Why do so many people grab the rope when they fall?

Conghui Song wrote:

A sincere question..how grabbing the rope/figure 8 next to your harness will hurt the fingers?

I know that when you are rappelling over a roof and holding onto the rope it is possible to get your hand wedged between the rope and the rock when your feet go below the roof and the rest of your body does not. This happened to me once and now I have learned to do a sort of quick jump and even momentarily speed up the rappel when passing a roof so that my entire body passes the lip in one motion, if that makes sense.

I could see how the same thing could happen in a fall when holding the rope. It could be pretty bad since your fingers would get slammed between the rope and the wall. Of course falling just below a roof could also be bad because you could slam your face into the rock, but maybe if your hands were free you could protect yourself a little.

Conghui Song wrote:

A sincere question..how grabbing the rope/figure 8 next to your harness will hurt the fingers?

The concern is that if while falling you grab the rope a bight (loop) could form and when the rope catches your fall if your finger is in the loop you finger comes off. I have a friend that this actually happened to, fell, grabbed the rope, thumb was caught in the loop and thumb came off. 

Sam Sluys wrote:

The concern is that if while falling you grab the rope a bight (loop) could form and when the rope catches your fall if your finger is in the loop you finger comes off. I have a friend that this actually happened to, fell, grabbed the rope, thumb was caught in the loop and thumb came off. 

Exactly. Here's another accident quoted from this paper:

"During falls, experienced climbers are taught to grab the rope approximately 50 cm away from their harness to stabilize their body during the deceleration phase. While attempting this maneuver, the climber’s right index and middle fingers became entangled in a loop of the rope. The full force of the fall was thus transferred to his middle and index fingers before being distributed by the harness. This caused a near complete amputation of the index finger at the distal interphalangeal joint level. "

I’m not sure what you mean by pros grabbing the rope. Grab the rope at what point in the fall? Climber’s side, or belayer’s side?

 If you mean they hold the hand just above the harness knot in front of them, while the rope is still slack, in the middle of the fall— that could be because they are trying to keep the rope running  the right way (I actually saw someone FIX a rope-behind-the-leg situation in the middle of a very long fall, that was impressive!). But I would say that in a vast majority of falls that I’ve seen, either in online videos, or in real life, nobody was grabbing the rope while falling, certainly not the experienced climbers or “pros”.

If you mean they grab the belayers side of the rope when the fall is finished, as they swing in—that is entirely different, and makes it easier to climb back up

Sam Cook wrote:

Well don't put your leg behind the rope...

We are all guilty of it at some point but if that's the reason someone automatically grabs the rope they other issues to work out. 

Sam Cook wrote:

Well don't put your leg behind the rope...

Do you mean don't let the rope get behind your leg?

Jonathan Cunha wrote:

Sam Cook wrote:

Well don't put your leg behind the rope...

Do you mean don't let the rope get behind your leg?

That's pretty much the same thing. 

I believe what we both mean is don't put your leg between the wall and the rope when above a bolt or piece of gear.     

Lena chita wrote:

I’m not sure what you mean by pros grabbing the rope. Grab the rope at what point in the fall? Climber’s side, or belayer’s side?

 If you mean they hold the hand just above the harness knot in front of them, while the rope is still slack, in the middle of the fall— that could be because they are trying to keep the rope running  the right way (I actually saw someone FIX a rope-behind-the-leg situation in the middle of a very long fall, that was impressive!). But I would say that in a vast majority of falls that I’ve seen, either in online videos, or in real life, nobody was grabbing the rope while falling, certainly not the experienced climbers or “pros”.

If you mean they grab the belayers side of the rope when the fall is finished, as they swing in—that is entirely different, and makes it easier to climb back up

This guy grabbed the rope when he fell. I hear he was pretty experienced:

Lots of rope grabbing here. This one even has a short instructional clip about learning how to fall where the climber does not grab... but the outdoor climbers still often grab the rope.

Sam Cook wrote:

Well don't put your leg behind the rope...

We are all guilty of it at some point but if that's the reason someone automatically grabs the rope they other issues to work out. 

See @whippermedia on IG for many examples of climbers flipping over without having their leg catch on the rope.

Mastering our fears doesn't mean illiminating them. That pesky subconscious has a mind of it's own.

This whole thing is a total non issue.  Someone somewhere broke a finger or maybe even got a finger ripped off but if it did happen it was a total outlier incident.  Then SPI instructor heard about it and decided that grabbing the rope now needs to be incorporated into the course.   Now you have a population of new climbers who are terrified to grab the rope and even more terrified to fall because they might grab the rope and have their hand ripped from their body.  Bottom line, don't worry about it, in fact why don't you put that effort in to not letting the rope get behind your leg while leading.

Rob Cotter wrote:

See @whippermedia on IG for many examples of climbers flipping over without having their leg catch on the rope.

I'm already following that page. I really enjoy watching the content.  

I just rewatched every post from the last month. They showed 5 people flip over. All of which had a rope behind their leg. (And mostly no helmets. Wtf)

Maybe I haven't payed that close of attention.. I'd love to see the ones where they flip without the rope issue if you could point some out. 

Sam Cook wrote:

I'm already following that page. I really enjoy watching the content.  

I just rewatched every post from the last month. They showed 5 people flip over. All of which had a rope behind their leg. (And mostly no helmets. Wtf)

Maybe I haven't payed that close of attention.. I'd love to see the ones where they flip without the rope issue if you could point some out. 

I saw a dude flip over and do a header off a Drytool route at Vail, did he have the rope behind his leg?! Who the f*ck knows…

I always wear a helmet sport ice mixed Drytool I can’t ever remember flipping over but I think I’ve grabbed the rope? It would have to be sport climbing because Drytool I’ve got tools in my hand.

Safer than grabbing the draw.  I’ve flipped the rope out from behind my leg a few times mid air before the catch.  I’m a fan.  Never heard of an injury.  I’m skeptical and would want to see more info.

James W wrote:

Safer than grabbing the draw.  

Safer than putting your finger through the bolt hanger also, but safer than doing something even dumber doesn't mean it's not dumb.

I’ve flipped the rope out from behind my leg a few times mid air before the catch.  

Maybe you're posting on the wrong thread: https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/121349227/the-tall-tale-thread

You never heard of an injury?  There's an article published in a medical journal linked in this thread.

It is very rare and could fall into the freak accident category. But why not try to avoid doing something that is otherwise useless and adds some risk?

Or keep doing it and try to convince ourselves there some reason other than instinctive fear.

aikibujin wrote:

Exactly. Here's another accident quoted from this paper:

"During falls, experienced climbers are taught to grab the rope approximately 50 cm away from their harness to stabilize their body during the deceleration phase. While attempting this maneuver, the climber’s right index and middle fingers became entangled in a loop of the rope. The full force of the fall was thus transferred to his middle and index fingers before being distributed by the harness. This caused a near complete amputation of the index finger at the distal interphalangeal joint level. "

Thank you guys for sharing. Although I don’t have the habit of grabbing the knot, it’s good to know that awful accident can happen while rare.

Just want to highlight the conclusion from the link shared.

The most important prevention of rope-related digital in- juries during a fall might be the use of stiffer ropes, which are less likely to form loops when slack. Old ropes, which can be found in commercial indoor gyms, are often coiled as a result of heavy use and thus pose a possible increased threat to the climber. Climbers should grab the rope during a fall in a controlled manner. Reducing rope slack as well as using new ropes that are less likely to coil up will additionally decrease the like- lihood of major finger injuries.