwise get the truck.

I'm with Logan. My Honda Fit serves me well, and it's pretty amazing how well it does on dirt roads because it's so small.

Yury wrote:

 How is this $9k possible?

According to https://roadtrek.com/:
"2023 Zion Slumber ... MSRP STARTING AT $178,010 USD"

It's all about finding some used gems. Some postings are too good to be true, and the $9k Roadtreks are usually quite old, but $15-20k can go a long way. Example:

https://miami.craigslist.org/pbc/rvs/d/west-palm-beach-roadtrek-200-tv-class/7553619931.html

I owned a 28 foot RV for 16 years.  I towed 3 different manual transmission Subarus behind it over that time frame.  I loved it.  It's great for longer trips, extremely comfortable.  Really it's like having a wonderful little apartment with you.  But I doubt that is the right choice for you at this part of your life.  Because it is a road vehicle, it is heavy and needs all the maintenance you do for a truck (I had an E350 Econoline engine, it was very reliable but it is an extra). You need a place to store it when you are not using it.  The mileage is pretty awful (usually about 8-10 mpg unless you get a mercedes diesel).  You can't easily make u-turns or back up with that tow system.  You want a vehicle you can flat tow and they are getting harder and harder to find.  And because of the size, you are more limited about where you can camp.  

Just this year, because of my age and the fact that I do a lot of solo trips, I decided that I was at the end of my days for driving 45' length of vehicle around.  I bought a new class B van, 21 feet, preoutfitted (another Winnebago). Ram chassis, not very high clearance. I've used it for about 40 days of climbing road trips so far since May, and I can say it's much more like camping than having a comfy apartment.  I mean it's fine but I wouldn't want to spend a month in it. I am admittedly spoiled.  When I had a climbing partner with me for a couple of trips, it was actively annoying.  Two people moving around in that space making meals and eating them was one too many.  (Whereas in my class C I used to very comfortably have dinner parties for 4 and movie nights.)  The disadvantage of this type of rig for you has to do with off road access to climbing areas.  Even if you get a high clearance 4 WD van, I'd be leery of taking that into places like Clark Canyon or Black Velvet Canyon.

I've had a number of friends over the years who have used the combo of 4WD high clearance truck towing a trailer.  That might be the best for you, since it has a significant comfort advantage over the class B.  Trailers are much cheaper than Class Bs or Cs.  Since they are not motor vehicles, and not meant for occupation when in motion, they can be built much lighter.  The length of trailer you get will depend on your preference.  If you want comfort for a month long trip, I wouldn't go as small as a teardrop.  You still need a place to park in when it's not in use but the insurance and upkeep cost is much less.

I always advise people making this first decision to go to a big RV show and walk around and visit every type of combo.  They will all be there in one place.  Even if you have no intention of buying new, it's a good place to start.

Yury wrote:

 How is this $9k possible?

According to https://roadtrek.com/:
"2023 Zion Slumber ... MSRP STARTING AT $178,010 USD"

You get an old one. Late 90s models with 50k-100k miles are routinely priced around $10k and sometimes a bit under. Mine needed a little TLC but was pretty sound in all the important ways. I see them around that price point quite frequently.

There's one for $12,500 right now in the bay area. 

https://www.journeysoffroad.com/toyota-sienna.html

Cory B wrote:

This gave me a good chuckle. +5

That's funny, it gave me a migraine and made me barf on my shoes.