How many quickdraws and slings do you typically rack?

On a typical route that you haven’t climbed before and you haven’t read anything unusual about like very wandering, how many quickdraws and alpine draws in any combination do you normally rack for multi pitch routes like at Tahquitz or Yosemite?

I’ve been climbing trad for 2.5 years now and I’m slowly working on trimming up my typical rack and making it more efficient. Currently this is what I typically rack

8 quickdraws (25mm long dyneema dogbones)
4 Shoulder length dyneem alpine draws
1 Double length dyneem sling

I feel like it’s a little much but I use most of them for at least half the pitches. Maybe I just use them because I have them. Even when a section is pretty straight, I lean towards adding a floppy dyneema quickdraw. I never like climbing past the piece and seeing the rope pulling taut on the cam. 

Sounds about right. I have 12 quick draws, and 6 alpine draws, plus one double sling. What I take on any particular route varies.

I’ll bring anywhere from 6-12 alpine draws.  Haven’t seen a reason to bring anything different, as that allows the full range of extension.  I’ve tried the slings around the neck thing but honestly it’s a pain when you’re wearing a helmet.

HUGE Tradifan wrote: Get ready for every answer possible.

I carry 10 trad draws and 2 long ones for anchors or if there's a zig zag.

Stop using quickdraws for trad.

Why do you say stop using qd’s for trad?

I get the reasoning behind not using sport draws because they’re so short and stiff that they don’t really help with minimizing rope drag much because they’re short and may not help as much with preventing walking because they’re stiff

Are there other reasons? 

I use pretty long, floppy qd’s on fairly straight sections to prevent walking. 25mm long dyneema

Either too many or not enough, depending on the climb.

I also use quick draws along with alpines though so I'm a heathen. 

Having “quickdraws for trad” is perfectly normal.

The question of how many draws: I wouldn’t over think it but the question is [always] “it depends.”
Think you’ll be linking pitches? Or placing more gear because you’re climbing at your limit? More draws.
Anyways, full day route with a ridge traverse to the summit, I’ll take 14 including a couple QD. 

Depends on what the route looks like from the bottom. Anywhere from 4 to 8 shoulder length alpine draws. Anywhere from 2 to 6 double length alpine draws. I never bring quickdraws for trad climbing because I don't see any when in which the inability to extend it could be considered beneficial. 

"Why do you say stop using qd’s for trad?"

I'm kind of a gumby so feel free to ignore or ridicule. :D

Personally, I have 7 alpine draws and bring them as part of my standard rack.  

They are all lighter than QDs and the do the same thing.  So I'd rather just bring those instead of heavier things that are less functional.... my QDs are all pretty beefy things.  Just cause I am lazy, not cause I climb hard.

I will bring extra QDs if I want more stuff, just cause I have them and a finite amount of alpine draws..

Whatever works though.  At some points I only had about 8 QDs, and so I'd use alpine draws on sport climbs.

FWIW, I also general bring a pair of extra 120cm slings that each have a single carabiner on them.  Lately I've also been playing with a pair of 30cm nylon "draws"... they are longer than draws which is nice, but I don't have to extend them to make them longer and they are short enough that the seem to carry okay on my harness... they were like, $2.50ea for the runners, so it's a cheap experiment.

Matt Wetmore wrote: Either too many or not enough, depending on the climb.

I also use quick draws along with alpines though so I'm a heathen. 

I prefer savage.   

Keep in mind granite cracks have very different requirements for rope management than East Coast quartzite roofs and traverses like at Moore’s wall and the Gunks. Here in N.C. we have a lot of routes where you have both direct placements clipped on a single biner and also 4ft runners around roofs. Just depends on the demands of the pitch and what you need to do with the rope line.  

I’ve been wondering about this as well. I’ve been using a combination of alpine draws and some Petzl spirits, usually about 6 of each, it has worked fine for now but I’ve noticed some of the issues mentioned above with the spirits.

Does anyone have a preferred “all around” draw? I’ve been climbing mostly trad but would like to have the option to climb sport as well, without needing two different sets. 

5 or 10 spectra 20 cm qiuckdraws and 8 to 10 60 cm spectra alpine draws.  I have more of each type which I can throw into the pack if I think i need something else.

I like the quick draws because they are both lighter and more compact.  Often there is no reason for a longer extension because three or more placements are in a line.

I no longer use 120 cm runners.  They are too bulky and clumsy.  If i need a longer extension i will either use 2 alpine draws or a quickdraw and an alpine draw. 

climber pat wrote:
I like the quick draws because they are both lighter and more compact.  Often there is no reason for a longer extension because three or more placements are in a line.
 

This is my reason for quick draws. Mine really are not well suited for hard sport climbing because they’re so long and floppy. 

This is my typical set up. Sometimes I might swap out 2 quick draws for 2 alpine draws depending on the route. I guess I’ll keep my system as is until something better suits me. From the replies, my set up doesn’t seem too weird.    

What’s really weird is when you go to a sport crag and bust out your 6 helium draws and 8 helium alpines...
It’s like wearing a sign that says, “That’s right! I’m not sending as hard as you, Mr. DMM electro-spirits!”

You can never have too many slings!

Nice topic!

I've never climb in those places. But if I take the question as "my average onsight trad quickdraw setup for a typical climb"...

I only carry alpines (shoulder length typically, but sometimes a few doubles if some obvious meandering in the crack). I don't see an advantage for sports draws vs alpines. However it's clear that alpines are more versatile. For 9+/10s (in my case), weight isn't the limiting factor. Instead of placing a sport draw, I would just clip the cam direct & not extent it. Nuts needs a draw anyways, but then I wouldn't place a sport draw on nuts. I may be a bit over zealous, but I rather err on the side of more extension rather than less for nuts. The alpine is longer and more flexible to absorb rope pulls.

Another nice thing about using only alpines, imo, is that it simplifies everything to have only 1 type of draws (or rather 2 with should/double lengths). I just like to manage less stuff, in general.

As for numbers, I may not extend cams that are well in line with the crack/general climb direction. So typically 8-12 alpines. Depends on route length mostly. A little bit about my mental state. If I just want to do a nice, mellow climb, I tend to bring more gear rather than less.

Sport, as many QDs as needed plus a couple single runners.

Indian Creek, a couple single runners which are rarely used.

Eldo about 12 single runners and a double or two which are often used up in a pitch.

Elsewhere varies on the alignment of the protection.

D B wrote:  

This is my typical set up. Sometimes I might swap out 2 quick draws for 2 alpine draws depending on the route. I guess I’ll keep my system as is until something better suits me. From the replies, my set up doesn’t seem too weird.    

Don, here's my question to you: Do those LONG quickdraws ever bug you or get caught on stuff? I notice that they're longer than your shortened alpine draws. Given that a 60 cm sling is 30 long in practical application and you've got 25 CM QDs you're not really losing any significant length as an extension. But my hunch is those are long enough they might bug me on the harness, hitting my legs and such.

I tend to climb with about a dozen total draws. Mostly it's 8 or so alpines (60 CM slings like yours) and another 3 or 4 double length slings over my shoulder and snapped under the arm with a single or double carabiner, depending on how I think they'll be used. I've come to really like the long draws over the shoulder like that, especially at Tahquitz where you often need a LONG extension to reduce wander. I also sometimes climb with 4  18cm draws similar to your top ones set up with camp nanos for routes where I expect some bolts. 

What’s on my base trad rack:
2 light weight quick draws (wire gates, skinny dog bones)
8mm slings with one biner each (I don’t do trad draws because my cams all have racking biners) I twist rack most of them. 2 60cm, 6 120 cm, 2 240cm.

That gives me a dozen slings of various lengths. This is good for maybe 70% of climbs I do on granite. Eg Yosemite. There’s often a bolt or two where I use a quickdraw, or some other reason they come in handy. The 240cm slings weigh very little so I like to bring them to wrap around trees, long extensions to prevent rope drag, etc

The other 30% of the time I’ll swap out as needed for the climb. Maybe no quickdraws. Maybe no long slings.

I also have 3 120cm cord slings for emergency Prusiks, for bailing, or if I run out of slings.

For sport I have 18 Spirit keylock QDs. 1 short, 13 medium, 4 long. 2 long ones if needed  to keep the rope straight, 2 long ones for the anchor. If I need to I bring my trad quickdraws or alpine draws (really long or wandering climbs).

6 - oz quickdraws
14 - 24" slings w/ biners
2 - 48" slings w/ biners

Sometimes you use everything if you're leading a 70m pitch.