What do you mean when you say “on belay”?

And what should you mean?

I heard this thing at the crag yesterday. Man, it was crazy.

I remembering hearing "on belay?" is short for "Am I on belay?"

Unless you fuck up, i will not let you hit the ground.

It's 2022. Why is this even a question?

Oh. Right. Gym-based gen Z's wanting to either redefine every term or hear a phrase and completely misinterpret it.

More than likely they heard "You're really not on belay until you clip the first piece" and twisted that into "you don't say on belay until the first piece is clipped". This is how a conceptual meta-statement becomes a n00b's iron clad rule.

I mean that I will catch them with the rope unless it is physically impossible to do so.

"On belay?" is a question asked by the climber.

"Belay's on" is a statement from the belayer.

I first heard the "you're not on belay until you clip the first bolt" thing in 2012. 

Perhaps it's useful for newer climbers to understand the distinction between spotting their climber and actively managing the rope. Whereas a more advanced climber understands that the concept of belaying the climber is broader than simply managing the rope. Just a thought.

Doctor Drake wrote:

I first heard the "you're not on belay until you clip the first bolt" thing in 2012. 

Perhaps it's useful for newer climbers to understand the distinction between spotting their climber and actively managing the rope. Whereas a more advanced climber understands that the concept of belaying the climber is broader than simply managing the rope. Just a though.

What if you don't clip a bolt for several years?

Doctor Drake wrote:

I first heard the "you're not on belay until you clip the first bolt" thing in 2012.

Funny, I first heard it in 1973 (although referring to pro, not specifically bolts).

Marc801 C wrote:

Funny, I first heard it in 1973 (although referring to pro, not specifically bolts).

So if it's not a concept created by the new wave of social media climbers, then what's all the fuss? There are lots of things in climbing that are taught to beginners, but experienced climbers understand they're not set in stone or not entirely correct. 

Consider belay technique, the finishing knot above your primary knot, the figure 8 follow through vs any type of bowline. Most gyms I've been to treat their answer to those topics as gospel and impart that onto their customers. Experienced climbers understand that there's a time and a place and you have to make your own judgement of what is appropriate or "best."

Doctor Drake wrote:

So if it's not a concept created by the new wave of social media climbers, then what's all the fuss? 

The fuss is the lack of understanding the concept so that it became "Don't say belay on/on belay* until the first piece is clipped." This becomes a safety issue as described in the parent thread of this one.

*: belay on/on belay - another source of confusion for some. One is a question, the other a response, yet from strictly a language standpoint are interchangeable.

Geez, people, you're confusing two different things!

You are on belay as soon as we finish the partner check and confirm my belay device is correct (or whatever), you are more or less tied in, and think you're ready to climb.

After that?

The only wrinkle is guesstimating how useless the belay is, and if that bothers you, as you're climbing.

Haven't clipped anything?

You're soloing.

I'll admire yer ass, yell up at ya, if that kinda thing gives you the warm fuzzies.

Once you clip something?

Just gimme a sec to set the coffee down, eh?

Best, Helen

EDIT to add, if you peel off before you clip something? It's all on you, especially if I drop my coffee or you crash into it. Sheesh.

Dead horse?

From a reasoning standpoint when I ask if I'm on belay I guess I'm asking if the belayer is paying attention and ready to do their job. 

 True enough I am not actually on belay until the first piece is clipped but I want to know if I'm on a spot before that happens. 

When I belay I say "on belay" or "ready" "I got you" whenever I'm ready to pay attention and all the gear is set and checked and then I'll say "I'm with you" after they clip the first piece to let them know I have the rope managed and proper slack from then on. 

People get so uptight about terms.. in reality it doesn't matter what you use if it gets the point across. I'll ask ready? Or I'll say climbing? and wait for my partner to confirm they are ready to go and then I go up. 

But my by far favorite response to "on belay?" Is "Fall on" Always gets a laugh.

From Spanish ándale (“hurry! come on! let's go!”).

to answer the title: most people mean "my hand is on the brake"

what i mean [at least when administering belay tests]: "i can catch your fall within the rope system even if its a foot off the ground, like, now, you clumsy goof"

Old lady H wrote:

You are on belay as soon as we finish the partner check and confirm my belay device is correct (or whatever), you are more or less tied in, and think you're ready to climb.

Well you can't argue with efficiency.

"Alright I'm double ba---"

"ON BELAY!"

PortlandRob wrote:

Well you can't argue with efficiency.

"Alright I'm double ba---"

"ON BELAY!"

It's worse than that, when we're at my gym.

The top ropes are all prerigged, with a fatass locker on the knot side, and a Grigri and fatass locker on the belay end.

Usually, it's something like this:

"You ready?"

"Yup"

"Okay"

Sigh. Gym climbing is.....gym climbing. 

Outside, it gets far more fun, even on simple single pitch cragging.

"18 draws! WTF??"

"Hang on, lemme get to the pack....."

At some point?

I will almost certainly ask you to show me your stuff, last thing before you climb, once we ascertain you've got all the crap you think you want clanking around and really wanna do this. 

At least we aren't at Indian Creek. Or Vedauwoo.

Yet.

Seriously, though?

There is not much I can do for you once your feet are past my head, and nothing at all if your 170 pound self is 15+ feet off the ground, fishing for that first bit of gear. Make sure the rope is behaving. And hope today isn't the day it goes badly right off the deck. 

Nonetheless, I am belaying, as soon as you leave the ground. That's when the shit gets serious, and my job is to facilitate your climbing, sure, but the big ticket bottom line? 

I'm there to mitigate the consequences if gravity wins.

Best, Helen

It used to be "doubled ba..."

Imagine falling before getting your first piece in and blaming the belayer when you deck: 

“What the hell man I thought you had me?! You said I was on belay!”

Collin H wrote:

Imagine falling before getting your first piece in and blaming the belayer when you deck: 

“What the hell man I thought you had me?! You said I was on belay!”

I guess you never heard of spotting before the first clip. Not that you are going to catch them with your bare hands. But you prevent him/her from landing on neck or back.