Advice on Heel Lift in Double Boots + insole advice

I’ve been grappling with a pair of LS Baruntses for ages, and have heat molded them like 4 times so far. My foot is a little bit wider than normal, but my heel is normal.

I have two pairs of insoles I’ve been trying with these superfeet Red (same size as green, just insulated), and Superfeet carbon, which are low volume and which I use in the trail runners. With red, I don’t have any heel lift but my toes and forefoot are a little squished. With carbon, my toes and forefoot feel perfect but I have heel lift and my feet slide forward when walking downhill. 

I’ve been doing my heat molding with the insole in the boot, and by putting on toecaps and multiple layers of socks. Is this boot just not destined to work out, or is there anything else I can do?

My sneaker size is a 12. I have these in a 47. My scarpa mont Blancs are a size 47 and they fit perfect.

I considered visiting the mountaineer in Keene Valley, or another boot fitter in my area (Greg Pier, apparently one of the best), but I think I may need to try another boot.

Any advice?

Ankle booties? 

https://www.ezeefitsports.com/category-s/1865.htm 

Might take up the space so your heel can't lift or slide forward. 

four heat molds trying to get it right? kind of smells like you bought them a half size too big. 

you can look for heel shims online. a bunch of companies sell products like that and you could experiment and get it dialed in before the winter if you’re close. 

or if you have the means at least try on the smaller size. if it’s a revelation you might save yourself some annoyance and you could sell these before they’re trashed and oddly modded out. 

Matt N wrote:

Ankle booties? 

https://www.ezeefitsports.com/category-s/1865.htm 

Might take up the space so your heel can't lift or slide forward. 

Thanks! I’ll definitely look into that. Ideally I’d want to find all in one solution, meaning another boot. None of my other boots have had these problems, I guess I just need to find something else. But the market for double boots is not like the market for running shoes. Might have to order those. Thanks 

The “multiple pairs of socks” seems off to me. Intuition sells a home fitting kit which comes with an extremely thin sock, like pantyhose thin. You may be leaving yourself too much room when you do the heat molding.

My Baruntses require attention to lacing, or I get some heel lift. 

Arnav V wrote:

Thanks! I’ll definitely look into that. Ideally I’d want to find all in one solution, meaning another boot. None of my other boots have had these problems, I guess I just need to find something else. But the market for double boots is not like the market for running shoes. Might have to order those. Thanks 

ah, i didnt realize it was a double boot. I'll amend my suggestion because that opens up options. If you look into ski bootfitting, you can find stuff like these that can get attached to the outer layer of the boots that could keep the ankle down within the shell:

https://www.tognar.com/boot-fitting-foam-c-pads-2prs/

or

https://www.tognar.com/boot-fitting-foam-ankle-wrap-pads-1-8-pr/

it is also possible to use that in conjunction with something else just over the back of the ankle that could be epoxied into place.

I did miss the part about two pairs of socks though. That sounds terrible, and like you are in the wrong shell. One quality midweight wool sock is all you should need, and toe caps are great for heat molding but to wear them? I have never heard of that.

Get some adjustable orthopedic heel lifts and try them with the carbon.

If you’re a 12 and a in a 47, I think you’re too big. I’m a 12.5-13 and a 47 in all sportiva mountain boots. 13 in street shoes, Chacos, ect

First off, the Palau liner in the Baruntse is not nearly as thick as a ski boot liner so heat molding won't do that much for you.   Now you can punch out shells, but I don't think that's your issue.

I agree that you are probably in the wrong size boot.   If the boot is too large for you then the width of your foot won't be in the proper location within the boots.   For high altitude boots I recommend sizing up a half size at most from street and wearing thin socks.    I personally wear a size 42.5 G2SM when guiding Denali which is the same as my street shoe.   But everyone has different feet.

petzl logic wrote:

ah, i didnt realize it was a double boot. I'll amend my suggestion because that opens up options. If you look into ski bootfitting, you can find stuff like these that can get attached to the outer layer of the boots that could keep the ankle down within the shell:

https://www.tognar.com/boot-fitting-foam-c-pads-2prs/

or

https://www.tognar.com/boot-fitting-foam-ankle-wrap-pads-1-8-pr/

it is also possible to use that in conjunction with something else just over the back of the ankle that could be epoxied into place.

I did miss the part about two pairs of socks though. That sounds terrible, and like you are in the wrong shell. One quality midweight wool sock is all you should need, and toe caps are great for heat molding but to wear them? I have never heard of that.

Hi, I meant the fact that I did the heat molding with two pairs of socks to ensure adequate space for my toes. The problem was with a thin superfeet insole, I get heel lift. With a superfeet green insole, I don’t get heel lift but my toes are cramped. When climbing, I use a single pair of darn toughs. 

CalvinM wrote:

First off, the Palau liner in the Baruntse is not nearly as thick as a ski boot liner so heat molding won't do that much for you.   Now you can punch out shells, but I don't think that's your issue.

I agree that you are probably in the wrong size boot.   If the boot is too large for you then the width of your foot won't be in the proper location within the boots.   For high altitude boots I recommend sizing up a half size at most from street and wearing thin socks.    I personally wear a size 42.5 G2SM when guiding Denali which is the same as my street shoe.   But everyone has different feet.

Hi. For the G2SMs, what insole do you use? For the baruntses im trying to make work, if I use a thin superfeet carbon, I have enough space for my foot but heel lift. When I use superfeet green/red (which I use for hiking boots and single boots), I’m squished in the toes but don’t have heel lift. I was actually thinking they were too small, because all my other boots are fine with that insole 

Allen Sanderson wrote:

Get some adjustable orthopedic heel lifts and try them with the carbon.

Thanks! I looked into that and it sounds promising. Will definitely check it out.

La Sportiva Nepal Extremes come with removable tongue inserts, I think you can buy these separately too or call Sportiva. I have a set of these and they have really helped to reduce heel lift on a variety of alpine boots sometimes as a stand alone fix, or sometimes in combination with insoles.  

Erik Harz wrote:

La Sportiva Nepal Extremes come with removable tongue inserts, I think you can buy these separately too or call Sportiva. I have a set of these and they have really helped to reduce heel lift on a variety of alpine boots sometimes as a stand alone fix, or sometimes in combination with insoles.  

I have been thinking about this, can you explain how you’re using these tongue inserts? Pics maybe?