Weighted Pullups

Supposedly Bachar swore by them. What are your opinions? 

My goal is power endurance but I'm rehabbing an A2 sprain and trying to figure out other ways to train without climbing the harder, finger-intensive routes in my gym. Elev8 has a weighted vest, so I just started doing 5 sets of 5 reps on 40lbs with 3 minutes rest between sets. I'm using rings instead of the bar for elbow health.

Previous threads proved moderately informative.

For reference and spray, I can do 20 consecutive normal pullups with good form and onsight in the 5.11c range outdoors, sport and trad. I eat vegetarian and take collagen with vitamin C, etshitera.

If you're going for power endurance it might be better to add reps rather than weight as you progress. Maybe add a rep to each set each week until you get to the 8-12 range and then add more weight starting back at five. You could also use straps to take the weight off your hands but that's kind of part of the endurance and might be counter productive.

You’re good on pullups - especially for 11’s - go find something else to work on - like core - front levers or something - and a hangboard to rehab your finger.

you can onsight 11c trad? nice dude

Jesse Quandt wrote:

you can onsight 11c trad? nice dude

Only in Colorado, where all the grades are soft. :-P

James W wrote:

You’re good on pullups - especially for 11’s - go find something else to work on - like core - front levers or something - and a hangboard to rehab your finger.

I don't think he's trying to get better at pullups or even stronger at pulling, he's looking for substitute to power endurance training on the wall. I would normally agree that training pullups aren't going to make you all that better at climbing if you're already good at pullups but in this specific scenario might work for what he's trying to accomplish.

Austin Shaver wrote:

he's looking for substitute to power endurance training on the wall.

Correct. I've already done a hangboard cycle without using my affected fingers (middle left, ring right).

I'm open to any other suggestions ... wrist roller? Rice bucket? Wrist curls? Doing 4x4's on juggy 5.8 with the weighted vest? Basically, I want to get pumped without having to pull hard on pocket or steep crimps with those fingers. 

Austin Shaver wrote:

I don't think he's trying to get better at pullups or even stronger at pulling, he's looking for substitute to power endurance training on the wall. I would normally agree that training pullups aren't going to make you all that better at climbing if you're already good at pullups but in this specific scenario might work for what he's trying to accomplish.

Pull-ups, especially weighted, are not effective as a power endurance tool, and at your current level will not yield major power or endurance gains on what you are climbing. If you really want to get better PE there are other possible and effective ways even while injured. The best way is to get pumped on the wall, preferably in a controlled environment that works for your finger.  Also, it may help you to research PE focused easier hangboard routines. The Crimpd app has many and a simple google search will yield many as well.  Maybe some type of 7:3 repeaters or longer on a larger hold potentially with weight. 

Have you checked out Eric Horsts’ training plans? Check out the spreadsheet. There’s a section on power endurance and it includes various types of pull-ups.
https://trainingforclimbing.com/training-programs/

Another workout that might benefit you (not really PE, but most climbers could benefit from):

In you gym, pick a boulder problem that is hard for you but not at your limit.  In your case, something steep and not fingery.  Add a weight vest if you have to, in order to make it hard.  Now, do the problem, then downclimb or drop off (careful dropping off with a weight vest on!), then immediately find a jug and use it to rest.  Do not rest on the ground!  Force yourself to rest on a jug, shaking and working on body position. Then do the boulder problem again after getting as much back as you can.

This works on quasi-PE (and basic endurance) plus teaches you how to rest... something a lot of people don't train but should.  You learn to rest both technically (body positioning, shaking etc) and physically(teaching your muscles to recover even under SOME load)

As my friend likes to say, "sport climbing hard routes isn't about doing hard moves as much as it is about finding and using rests."

Later in life Bachar indicated in an interview that he wasn't sure how much weighted pullups and related training helped. However, I recall him saying that the weighted training he did was good for his confidence.

That said, weighted pullups might be an engaging distraction for awhile until your finger starts to recover.

As far as nursing a pulley injury and climbing, tape your finger board straight and crack climb or climb off vertical routes where you can find creative ways of not using the finger or loading it too much. 

Skip the climbing gym for awhile. In my experience, it tends to be a great place to get injured with debatable utility for trad climbing.

You could either try foot on campusing and vary how far you go up and the size of rungs or do 2 seconds on 1 second off on a hangboard till your arms are noodles.

Rest for half the time you spend on the board, keep time spent on the board between 30 and 60 seconds. This is only really useful for linking a lot of very hard moves together and probably isn't what you need to train.

If you want to train pure aerobic cap (beneficial for resting and what most people would probably benefit from) just spend as much time on the wall as possible on really easy stuff, stay on vert to gently overhanging, try and spend half an hour on the wall in a stage of ever so slightly pumped but completely manageable. 

Fitz, you’re exactly where I was at when I “peaked” on my weighted pull-ups. I attribute them to helping me break into 11+ territory. After that I began to focus on fingers and core. Unfortunately I’ve since regressed to a (soft) shell of my former self. This is good motivation to get back on the wagon.

If you have free time go for it, I do think having that explosive power is helpful in bouldering but…I got injured for the first time in my climbing career in September.

 I strained some of the muscles in my ribs, fortunately I have an old person bed because I couldn’t sit upright. Now you are probably wondering what this has to do with pull ups, well I went from being comparable to you ;to not being able to even get halfway in a pull up since I was in so much pain. Three days later I went on a climbing trip. I matched my best onsights and maybe best day of climbing even having lost my ability to do a pull up.

Moral of the story, find softer climbs then it doesn’t matter.

Jon Clark wrote:

As far as nursing a pulley injury and climbing, tape your finger board straight and crack climb or climb off vertical routes where you can find creative ways of not using the finger or loading it too much.

Got to be careful with this one. The other fingers end up taking a greater load and the last thing you want is another hurt finger.

If you drink profusely and eat lots of delicious smoked meats, you can become an all in one weighted vest/person. Saves on gear this way

I think the concept of Power Endurance is baloney. You’re only able to hold onto a hold aerobicly when it is %20 easier than your max. And the only way to hold on longer to that hold is to have a high level of aerobic endurance.

If you are running out of gas on routes, the best way to do better is through high low training. High means focus on your maximum strength with out getting pumped. Powered out rather than pumped out. Low means lots of low output training, ie aerobic endurance on something easy without triggering a pump.

Training power endurance as climbers like to use it is only increasing your tolerance and knowledge about your lactic threshold. While a useful tool, it isn’t effective training.

Your weighted pull-ups idea is a good one as it will increase your maximum strength. 

Knew a dude who physically could not do a pull up and sent 5.14a during that span. Dave Graham famously could (cannot?) not do a 1-armed pull up and climbed V15

For me, personally, core workouts and mobility will improve my climbing far more than weighted pull ups ever would and I don’t know if I can do 20 pull ups with proper form at this stage of my life lol.  I think each individual will dictate the importance of weighted pull ups though, but for someone who can do “20 consecutive pull-ups in the correct form” I see it as a waste of time though as their power is nowhere near a limiting factor for you. Campus boarding (on jug rungs) would be my recommendation anyways, if power is your goal. 

Weighted pullups won't get you up hard Slab.
--
Do weighted pullups train power endurance or strength? I'm leaning towards strength... Have you considered Frenchies? I argue holding the arms bent in the 120, 90, and 45-degree angles for 5 seconds each until failure might offer better benefits than just weighted pullups.

I recently overcame a finger issue. I basically stopped climbing at the gym to get it to recover. During that time I focused on heart rate training cardio and strength training (Bench, Squat, Deadlift, and Shoulder Press). If you're not flexible/mobile then take the time to train that as well.
--

Anyways...  to the OP, thanks for the humble brag.

Campus the crack climb! 

It's hand jams....not an 11 sumthin tips. Cough, cough. 

Gumby King wrote:

Weighted pullups won't get you up hard Slab.

Any recommendations for strengthening the sphincter?