Welcome to the Gunks...

Welcome to the Gunks...

Sadly the FB group admin cut off further comments at facebook.com/groups/1459974…

So are the natural features on or off route now??

I really hope this is a joke.

Dude said it was installed on private property.  Unorthodox, and sets a bad example for what's acceptable  -yes.

 Would I do that or even want to climb on it. - No. 

Unless I'm missing something, If they own the land then they can do what they want. 

How many stars does the route have?

With every comment I read I think "Erik Phillips can't possibly be more of a tool." Then I read his next comment.

Glad to see climbers scream at each other on faceybook too. 

This is certainly not the way to “introduce” hikers/new people to climbing outdoors as the post on FB claims.   I know it’s private property, but it’s still very sad to see this anywhere let alone here at the Gunks. 

Not to get political, but this checks out...

jms wrote:

This is certainly not the way to “introduce” hikers/new people to climbing outdoors as the post on FB claims.   I know it’s private property, but it’s still very sad to see this anywhere let alone here at the Gunks. 

it’s appalling but it’s not really the gunks. i used to love that side of the road and went pretty often, never saw that rock because it’s someone’s backyard. 

the temperature got a little too heated in that thread because the dude was being ridiculous and obviously has no clue. 

If it's on private property, why worry? Let people have the climb they want to. I'm sure the route could have great movement if set correctly. 

And it would truly ease the gym to crag transition.

Edit to Ben:

What a tool, man bun and all. He climbs 12s so its ok, plus where else are the beginners gonna learn???

Ben Silver wrote:

With every comment I read I think "Erik Phillips can't possibly be more of a tool." Then I read his next comment.

This was the showstopper to me, a veritable word salad inclusive of the emotions of a rock and how to increase your Zestimate™ .

Erik Phillips

Daniel Chode Rider wrote:

And it would truly ease the gym to crag transition.

If Chumley from Pawn Stars can randomly jump on some 5.8 at Red Rocks with no experience I don't think we need jugs installed on outdoor walls for gumbies.

They could probably add some volumes

James Arnold wrote:

This was the showstopper to me, a veritable word salad..

Erik Phillips wrote

… Otherwise, it would just be a sad rock with a single 5.11+ that only a few experts could climb….

I would say NOW it’s a sad rock.  It was once bold and natural, the way it had been shaped by millions of years of whatever nature threw at it.  

Then in an instant of mind boggling cowardice and hubris, it’s been made into an “adventure” for the weak and stupid.   Like putting a little knit sweater and a hat on some ex-military war hero German Shepard to make it “cute” for a party. 

Sure it’s legal to do what they want on their own property, but it’s also legal to judge them as idiots for doing it. 

la climber wrote:

Oh, it's possible, and we've not even started.

It's their property and they can do what they want.  I might add that their property extends to the top of the main cliff and they can do anything they want to that too. They profess no interest in such modifications at the present time, although installing a permanent rap line was mentioned as something they're thinking about, so I wouldn't be at all sure what they might want to do for the "entertainment" of their guests going forward. My experience with such things suggests that they are almost always a platform for more such "improvements" rather than an isolated blemish, and this possibly against the intentions of the original "developers."

It's their property and they can do what they want.  Let's remember they could close off their entire section of the cliff and the trail below it.

It's their property and they can do what they want, but it is totally absurd to bolt holds and install draws on a 35-foot boulder on their property when they are literally in the midst of one of the nation's premier trad climbing crags with opportunities for absolutely every range of experience and ability.  There is nothing that they can provide for their guests that isn't far exceeded by natural opportunities literally next door, and the example provided and attitude instilled by bringing people to this boulder are both antithetical to everything the Gunks in particular and trad climbing in general has stood for.  To the extent that their guests are entertained by this, they are creating a demographic with expectations and attitudes and, ultimately, demands that run against an entire genre of climbing.  The idea of making the outdoors more "accessible" by turning it into a pale reflection of the indoors is monumentally ass-backwards.

It's their property and they can do what they want, in this case creating a diminished experience for guests---with the real thing right around the corner---and a deep affront to the prevailing local ethic.

But It's their property and they can do what they want.

My hope is that they will think about the meager benefits to their guests compared with the distress inflicted on a community that apparently stretches at least out to Boulder and take the whole mess down.  Maybe build an indoor climbing wall if they think it will enhance the guest experience.

Daniel Chode Rider wrote:

If it's on private property, why worry? Let people have the climb they want to. I'm sure the route could have great movement if set correctly. 

And it would truly ease the gym to crag transition.

Is easing the transition a good idea? If the goal is for newer climbers to eventually climb independently outside, does this make them safer? More ethical?

I'd argue the exact opposite.

we will never know how much of this was their idea and how much was the guy they trusted to ‘tastefully’ bolt on horrendously ugly concrete discs. they don’t seem like climbers because how could they be proud of that slipshod job?

the ‘it’s their land and they can do what they want’ certainly comes in to play with the vigilantism displayed in the thread. “Is someone going to be the ‘hero’” to chop the bolts? 

this could easily not end well. 

Wow, I can't believe I read that entire Facebook thread. I also can't believe that person who drilled on those concrete holds could defend his position so passionately.  Even if it was done out of ignorance,  or hubris,  or greed,  there should be a point where a reasonable person recognizes that perhaps they made a mistake...  

W K wrote:

They could probably add some volumes

Auto belays are what is really missing, maybe that and some speakers to drown out the Harleys and fans cause it gets really hot.