Camp photon is junk

This is the second camp photon issue i have seen.  
This was my only photon luckily.
This was a backup piece in a roof crack.  Took/fell on it a few times.  Gate was bent around side of nose of biner.  

My buddy bent the bottom of the biner nearly flat (it likely had open gate and nearly broke).  

The gates open too easily on these and camp nano 22.  Biners with a protected nose are much safer ( like a WC helium, DMM chimera/alpha trad, BD oz with wire gate protector).

This is a dangerous biner.  

Unfortunately many people and many partners own these.  
people like them because they are light and cheap. Unfortunately, as is almost always true, you get what you pay for.

Please stop buying these, I really don’t want to use these anymore and partners often have them.  
I really want the photon and nano 22 to be great. They are so light and cheap, but the nose is not protected and the gates open when rubbing against the rock. The nose is very narrow compared to the gate. This leads them to open in unwanted situations. 

I misused my $8 ultralight life-saving equipment, and now it’s broken!

Yeah, the gates are not very strong on those. I've seen plenty that barely close. I wouldn't buy photons for my personal use. However, if the rope is pushing your gate open, then you have the carabiner sitting in a bad spot. Sounds like you needed more extension.

Early Photons had a very light gate spring.   I have a ton of early photons but still use them.   I’ve been buying newer photons that have a much stiffer gate and haven’t had any issues with them or the early ones for that matter.  I have broken biners before just through normal abuse of climbing but I just chalk that up to climbing beats the crap out of your equipment and every so often yer gunna break stuff.  I’ve broken cams before too during falls but I would never say that cam sucks and is dangerous because it broke after taking a big fall on it.  Sometimes crap happens.  

Hmmm.   I don’t have any Photons, so I have no first hand experience with them, but I’m unsure why from the OP post, people are jumping on the “he mis-used them” bandwagon.  How so??

I think the key point he is describing - that the gate is wider than the nose, and thus prone to snagging or opening, is a valid concern and potential design flaw if true.  

Is it true?  (At least for some vintages?)

If so, I’d recommend tossing them off your rack as well.  

Mark Pilate wrote:

Hmmm.   I don’t have any Photons, so I have no first hand experience with them, but I’m unsure why from the OP post, people are jumping on the “he mis-used them” bandwagon.  How so??

I'd say if your carabiners are being dragged across the rock when you pass a roof, you probably need more extension. This might not be practical in every situation, but I still think its worth considering. If you can't adequately extend your gear under the roof, maybe consider using a locker (to help keep the gate in place). Once again, on a hard route this isn't super realistic, but using a carabiner with well-known super weak gate action is a pretty bad option.

It also looks like the photon is not on a long runner, but rather a dogbone. I wonder if it got sucked up into the crack and the gate was forced open and bent that way. I still think additional extension would likely have helped this carabiner not get bent/broken.

TLDR: The photons have weak gate action and suck, but extending placements adequately is still important.

Mark Pilate wrote:

Hmmm.   I don’t have any Photons, so I have no first hand experience with them, but I’m unsure why from the OP post, people are jumping on the “he mis-used them” bandwagon.  How so??

If you plan on whipping and hang dogging maybe buy some burlier gear. These are among the lightest weight full size wiregates available. This is a classic example of using something outside of its design intent.

It’s the difference between revving the piss out of your Hayabusa vs revving the piss out of your Harley. One of them is meant for it, and the other might explode if you do it too many times.

Keep in mind that even with the gate open, it’s still not going to break unless it’s loaded over an edge (which is user error). You’ll never generate 7kN climbing.

Edit to add: the new CAMP wiregates have stronger tension. If you have old ones that have weak tension I’m sure you could contact CAMP and discuss replacement.

What??? You fall and hang on your gear?  

We got a badass here.

My current gen photos seem fine but I've definitely had bad experiences with very weak gate tension plus misaligned gates similar to your first picture.   

I use mostly dyons now and for what's it worth haven't had issues with my nano 22s.  Maybe less leverage being a smaller biner.   

Demetri V wrote:

If you plan on whipping and hang dogging maybe buy some burlier gear. 

Just curious, what else are carabiners for? Decoration? Keychain? Dog leash?

Agree with OP 100%. I've had the same issues with the photons and have stopped buying them. The nanos are much better in my experience.

Never had this problem with nanos....

I have photons on all of my cams. They're light weight and easy to manipulate. I have had this issue happen before. I was able to snap the gate back into place and it was good to go again.....

A V wrote:

Don’t fifi into these biners - saw one of these gates pop and cause a dude to whip on C1 because of it

Why would a gate opening cause a fifi to pop causing a fall???  I’ve fifi’d into Photons hundreds of times and never had an issue.    

OP should contact the Hownotohighline folks to test this vs other carabiners, would be interesting.

I have most of my cams racked on photons, I’ve used them for 2-3 years, so far no issue. My partner has a BD biner whose gate popped open like this while he was trying to use it to take out a stuck cam (don’t ask me how, it didn’t work). Point is, this could happen to any biner with this type of nose when used inappropriately. A nose that wraps the gate inside like DMM chimera of course prevents this type of issue, but it’s also more than twice as expensive. 

A protected nose design on a wiregate (Chimera, Helium, Oz) does not prevent this, it makes it a bit less likely. It can still happen. Wires have a lot of play and can be forced easily by hand... while the forces that can be generated while climbing, or falling, are much higher. Solid gates are harder to force by hand, but it has still happened before to people.

I've exclusively used photons and nanos on my rack (more nanos the past few years for weight) since 2015 and have never had any issues with them not working as designed.  FWIW, I'm weak enough that I fall on my gear quite frequently.  The one time I managed to break one was using it to clip an oversized bolt puller to a glue-in.  We tried a neutrino next and got the same result. (broken neutrino)

I still have my c4s racked on old (pre-2014ish) photons with the ‘flat’ nose (zero gate protection). Any people had problems with that edition? For racking biners no issues but definitely have less gate coverage than even the model pictured. 

I don't own Photons, but I have lots of flaccid gate problems with the (older) Nano 23s and less but some with the 22s (which typically still weigh 23 grams, BD mini wires are better), I barely trust Nanos anymore for racking cams. I find Camp stuff light and cheap, what was the third criterion again?

A V wrote:

He fifi’d into the biner, top stepped to another placement, and as he was top stepping with his fifi sliding up the biner gate - the gate popped and his fifi popped out - causing a fall and broken/dislocated finger.

He was right below me when it happened, so I had a perfect bird eyes view of it happening. He was hauling butt up the pitch somewhat hastily - leading to the fifi being on the gate side rather than on the spine side. It was a camp photon - honestly I think other biners wouldn’t have failed in this way - but still an error on the leaders part for sliding his fifi in a riskier way than he should have (personally if I’m fifi-ing into a wiregate for some reason - I always make sure it’s on the spine side - even if it’s a keylocked design).

That makes sense but that would happen with almost any wire gate not just a Photon.