Yosemite Valley Entrance Permit

Hey all!

Looks like entrance permits are now implemented.  Can someone smarter than me extrapolate how this can affect big wall planning?

If I'm reading correctly, two permits will be needed for climbing The Nose?  And the EP is for a max three days?  And can be obtained only through the website.  

What if I enter the park at 5am?  Is one needed still?

https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/reservations.htm

Last season, a wall permit would get you through the gate. In other words, you could get your permit for the Nose or whatever and simply show that at the entrance station. Honestly not too bad. Who knows what new bureaucracy awaits this year. You could always email the climbing rangers to ask.

abandon moderation wrote:

lol, the 3rd year of "temporary" entrance permits. 

From this page though: https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/faq.htm

No. If you enter Yosemite before 6 am or after 4 pm, you do not need a reservation. You can remain in the park during peak hours if you arrive during these non-peak hours.

I've never seen anyone at the gate at 6am, maybe that's changing. Or maybe not, who knows with the park service.

I once asked a gate ranger when they arrive in the morning and he laughed and said it was a state secret. But around 7am seems to have been my experience.  

With all the construction planned for this summer, something like this was probably going to be necessary to avoid parking apocalypse. Although maybe the pandemic will recede and people will go back to playing video games or whatever they did back in 2019? I don't remember.

abandon moderation wrote:

lol, the 3rd year of "temporary" entrance permits.

I thought they were in response to reopening after the initial Covid lockdowns to limit crowds. That would mean they started in the summer of 2020.

Marc801 C wrote:

I thought they were in response to reopening after the initial Covid lockdowns to limit crowds. That would mean they started in the summer of 2020.

Although Covid was the initial justification for the reservation system, the prevailing expectation seems to be that the reservation system isn't ever going away.

My experience last summer was that with even a very modest amount of foresight, it was easy to get entry reservations for any weekend I wanted to visit the park. Even just getting the slots made available 7-days ahead. It is much much easier than the campsite reservations.  So regardless of whatever philosophical objections one might have to an entry reservation system, from a pragmatic standpoint it won't keep you from going climbing.

This is great. Most climbers (especially bigwallers) are going to be entering the park before 6am or late the night before (well after the 4pm cutoff) anyways. This pretty much only has an effect upon the tourists that clog up the loop. 

The biggest issue with the reservations to this point was that they prevented you from entering the park after hours, or working projects late into the night. This will help reduce the daytime crowds without adding extra loopholes for those of us that aren't contributing to the daytime crowding of the valley floor. 

Eben Freeman wrote:

You could always email the climbing rangers to ask.

From what I gathered online, the climbing rangers’ positions begin May 1. The website also intimated the wall-permit system may change around then, but it’s possible I misunderstood something. 

My partner tried calling the backcountry office and didn’t hear back. I sent an email and also didn’t hear back.

If you enter before the gates are staffed, you're supposed to fill out a self registration form to be displayed on your dashboard. The form must show your valid entrance reservation number. If you don't have a valid reservation or permit number, you could get busted. No idea what the probability is, but it's something to consider.

Tuolumne Climber wrote:

If you enter before the gates are staffed, you're supposed to fill out a self registration form to be displayed on your dashboard. The form must show your valid entrance reservation number. If you don't have a valid reservation or permit number, you could get busted. No idea what the probability is, but it's something to consider.

That was the old system. Does not apply to this new system

Marc H wrote:

From what I gathered online, the climbing rangers’ positions begin May 1. The website also intimated the wall-permit system may change around then, but it’s possible I misunderstood something.

AFAIK, the "change" will be that it will move from the self service kiosk (as it is right now) to meeting a ranger to have the permit issued to you. 

So we can just roll in early without a reservation or permit and stay all day?  Glad to hear it. Big improvement over last year!

I would venture to say the new new system is downright reasonable. agree with Kevin, those are climbers hours right there. 

Not a hardcore climber but my Yosemite experience's have vastly improved with the reservations the past few years. I've found them super easy to get and the park way less crowded than before. One big downside of this year's is no more driving through from Tioga -> West side without a reservation it appears. That was allowed last year and made it easier to get to and from the east side. 

Danny V wrote:

Not a hardcore climber but my Yosemite experience's have vastly improved with the reservations the past few years. I've found them super easy to get and the park way less crowded than before. One big downside of this year's is no more driving through from Tioga -> West side without a reservation it appears. That was allowed last year and made it easier to get to and from the east side. 

Well, my experience has been that the gate staff has been very liberal in how they interpret the rules. Unless you get someone having a bad day, they've been reasonable in allowing people to drive through or visit friends living in the park whether or not you had a permit. Ymmv as always 

Danny V wrote:

Not a hardcore climber but my Yosemite experience's have vastly improved with the reservations the past few years. I've found them super easy to get and the park way less crowded than before. One big downside of this year's is no more driving through from Tioga -> West side without a reservation it appears. That was allowed last year and made it easier to get to and from the east side. 

Though if you are driving through after 4 pm, you're free to go through without a reservation now. This means that the late Friday night drive over to the Eastside can happen without a reservation. Same thing for the Sunday evening return drive.

I agree with the other posters that the new system seems really quite reasonable. It will help manage the volume of tourist hordes without much adverse impacts on motivated climbers. 

abandon moderation wrote:

I'm pretty skeptical that climbers are the only group that are going to figure out to enter the gates early in the morning. I guess it can't possibly increase the amount of traffic, though.

At this point it seems they just adjusted their definition of "temporary" to mean "seasonal". The traffic/parking problems sure aren't going away in 2023.

It's not really that different from knowing that if you enter before the gates are staffed and exit after the gates are no longer staffed then no one ever checks if you actually have a parks pass. This concept has been in place for decades at least and tourists have never caught on. (To be clear, no one should do this in lieu of purchasing an annual pass and supporting the parks)

Also, we weren't making the argument that only climbers would "figure out" entering the park early to avoid the reservations. Only that the general behavior patterns of climbers matches up with  the benefits of this new system. And tbh, anybody with a modicome of reading comprehension will see the text on the nps website and "figure out" that they can avoid getting a entrance reservation by simply entering outside of the reservation time frame. 

Danny V wrote:

One big downside of this year's is no more driving through from Tioga -> West side without a reservation it appears. That was allowed last year and made it easier to get to and from the east side. 

This was just posted on FB: locals can drive through the park without a permit during the reservation times.

The honker should have everyone up by 5 anyway. What's the big deal,?

Tony Lobay wrote:

The honker should have everyone up by 5 anyway. What's the big deal,?

10/10

On the same topic but different note, can someone clear the camping situation up for me please? I'm heading there in May and am super confused on how and where to camp for climbing access in the valley. The website is super misleading as it says some of the sites are not open yet but they're already reserved. Then some are by lottery? I kind of seems like you just go there and hope to get a spot? Could someone clear this up for me please?

Alex Langfield wrote:

On the same topic but different note, can someone clear the camping situation up for me please? I'm heading there in May and am super confused on how and where to camp for climbing access in the valley. The website is super misleading as it says some of the sites are not open yet but they're already reserved. Then some are by lottery? I kind of seems like you just go there and hope to get a spot? Could someone clear this up for me please?

They open up camping reservations at a specific date and time and they get swooped really fast. I can't speak to if that's happened or not for this summer. Campgrounds like Camp 4 are now lottery. The day before your trip you can try to get a spot. The only other bet is to look for cancelations. 

Steph Evans wrote:

They open up camping reservations at a specific date and time and they get swooped really fast. I can't speak to if that's happened or not for this summer. Campgrounds like Camp 4 are now lottery. The day before your trip you can try to get a spot. The only other bet is to look for cancelations. 

Word, how likely is it to get a spot if we just show up to camp 4?