Patagonia Grade VII Discontinued; "AlpLoft Down Parka" Inbound as Replacement

I was recently made aware that there's been confirmation Patagonia appears to have axed the Grade VII Parka and will be replacing it with the "AlpLoft Down Parka", hence no Grade VII availability pretty much everywhere in the US and Canada.

According to Patagonia's European website, the new AlpLoft Parka weighs in at 680 grams, a weight saving of approximately 69 grams vs. the latest Grade VII, which was listed at approximately 749 grams.

It's still unknown what the down fill weight is, ie: how many grams of down are used in the AlpLoft's construction, but they're still using 800 fill power, which the latest Grade VII had approximately 330 grams of.

Per the Patagonia Japanese website, it appears the initial launch will likely be light blue and light orange options. No indication that there will be a women's specific version yet.

Video with product description here.

There better be a good snap on the bottom of that zip. 

that guy named seb wrote:

There better be a good snap on the bottom of that zip. 

No snap unfortunately.  I've had one since this spring though I haven't really gotta use it in its intended environment.  I've mainly used it for cold weather rock cragging.

Overall it doesn't feel as warm as a GVII but warmer than previous model year FitzRoys and definitely warmer than the current model.  Features all feel very similar to the GVII.   There is a new baffle design that doesn't have any exterior stitching besides at major joints.  So there shouldn't be any real feather loss.  I'm not sure what weight the face fabric is, but similar to the heavier fabric on the GVII.  Some reviews have said it is more durable than a GVII and said some less.  So time will tell.

Total bummer to hear minimal weight savings, no snap and less warm. Do you know what kind of baffle system it is? Laminated or integrated weave? I assume it's not a box baffle. 

that guy named seb wrote:

Total bummer to hear minimal weight savings, no snap and less warm. Do you know what kind of baffle system it is? Laminated or integrated weave? I assume it's not a box baffle. 

Agreed, 100%. For the anticipated 69 grams of weight savings, I'd gladly take the warmth over weight of the Grade VII if Mikey's testing turns out to be accurate. 

Typical Patagonia axing a great piece for no fucking reason. Whatever happened to their "High Alpine Kit" plans / intentions? Such a waste of a great system to not keep it going, IMHO.

Rab positron seems like a better piece-and for likely half the price.  Patagonia ruined the fitz Roy down parka-and now the grade Vll

AlpineIce wrote:

 Whatever happened to their "High Alpine Kit" plans / intentions? 

They remembered only 1% of their customers actually do any real alpine climbing. 

A video of Patagonia's 2022 alpine lineup can be seen here, which includes the yet-to-be released AlpLoft Parka with product description and pricing ($599 USD.) No date of sale has been released yet.

The new face fabric baffle and lining all being woven together is legit shit, pretty awesome stuff from a technical standpoint, I'd love to look at this jacket under a microscope, their technical team have done wonders with this jacket and have legitimately released something that doesn't exist on the market. This is some actual innovation right here. And confirms it is a box/triangular baffle system. 

that guy named seb wrote:

The new face fabric baffle and lining all being woven together is legit shit, pretty awesome stuff from a technical standpoint, I'd love to look at this jacket under a microscope, their technical team have done wonders with this jacket and have legitimately released something that doesn't exist on the market. This is some actual innovation right here. And confirms it is a box/triangular baffle system. 

You nailed it, my man. I'm still very curious to know what the down fill weight is. I hate that Patagonia and a few others refuse to list this on their website. So unnecessary and frustrating.

Reviews starting to roll in from field use.

that guy named seb wrote:

The new face fabric baffle and lining all being woven together is legit shit, pretty awesome stuff from a technical standpoint, I'd love to look at this jacket under a microscope, their technical team have done wonders with this jacket and have legitimately released something that doesn't exist on the market. This is some actual innovation right here. And confirms it is a box/triangular baffle system. 

Any more, I'm a bit skeptical of Patagonia's hype.  Sometimes, it's justified.  Sometimes it isn't.

I bought into the hype for their last "Greatest Belay Jacket of All Time!!" with the Patagonia Encapsil Belay Parka.  

It was, no-contest, the worst puffy jacket I've ever owned.  It's only redeeming feature was the strong used market for Patagonia in Korea, which allowed me to re-sell it for more than I paid for it.  

I will wait a season or two and see how these things hold up.  (Although if everyone really likes them, Patagonia is sure to discontinue the model.)  

Kai Larson wrote:

Any more, I'm a bit skeptical of Patagonia's hype.  Sometimes, it's justified.  Sometimes it isn't.

I bought into the hype for their last "Greatest Belay Jacket of All Time!!" with the Patagonia Encapsil Belay Parka.  

It was, no-contest, the worst puffy jacket I've ever owned.  It's only redeeming feature was the strong used market for Patagonia in Korea, which allowed me to re-sell it for more than I paid for it.  

I will wait a season or two and see how these things hold up.  (Although if everyone really likes them, Patagonia is sure to discontinue the model.)  

It's funny you bring up the encapsil, it's another example of a jacket that did some really interesting and innovative things but the overall jacket let it down and the alploft just like the encapsil seems to have very similar design issues. 

that guy named seb wrote:

It's funny you bring up the encapsil, it's another example of a jacket that did some really interesting and innovative things but the overall jacket let it down and the alploft just like the encapsil seems to have very similar design issues. 

The thing that screwed up the encapsil jacket was the interesting and innovative main selling point; the encapsilated down.  After using the jacket for a week or so, the down would clump together and stop lofting.  You were left with baffles that were mostly devoid of down fill and a jacket that was made up mostly of cold spots.  

The jacket also lacked a two way front zipper, which makes absolutely no sense on a belay jacket.  

For all the hype and R&D that went into the jacket, the Encapsil was a major failure.  

Does it surprise you guys or let you down that Patagonia chose to cut weight here, making the AlpLoft likely less warm than the Grade VII? 

From my understanding, it appeared that people chose the Grade VII for its warmth-to-weight ration; a go-to alpine climbing belay jacket for the Alaska Range, Canadian Rockies, Alps, etc.

From my initial impressions via online reports, I feel like they're steering away from or missing the mark here. Your thoughts?

patagonias Instagram shows you why this really is a innovative jacket, no other jacket has done this. It will inherently be heavier because their is more fabric and the GSM of that fabric is great than the usual baffle material.

I would expect around 200g-230g of down in this new jacket but it should be very warm for the amount of down in the jacket. 

295 grams of 800-fill down, conformed via Patagucci.

AlpineIce wrote:

295 grams of 800-fill down, conformed via Patagucci.

That's really surprising, I wonder how they managed to add just 30g to the jacket sans down.

With that amount of down and this construction I'd expect similar warmth to the grade 7.

Just wanted to chime with some real world experience here as I’ve had the fortunate opportunity to put both of these jackets to use recently ice climbing in Montana in chilly conditions.

I’m not all that great at describing things but the long and short of it is, I would go with the Grade VII if you can find one. The AlpLoft is a nice jacket and will suit many but it is simply not as refined, not as warm, and the fit is not as good as the Grade VII. In the same size the Grade VII has much more loft, longer drop seat, easier to get on and off/ easier zippers to use, better internal dump/storage pockets, better hood, and has nice attached stuff sack vs non-attached on the AlpLoft. The extra weight is totally worth the trade off.  Patagonia hit a home run with the Grade VII, too bad it’s discontinued. For belay parkas, I don’t think anything out there is better.

With that said,  the AlpLoft is still a great jacket that you can climb/belay in and if you just want a warm jacket to wear around it’ll definitely fit the bill.

Went to a patagonia store in chamonix to try it on and I wanted to give a visual, some opinions on the design and where they fell short, my main comparison will be my montane jacket that has a fill of roughly 280g. 

So first things first, it's very short in the front and just about long enough in the back to cover your arse. 295g of down sounds good but then you realise because of the new construction they have evenly spread the down across the whole jacket evenly, so the core has much less down in than what you would typically see in a jacket of this fill weight making it feel a lot less warm. 

The drop pockets are sad, mesh would have been preferable and they just feel a bit too short, the whole whole jacket just feel like it needs to be 2 inches longer or so. 

Lack of snap becomes less of an issue as honestly it barely feels long enough to need one. The hem cinch is kinda weird and really would be better if the jacket was longer and had a snap at the cinch point, this would have isolated the torso just above the harness keeping out drafts and maintaining access to your harness, almost a really great feature. 

Front zip is nice as are the cuffs. 

Hood is pretty poor tbh not sure how it compares with the grade VII but it doesn't move with my helmeted head well and when cinched down leaves a lot exposed. 

Montane jacket for reference. 

I think the alploft will be a good jacket for the European market especially in the alps in the winter but I can see it disappointing people who want a parka for -30 on denali. 

My current go-to for a really warm down jacket is Valandre.  

I've got two Valandre jackets;  the Troll and the Immelman.  The Immelman is too warm for pretty much anything I do, but the Troll hits that sweet spot for a jacket that is really warm, but not too massive.  Valandre's patterns are the best I've ever used, and create a jacket that has a ton of freedom of movement.