Skwama Fit Advice?

Hi Mountain Project,

I’m hoping to gain some wisdom on how my Skwamas should fit. These are my first pair of aggressive shoes, as I’ve historically stuck to easy trad. Now that I want to try hard, I decided on Skwamas, but I think the downturned-ness and softness is messing with my understanding of how they should fit.

I got the Skwamas in size 40, for context, I wear a USM 9 street shoe, I have TC Pros in 41.5 oversized for really easy stuff, Mirua Lace in 40.5 that fit really well, and another pair of TC Pros in size 40 for harder edging.

I’ve worn the Skwamas for two gym bouldering sessions now, and I can say they remain fairly uncomfortable, and make my toes curl considerably. However, I have a lot of dead space in the top of the shoe, and a bit in the heel. Particularly on the top over the forefoot, the fabric has bulges of air that aren’t getting filled out by my foot. I’ve been told the Skwamas have a “glove like” fit, but I’m definitely not experiencing that. With my Miruas I can’t really wiggle my toes at all, but they’re pretty comfortable, with just a slight curl in my toes. The Skwamas make my toes curl more and they’re definitely more uncomfortable, but due to the dead space they’re not super snug feeling, so I can wiggle and move my little toes around. 

I’m not sure if I’m just not used to such a soft, downturned shoe, but the fit just doesn’t seem right.

I’m wondering what the collective wisdom of the internet thinks I should do?

I could downsize more to maybe fill out the dead space and get a tighter fit, but then I don’t even know if I could bear climbing in them to get them to stretch. Sizing up doesn’t seem to make such sense, but I thought about that too. Outside of those two options, I thought about a different shoe all together, something like the Otaki or the Solution.

Thanks for any advice, sorry it’s such a long read.

Tl;dr my Skwamas don’t fit right, what should I do?

Thanks!
Jack

Here are some reference points that may or may not be helpful. I wear a size 42/42.5 hiking shoe. In the TC Pro my comfy ones are 40 and my tight ones 39. I wore a 39 in the Miura when I wore that model, and I wear a 39 in the Skwama. 

We're similar in sizes across the board; I wear 41 for comfort and 40.5 for performance. The katana Lace is my go-to shoe, and the laces let me help adjust for the baggy heel. I've tried on Skwamas, Futura, Theories, and Solutions, and have encountered the same issue as you. In Futura I found up sizing to help, but in general I've found that my feet just don't fit well into these shoes at any size. I've switched over to the Evolv Phantom LV as my aggressive bouldering shoe, and I find that the heel and toes feel sock-like without putting my toes through miserable contortions. These size up between 1.5 and two sizes compared to my Sportiva shoes.

My skwamas and miura velcro are the same size.  There's always the chance it may not be the shoe for your foot.

Wear a size 10 USM in street shoes and wear 41.5 Skwamas for bouldering and single pitch sport. They're not comfortable at that size for all-day multipitch routes unless you slip your heels out at belay stances. Also wear a 41.5 in the Miura VS which is slightly more comfortable for me. The Skwama breaks in significantly over time and becomes more comfortable. I noticed a major change in the comfort of the shoe when I first got them vs. when they broke in a little vs. the end of the shoe's life.

X C wrote:

Here are some reference points that may or may not be helpful. I wear a size 42/42.5 hiking shoe. In the TC Pro my comfy ones are 40 and my tight ones 39. I wore a 39 in the Miura when I wore that model, and I wear a 39 in the Skwama. 

Jesus Christ how. I wear the same street shoe size and wearing 40 Skwamas was painful enough for me to sell them. Also because I don't climb hard enough for that amount of downturn. 

FWIW, I wear street, hiking and mountaineering boots in sizes ranging from 42-43EU and my climbing shoes are/have been as follows:

La Sportiva Mythos 40,5 (too baggy after stretch)

La Sportiva Skwama 40 (too tight for anything but wearing while climbing and I didn't overhang nearly hard enough at the time and still don't)

Scarpa Thunder 40,5 (perfect before resoling, slightly too tight after)

La Sportiva Katana Lace 40, 5 (sheer perfection for my limit climbs)

Scarpa Vapor V 41 (I can climb at my current comfort and wear them longer than any of the previous ones)

If your Mirua Lace fit well, then you probably have a more narrow foot, which is not the Skwama.
probably better off with the Katana or find another narrower shoe. I don’t know offhand which ones are narrow as I have a wider forefoot and love the Skwama and Solutions.

Edit:
https://www.lasportiva.com/en/blog/post/how-to-choose-the-best-climbing-shoes

This is a nice chart.

The Squama is a performance shoe but the obvious downturn is deceiving- this typically results in a shoe that doesn't smear well.  The Skwama is actually an all around performance shoe.  The front sole is thin and flexible. The center of the cup in the fore sole has been removed. The result is a shoe that climbs steep pockets well, edges well and smears very well.  They do need to be downsized quite a bit and they do take a while to break in but it's worth the pain in my opinion.  

I climb at an area that has steep, featured face climbing off the ground that often leads to a band of blank slab. I trust the Skwamas on the slab more than I would trust TC's and perhaps even a little more than my lace Katanas. I use them for bouldering and cragging and not multi pitch. If crack is thrown into the mix I wear Otakis or Katanas.

Lace Katanas are 43.5

Otakis are 43

Skwamas are 42.5 (ouch).

Skwamas are actually the only LS shoe I wear - I love them to death. I'll echo what is said above though - they're also my most downsized shoe and the break in period was brutal (though short). I think it took two climbing sessions, plus some time wearing them with wool socks while watching TV at home for them to be manageable and then another few sessions for them to actually be comfortable. My oracles were a similar process - I adore both shoes now, though for different reasons. 

I'd wear them a bit more before you give up on them - but there's also a real chance they're just not the right shoe for you. I've heard of people wearing their shoes in the shower to stretch them out or throwing them in the freezer to lock them into a specific shape. I don't think either is really necessary. My skwamas were easily my most unpleasant break in experience for any of my shoes but I just bought another pair to do all over again - it was worth it IMO.

For reference: 

Skwamas - 43

Vapor Vs - 44.5

Generals - 45

Oracles - 44.5

Up Mocc - 43

Street Shoe (converse) - 44.5

The least comfortable of these for me is easily the generals despite them being the largest - they're pretty narrow and kill my achilles after a few pitches

Victor Machtel wrote:

Jesus Christ how. I wear the same street shoe size and wearing 40 Skwamas was painful enough for me to sell them. Also because I don't climb hard enough for that amount of downturn. 

FWIW, I wear street, hiking and mountaineering boots in sizes ranging from 42-43EU and my climbing shoes are/have been as follows:

La Sportiva Mythos 40,5 (too baggy after stretch)

La Sportiva Skwama 40 (too tight for anything but wearing while climbing and I didn't overhang nearly hard enough at the time and still don't)

Scarpa Thunder 40,5 (perfect before resoling, slightly too tight after)

La Sportiva Katana Lace 40, 5 (sheer perfection for my limit climbs)

Scarpa Vapor V 41 (I can climb at my current comfort and wear them longer than any of the previous ones)

Foot shape and toe length. I wear a 45 street and. 41.5 in the Skwama. Comfy enough to belay in I swear. I wear most Sportivas in a 42.5 though. 

My cobra ecos are 41s and fit inside my running shoes. Katanas in a 43. Really depends on the shoe and the foot.

If they are painfully tight and you feel lots of space in the shoe, it’s not the right shoe shape for you. Try other models or brands. I don’t know why this thread is so long with people listing off all their sizes. 

I had the same issue. I don't think downsizing more would ever help me, the toebox is just too wide and my foot slides around since the only way to tighten it is up by the ankle. I switched to the blue hiangles, which are much narrower, and that worked great. Definitely try out some other shoes though, it's amazing how a whole new world of standing on small edges opens up when you feel confident in your shoes.

Mike K wrote:

If they are painfully tight and you feel lots of space in the shoe, it’s not the right shoe shape for you. Try other models or brands. I don’t know why this thread is so long with people listing off all their sizes. 

Failed to mention for reference:

Flip-flops- 44

Uggs- 44.5

Wooden clogs- 47 (with gel inserts)

https://sizesquirrel.com/ is a helpful site

Elijah Benson wrote:

We're similar in sizes across the board; I wear 41 for comfort and 40.5 for performance. The katana Lace is my go-to shoe, and the laces let me help adjust for the baggy heel. I've tried on Skwamas, Futura, Theories, and Solutions, and have encountered the same issue as you. In Futura I found up sizing to help, but in general I've found that my feet just don't fit well into these shoes at any size. I've switched over to the Evolv Phantom LV as my aggressive bouldering shoe, and I find that the heel and toes feel sock-like without putting my toes through miserable contortions. These size up between 1.5 and two sizes compared to my Sportiva shoes.

Thanks so much for the advice! I like the idea of a LV specific show

Jesse Keith wrote:

If your Mirua Lace fit well, then you probably have a more narrow foot, which is not the Skwama.
probably better off with the Katana or find another narrower shoe. I don’t know offhand which ones are narrow as I have a wider forefoot and love the Skwama and Solutions.

Edit:
https://www.lasportiva.com/en/blog/post/how-to-choose-the-best-climbing-shoes

This is a nice chart.

Thanks! That is a sweet chart. I'm looking into the Katanas

Tal M wrote:

Skwamas are actually the only LS shoe I wear - I love them to death. I'll echo what is said above though - they're also my most downsized shoe and the break in period was brutal (though short). I think it took two climbing sessions, plus some time wearing them with wool socks while watching TV at home for them to be manageable and then another few sessions for them to actually be comfortable. My oracles were a similar process - I adore both shoes now, though for different reasons. 

I'd wear them a bit more before you give up on them - but there's also a real chance they're just not the right shoe for you. I've heard of people wearing their shoes in the shower to stretch them out or throwing them in the freezer to lock them into a specific shape. I don't think either is really necessary. My skwamas were easily my most unpleasant break in experience for any of my shoes but I just bought another pair to do all over again - it was worth it IMO.

For reference: 

Skwamas - 43

Vapor Vs - 44.5

Generals - 45

Oracles - 44.5

Up Mocc - 43

Street Shoe (converse) - 44.5

The least comfortable of these for me is easily the generals despite them being the largest - they're pretty narrow and kill my achilles after a few pitches

Thanks! I'm gonna keep at them for a little longer before I make a decision on them