How do you manage your hot drill bits?

I've just started learning how to drill, and am helping to replace old bolts at a local crag and something i've never thought of or dealt with before. How hot the bits are! In my construction jobs we swap bits to not wear them out too fast, but I'm on the ground. So I just take them out and set them aside. Now I'm finding myself way off the deck juggling multiple bits that are scalding hot. I was just keeping them in the back pocket of my jeans, but by the end of the day they had burned through the pocket. (I also ended up burning the heck out of my arm, but that's just user error.) So, how do you manage the bits?

Oh, and I'm just terrified of searing through my rope. Is there any fix for that or is it just, "Be extra careful around your rope." 

Thanks for the advice. 

Take your time.  If the drill bits are getting that hot, slow down.  You'll ruin the temper in the bit if you overheat them too much.

Back off on pushing too hard too.

Just go slower? interesting. I've always just gone as fast as I could when drilling bolt holes or rebar holes at work. But again, I just swap out bits regularly while doing that. How long should a hole take? for a titanium glue in. I think like, five inches deep? 

it gets fun when you are drilling on lead. if its gripping enough you hardly even notice when it burns your leg ;)

I don’t swap out bits.   I can get 30-40 holes on a single bit depending on the bolt.  If I’m using a five piece I can get 20 easily.  If I’m using stainless wedge I can get easily 40 on a single bit and sometimes more.    Swapping out bits is something I’ve only recently started hearing people do, I’m sure it can help some but not worth the hassle to me.  As far as hot bits go?  Call Russ at Fish gear and have a bolt bag made.  You can toss hot bits in without worry.  

I asked the Hilti Tech this question.  He said you can just spray water on them and/or into the hole. I'm sure you can figure out a way to carry water with you.  

I never need to swap bits because I'm using a slow-gel glue (20min gel time) so I can drill/brush/blow/glue/bolt and jug to the next placement.   Thus, the bit has time to cool between holes.   

I'm drilling limestone, much easier and cooler than granite, which helps too.  I assume you realize that letting the bit get too hot destroys the bit?   This is what happens if you let them get too hot.  The carbide blades are gone.

John Byrnes wrote:

I asked the Hilti Tech this question.  He said you can just spray water on them and/or into the hole. I'm sure you can figure out a way to carry water with you.  

I never need to swap bits because I'm using a slow-gel glue (20min gel time) so I can drill/brush/blow/glue/bolt and jug to the next placement.   Thus, the bit has time to cool between holes.   

I'm drilling limestone, much easier and cooler than granite, which helps too.  I assume you realize that letting the bit get too hot destroys the bit?   This is what happens if you let them get too hot.  The carbide blades are gone.

Yeah, I knew that from construction experience. It's why I was swapping bits between holes. We use  the Hilti 500 v3 and the work time isn't that longest in the world, so we drill, blow, brush, all the holes before going back and glueing in the bolts. 

a water bottle might be nice. maybe kill 2 birds with 1 stone, keep a bit in an old nalgene full of water, and just swap them out between holes.

John Byrnes wrote:

I asked the Hilti Tech this question.  He said you can just spray water on them and/or into the hole. I'm sure you can figure out a way to carry water with you.  

I never need to swap bits because I'm using a slow-gel glue (20min gel time) so I can drill/brush/blow/glue/bolt and jug to the next placement.   Thus, the bit has time to cool between holes.   

I'm drilling limestone, much easier and cooler than granite, which helps too.  I assume you realize that letting the bit get too hot destroys the bit?   This is what happens if you let them get too hot.  The carbide blades are gone.

I’ve been putting up routes for 35 years and have never seen a bit do that.   I have had the carbide blade come off a few cheap bits but have never seen that kind of rounding.    What brand bits are you using and are they sds bits?

I've drilled in a lot of different rock types with a pretty wide spectrum of drills (hand drill up to the old Bosch Annihilator) over the years and think it's worth noting that sometimes rock type can influence drill performance in ways you wouldn't expect. Sometimes using a lower-powered drill will yield better results with respect to bit longevity. 

We used to drill in a very specific type of quartzite in NC that would absolutely destroy bits with the old 24-volt Annihilator; sometimes we used more bits than bolts, but the average was usually about 1 bolt/bit (luckily these were mixed routes). However, much to our surprise, greater success was had with the lower-powered 12-volt Panasonic I had; we could usually get ~ 4 bols/bit with this drill. What we found was the higher power caused the bits to burn up. Presumably due to the heat capacity of that rock type. We had similar problems with the (somewhat metamorphosed) sandstone/siltstone in southwest VA. FYI: I used to try squirting water in the hole and/or on the bit and found no evidence of improved bit life.

I'd say these instances are the exception, as more power is usually better, but it is certainly worth considering if your bits are burning up.

I must be really lucky, I’ve been using Bosch bits with my Bosch 18v rotary impact drill.   I typically drill in quartz monzonite and limestone or marble.   I have never had to change a bit after a few holes let alone one hole.   I usually use the same bit for multiple routes before ditching it.   I had a friend that was burning through bits before he realized his drill wasn’t a hammer drill, don’t know how you spend money on a drill and not realize that?  Other guys I know also had non sds style drills and they would burn through bits too.   Right tool for the right job.  

Ryan Bond wrote:

I've just started learning how to drill, and am helping to replace old bolts at a local crag and something i've never thought of or dealt with before. How hot the bits are! In my construction jobs we swap bits to not wear them out too fast, but I'm on the ground. So I just take them out and set them aside. Now I'm finding myself way off the deck juggling multiple bits that are scalding hot. I was just keeping them in the back pocket of my jeans, but by the end of the day they had burned through the pocket. (I also ended up burning the heck out of my arm, but that's just user error.) So, how do you manage the bits?

Oh, and I'm just terrified of searing through my rope. Is there any fix for that or is it just, "Be extra careful around your rope." 

Thanks for the advice. 

Hi Ryan,

I have a dedicated pouch to hold all my drill bits with separate compartments stitched into the fabric to segregate bits by diameter. The pouch has a flap and it rolls up so bits don't fall out and it goes into a side rigging bag for storage. I can use the flap to switch out hot bits and it does n't matter if the bit goes into the pouch hot either.

The drill chuck should be kept lubricated to reduce energy consumption and reduce wear so the pouch addresses another issue; chuck grease going over everything else!

Cheers,

Francis

Just carry a 20oz soda bottle with water clipped to your harness or a sling and put a hole in the cap just big enough to stick the bit into. Fill it up to the top before you set off and quench the bit every time the bit is hot. The more often the better. No matter how hard the rock or concrete I usually quench after 5 seconds. Maybe its not worth it if you are using cheap bits but if you are using four flute drills, it pays off for sure. Im also a machinist, so I like to keep things cool when I can, even if its not for lubrication. Spit on it if you have too.... like a gentleman.  

Might have to experiment with a 12-volt in the quartzite. Seen quite a few bits with the carbide broken off and the ensuing nubby ends. I think the carbide ends up in the bottom of the hole and it doesn't take much continued hammering for the remaining steel to deform. Hilti cross tipped bits have a less robust attachment and break the easiest, ime.

Kinda spendy, but I really like the Petzl Bolt Bag for managing hot bits. I'm never completely comfortable with leaving the bit in the drill dangling from my harness, so I typically remove the bit after drilling a hole. The attachment loop allows the bag to hang open, allowing bits to air cool while the top flap protects from inadvertent contact. Two bit slots make it easy to switch out for another when one gets hot in hard rock. The "power slot" on the opposite side of the bag is larger and can holds extra bits, brushes, and what have you. Beware, there are holes in the corner of the main compartment to facilitate drainage. Easy enough to seal up the tough vinyl if these don't make sense. The inner, velcro pouch or the outer slots can hold the items that would slip out of the drainage holes. YMMV, but mine has held up well.

I just attach my drill to my belay loop with a long sling(I think it my be a 4ft sling) and then it dangles below my feet. I don’t move my feet that much when I’m hammering or blowing out the hole so it doesn’t really bother me. You can make a rope bag for your rope as you rappel to protect it but I just coil my rope around my right leg. Also I would recommend using a rope you don’t care about. It is very very easy to totally core shot the whole rope with a 1lb rock.

Ryan Bond wrote:

Yeah, I knew that from construction experience. It's why I was swapping bits between holes. We use  the Hilti 500 v3 and the work time isn't that longest in the world, so we drill, blow, brush, all the holes before going back and glueing in the bolts. 

I use the Hilti RE500 V3 too.  The gel time, the time you have before it starts to set, is about 20 minutes depending on temperature.  Seems to me you could take your time drilling... just sayin'.  

a water bottle might be nice. maybe kill 2 birds with 1 stone, keep a bit in an old nalgene full of water, and just swap them out between holes.

How deep are the holes and what are you drilling in?

Also while more complicated, you could use two ropes. You attach a rope that you rap the route on and then another on the other adjacent route you want to rebolt later. You can attach your tools to the other line that way you don’t have all the weight on your harness the whole time and it keeps the drill away from you. The main issue is you will need to move the tools down as you descend and if you forget you have to reascend your rope. It also helps to have an extra line if the top of the cliff is sharp (the real threat in developing is your rope getting trashed and shearing above you). This way you have a back up line option and or a redirection if the route wanders. All this adds to the complexity of route developing but route developing tends to create complex problems.

Kevin Mokracek wrote:

I’ve been putting up routes for 35 years and have never seen a bit do that.   I have had the carbide blade come off a few cheap bits but have never seen that kind of rounding.    What brand bits are you using and are they sds bits?

I destroyed these two 3/8" bits, the only two I've ever destroyed, on the same hole!   I think one was a Hilti "X" bit, the other something else.  I posted this a couple of years ago, btw.  I think the title is "Drilling really hard rock" or something like that.   

I had aided a rising traverse from the anchors of the neighboring route and was hanging from some very dubious temporary lead sleeves, looking at a really bad pendulum into a dihedral, so I was more interested in getting a bolt in than saving the bits.  The island is white compact limestone but, here and there, there are areas that are more like marble, and I wanted to put in a route in one of these areas.  The rock is unlike anything you've ever climbed on -- very attractive to put a route on.  (And I did the next year by rapping in from the top.)

Anyway, the drill went in normally about an inch, then just stopped.   I kept drilling until I realized nothing was happening.   When I pulled the bit out, it was rounded off.   I put on the back-up bit... same story.  Had to reverse the traverse.   When I got home I called Hilti, who's main advice was keeping the bits cool and being patient.   He confirmed that the failure mode, losing the blades, was due to the bits getting too hot.

CTB wrote:

 I like to keep things cool when I can, even if its not for lubrication. Spit on it if you have too.... like a gentleman.  

Oooo!  Sexy!

John Byrnes wrote:

I use the Hilti RE500 V3 too.  The gel time, the time you have before it starts to set, is about 20 minutes depending on temperature.  Seems to me you could take your time drilling... just sayin'.  

How deep are the holes and what are you drilling in?

You're getting 20 minutes? I....need to stop gluing in summer. 

and the hole depth is about 4 inches.

Ryan Bond wrote:

You're getting 20 minutes? I....need to stop gluing in summer. 

and the hole depth is about 4 inches.

Could buy RE500 if available? The reaction times (gel and cure) are somewhat slower than the V3.

Keeping the packs cool / out of sunlight is something you're probably doing already.

jonathan knight wrote:

Might have to experiment with a 12-volt in the quartzite. Seen quite a few bits with the carbide broken off and the ensuing nubby ends. I think the carbide ends up in the bottom of the hole and it doesn't take much continued hammering for the remaining steel to deform. Hilti cross tipped bits have a less robust attachment and break the easiest, ime.

Kinda spendy, but I really like the Petzl Bolt Bag for managing hot bits. I'm never completely comfortable with leaving the bit in the drill dangling from my harness, so I typically remove the bit after drilling a hole. The attachment loop allows the bag to hang open, allowing bits to air cool while the top flap protects from inadvertent contact. Two bit slots make it easy to switch out for another when one gets hot in hard rock. The "power slot" on the opposite side of the bag is larger and can holds extra bits, brushes, and what have you. Beware, there are holes in the corner of the main compartment to facilitate drainage. Easy enough to seal up the tough vinyl if these don't make sense. The inner, velcro pouch or the outer slots can hold the items that would slip out of the drainage holes. YMMV, but mine has held up well.

Yeah the bits go purple when drilling hard rock! 

I carry a magnet pen in one of my petzl tool bags to easily fish the broken head out.

The Hilti cross head bits are intended for drilling into reinforced concrete with lower in-hole cutting temperatures versus natural stone, which is why they tend to overheat versus a traditional 2 blade bit. Contacting rebar with a blade style bit causes it to jam instantly but the drill keeps turning and so to the driller. Net result can be broken wrists hence a 4 cutting head which won't jam.

How well does the Petzl Bolt Bag resist hot bits given the material is TPU?