3 Season Boot fit issues with Petzl's "FIL Flex" semi auto toe bail

Oof that was a wordy title. Has anyone had compatibility issues while using Semi automatic Mountaineering boots (heel bail only) in conjunction with petzl's "FIL Flex" toe bail? I wanted to use this set up for moderate (AI2-3) ice routes but when I test-kicked some wood, the boots popped right up and  kinda through the toe bails making the crampon fit totally sloppy and sketchy regardless of where I set the bail. (see photos, notice how heel comes out of place too) 

I also have some BD aluminum crampons with a toe basket front bail I was able to test and since the basket design was different I didn't have any issues. Does grivel or any other brand make better toe bails that would work with the petzl-pons and 3 season boot?

I had this problem with my Aequilibriums. With Darts, the toe of my boot is 1" off the crampon. I posted about it here:

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/120996988/crampons-for-3-season-boots-with-rockered-soles

I haven't used the boots yet; I plan to buy Irvis hybrids for them. My Leopard aluminum pons fit ok, so I think the solution might be to use the Petzl cord linking setup. Also considering aluminum heels for my Darts instead/in addition, because I think for certain routes I would rather have the more technical front points.

What boots are those?

Bug Boy wrote:

Oof that was a wordy title. Has anyone had compatibility issues while using Semi automatic Mountaineering boots (heel bail only) in conjunction with petzl's "FIL Flex" toe bail? I wanted to use this set up for moderate (AI2-3) ice routes but when I test-kicked some wood, the boots popped right up and  kinda through the toe bails making the crampon fit totally sloppy and sketchy regardless of where I set the bail. (see photos, notice how heel comes out of place too) 

I

I also have some BD aluminum crampons with a toe basket front bail I was able to test and since the basket design was different I didn't have any issues. Does grivel or any other brand make better toe bails that would work with the petzl-pons and 3 season boot?

I have used that same crampon configuration with both scarpa ribelle hd and salewa crows. the difference between that and using that crampon with a stiff boot is night and day. I used to have the Grivel C2M that functions the same way as that petzl bail, except the petzl version is much better. I would just suggest accepting the limitations of that setup. It could be that those boots are too narrow for that bail, or have too much rocker etc. The disadvantage of the removable semiautomatic toe bail is that it can shift a bit, as opposed to a fixed semi auto bail. perhaps using the darts with the cord would be a good compromise? Good luck! 

DeLa Cruce wrote:

I have used that same crampon configuration with both scarpa ribelle hd and salewa crows. the difference between that and using that crampon with a stiff boot is night and day. I used to have the Grivel C2M that functions the same way as that petzl bail, except the petzl version is much better. I would just suggest accepting the limitations of that setup. It could be that those boots are too narrow for that bail, or have too much rocker etc. The disadvantage of the removable semiautomatic toe bail is that it can shift a bit, as opposed to a fixed semi auto bail. perhaps using the darts with the cord would be a good compromise? Good luck! 

I am using the mammut taiss boots which are definitely on the smaller/lighter side of 3 season boots. I think you’re right that this set up may just not be compatible and I will likely have to get crampons with a fixed-semi auto toe bail if I want to make these work. 

I am about to face the same problem.  

Have you tried to use the the flexible linking bar that Petzl offers?  I was also thinking that you could possibly attach some foam to the either the boot or the toe basket to take up the dead space.

Karl Henize wrote:

I am about to face the same problem.  

Have you tried to use the the flexible linking bar that Petzl offers?  I was also thinking that you could possibly attach some foam to the either the boot or the toe basket to take up the dead space.

Honestly, given how the failure is occurring I don’t there is any solution that will be as solid as using crampons that have the two little metal pegs in front. Depending on how tight of a fit you need I’m sure you could rig something up but the toe of your boot will still just be braced against a “flexible” material 

FWIW I have mammut taiss boots and grivel air techs crampons that pair amazingly