Cilogear 45l worksack or Cold Cold World Chernobyl

Hi mp, looking for some adivice on witch of these two packs to buy.

Thanks

I have CCW Chaos for summer and it is awesome. I wouldn’t hesitate to buy another from Randy. 

I'm likewise a happy CCW user (I have four).  He's happy to work wit you to customize and build exactly the pack you want (within reason I imagine).  I have heard mixed reviews of cilogear - some seem to love them and some hate them.

Aaron Liebling wrote:

I'm likewise a happy CCW user (I have four).  He's happy to work wit you to customize and build exactly the pack you want (within reason I imagine).  I have heard mixed reviews of cilogear - some seem to love them and some hate them.

Ya I have heard mix reviews too.

Isn't there a substantial price difference (CCW<<Cilo)?

I've been very happy with my CCW pack - it's outlasted all of my previous packs (showing very little sign of wear after more than 6 years of almost weekly use). There are more convenient packs for cragging (e.g. I get jealous of my wife's pipedream pack), but CCW can't be beat for that particular (classic) style of pack IMO.

A M wrote:

Ya I have heard mix reviews too.

My $0.02 on my Cilo 45: it's light and carries well. But the materials are too light to take much abuse e.g. the taffeta inside that forms the framesheet pocket started to rip in the first year and is now in shreds. Ditto for the under-the-flap pocket. The strap system is um, versatile, but I would take fixed straps any day.

All right thanks for the info.

Is their any customizes you would recommend for the cold cold world Valdez?

Just call up Randy and chat with him- he's great at recommendations. I'd look at the sides ie Daisy chains, hip straps, etc and see if you're good with all that. He can change the color too if you want. Also he's got some cool custom packs on Instagram he's sold recently. I got a mostly stock Chernobyl that he recommended longer shoulder straps for due to my height 

A M wrote:

Is their any customizes you would recommend for the cold cold world Valdez?

Great pack but if I were to buy it again I'd ask for modern leashless tool attachments, a bigger lid pocket, and a pack body that was any color but black (its really hard to find things inside such a dark pack).   I'd buy another pack from CCW without hesitation.  

I've had 2 Cilo packs, a 75L and 40L.  They are ok.  Be aware that Cilogears pack sizes are much bigger.  My CCW Valdez and the Cilogear 40L worksack are nominally the same capacity but the Cilogear could probably carry 60L fully expanded.  Not that I'd recommend it.  The 40L didn't last me that long.  The 75L will probably last me forever since I only use it every few years.  

Love all 3 of my customized CCW packs.  Randy is a great dude to work with.   

I've got the 70L winter pack from Randy at CCW forget which model I think chernobyl. Works great as a crag pack too and the crampon holder fits a nalgene perfectly. 

It was like $2-300, fast turnaround for made-to-order gear and the thing is bomb proof yet lightweight. Very satisfied with the pack highly recommend their products.

I have all 3 CCW Alpine Packs (and an ozone which should be in the mail soon). They're phenomenal and truly second to none. The price and weight are competitive with every other commercial or cottage manufacturer, but the quality, durability, and design are far beyond. Plus, there's no pesky frame to deal with in the CCW -- useless imo for these types of packs.

The only pack that I think could compete is something made by Alpine Luddites -- based in nearby VT actually. But, that would be x2 or x3 the cost of a CCW.  

From my experience with my ccw valdez (I havent used a cilogear so cant comment on those). I do like the pack, but I feel that some of its old-school design decisions are a bit outdated. for example, the webbing is a bit wide and excessive for my taste. i get the durability argument to some materials, but I don't think think that slimmer webbing is necessarily wearing out on other packs. And you can customize the valdez with modern ice tool holders (I did for mine), but that feels like it should be standard instead of just loops. Something like the arc' alpha fl packs manage to get similar funtionality and durability in a lighter and more streamlined design.

i am happy with mine on the whole, and im really glad CCW is doing its thing and making affordable packs with some customization possibilities, with the direct to consumers model. i just wouldn't say they are the end-all-be-all of pack design..

Mitch L wrote:

From my experience with my ccw valdez (I havent used a cilogear so cant comment on those). I do like the pack, but I feel that some of its old-school design decisions are a bit outdated. for example, the webbing is a bit wide and excessive for my taste. i get the durability argument to some materials, but I don't think think that slimmer webbing is necessarily wearing out on other packs. And you can customize the valdez with modern ice tool holders (I did for mine), but that feels like it should be standard instead of just loops. Something like the arc' alpha fl packs manage to get similar funtionality and durability in a lighter and more streamlined design.

i am happy with mine on the whole, and im really glad CCW is doing its thing and making affordable packs with some customization possibilities, with the direct to consumers model. i just wouldn't say they are the end-all-be-all of pack design..

What is you favorite pack?

I agree with MitchL. I owned three different CCW packs from 20 to 10 years ago. Bomber but dated and other packs carry much better.

For durable and light weight, the Arc Alpha FLs are equivalent to CCWs (meaning they both carry weight so so)

For full featured packs that are a little heavier, but nicer - Osprey Mutants.

My new favorite alpine packs are Mtn Hardware AL 35 and 50 (as close to perfect as I have seen).

You could not give me a Cilo pack, surprised anyone still would buy one.

I get all the Randy love, his packs are cool but his woodcuts are amazing!!

I do agree with others that the packs are a bit dated in terms of design and materials, but they’re light enough for my use and absolutely bombproof.

I have a new Deadbird Alpha and it’s nice, light, well featured, but won’t last too long. My Patagonia Ascentionist lasted like a season or two before it was pretty beat down. It still works well enough, but it sees less use than my CCW and still shows much more in terms of wear. 

Rexford Nesakwatch wrote:

I agree with MitchL. I owned three different CCW packs from 20 to 10 years ago. Bomber but dated and other packs carry much better.

For durable and light weight, the Arc Alpha FLs are equivalent to CCWs (meaning they both carry weight so so)

For full featured packs that are a little heavier, but nicer - Osprey Mutants.

My new favorite alpine packs are Mtn Hardware AL 35 and 50 (as close to perfect as I have seen).

You could not give me a Cilo pack, surprised anyone still would buy one.

I get all the Randy love, his packs are cool but his woodcuts are amazing!!

How do you like the MHW AL 50?

A M wrote:

How do you like the MHW AL 50?

Best 50L (or 45L with brain removed) I've ever owned, and I've owned tons of packs. With that said, I can't speak to its durability, and I suspect it won't be awesome. I have the previous gen AL 35, which I have lots of days on, but it was made out of dyneema and has held up well. I have the current gen AL 50 and it seems like an improvement in every way over the previous model except for the pack fabric which is not dyneema, but I don't have enough days on it to really judge its durability. Interestingly, durability is no longer super important to me.

For fun, here's a pic of my 20 y.o. Chernobyl. It still has a lot of life left, but I use only for route development and to take the tools for a walk to the dry tool crag. The "soft suspension (i.e., a piece of folded foam pad)" is great for light loads but sucks when you're carrying the full kit, I think every 60 L or larger pack should have some semblance of real suspension.

@Ted Raven - I thought the same thing about the Alpha FL but years later I am surprised at how well it's held up, even the lightweight expansion collar thing has no tears. I had an Ascension for about 6 months before I couldn't wait to get rid of it. The Ascension looks a lot like the Alpha FL, but I think the material is worlds apart (like the Dead Bird's is way better). For all of Patagonia's posturing about the environment, I've purchased a couple surprisingly non durable products from them over the last 10 years.

I would use any CCW or the Alpha FL as a crag pack, but I will use the MHWs only for alpine if that helps. I feel cragging requires a dedicated burl pack (BD Creek or equivalent).

I am leaning more towards the CCW Valdez over Cilo 45l or 30:30. The reason is the durability I have heard many people say the cilogears only hold up a few trips before they explode, is this true? I anyone else has anything to say please say it.