Brush, equipment suggestions for cleaning routes in PNW

I'm interested in tidying up some dirty and/or moss-covered routes here in the PNW (Portland, OR area). What kinda brushes or tools do y'all recommend for cleaning basalt or other rock types in this region?

You will want a few different types. Grout brushes, like the Grout Demon, are awesome and they last quite awhile. If the top is flat get a Quickie broom.  

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Quickie-Bulldozer-Super-Stiff-Angle-Broom-7571/202941778

https://www.amazon.com/Groom-Industries-Dirty-Grout-Cleaning/dp/B00EMFRU1G

Im sure people will be along shortly telling you that wire is the way to go. IMO, that shit is lazy and a really bad precedent to set....even on granite. The difference between a wire brush and a grout brush is close to non-existent in regards to efficiency but one can do irreparable damage and generally leaves very obvious witness marks.

Where are you cleaning? 

Mike Brady wrote:
Im sure people will be along shortly telling you that wire is the way to go. IMO, that shit is lazy and a really bad precedent to set....even on granite. The difference between a wire brush and a grout brush is close to non-existent in regards to efficiency but one can do irreparable damage and generally leaves very obvious witness marks.

Solid advice, metal wire brushes are to strong for cleaning rock. I personally buy whatever nonmetal brush is on sale when I remember I need a few brush while shopping at the grocery store or hardware store. They all wear down eventually, but different shapes are useful for different sections of rock as Mike noted.

Mike Brady wrote: You will want a few different types. Grout brushes, like the Grout Demon, are awesome and they last quite awhile. If the top is flat get a Quickie broom.  

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Quickie-Bulldozer-Super-Stiff-Angle-Broom-7571/202941778

https://www.amazon.com/Groom-Industries-Dirty-Grout-Cleaning/dp/B00EMFRU1G

Im sure people will be along shortly telling you that wire is the way to go. IMO, that shit is lazy and a really bad precedent to set....even on granite. The difference between a wire brush and a grout brush is close to non-existent in regards to efficiency but one can do irreparable damage and generally leaves very obvious witness marks.

Where are you cleaning? 

Looking to clean some routes at Carver in the short-term. But there are routes up at Klinger and Pete's Pile I'd like to clean at some point.

Leaf Blower

Patrick Beeson wrote:

Looking to clean some routes at Carver in the short-term. But there are routes up at Klinger and Pete's Pile I'd like to clean at some point.

I’ll help you with Klinger and Pete’s if you need a partner, Patrick. Feel free to reach out anytime.

Cheaper the better. Go to Harbor Frieght they sell a wire brush with red handle (glue the handle to the brush), they are about  a dollar. Having personally put up hundreds of routes in WA, trust me a wire brush is fine . Unless it's very soft. Every single route at Index, Exit 32, Equinox is put up with a wire brush, shit I even seen wire brushes at Mineral. All Leavenworth and Goldbar boulders are put up with a wire brush, nothing lazy about it. Couple brushes, Leaf blower, drywall saw, saw, clippers, metal bars, beer. If working on ropes, rope guard, lots of lockers and spare biners, bosun chair, chest gear sling etc. If rebolting a bolt puller and all its counterparts, locktite.

michal wrote: Cheaper the better. Go to Harbor Frieght they sell a wire brush with red handle (glue the handle to the brush), they are about  a dollar. Having personally put up hundreds of routes in WA, trust me a wire brush is fine . Unless it's very soft sandstone. Basalt is fine. Every single route at Index, Exit 32, Equinox is put up with a wire brush, shit I even seen wire brushes at Mineral. All Leavenworth and Goldbar boulders are put up with a wire brush, nothing lazy about it. Couple brushes, Leaf blower, drywall saw, saw, clippers, metal bars, beer. If working on ropes, rope guard, lots of lockers and spare biners, bosun chair, chest gear sling etc. If rebolting a bolt puller and all its counterparts, locktite.

Carver is an already developed crag with fairly soft stone that sees quite a bit of traffic every year so a wire brush IS overkill. There are some derelicts routes here and there but its nothing a grout brush cant handle. IMO a wire brush is lazy because a stiff bristle synthetic does the same job with just a few more strokes but without doing any potential damage. Not saying any damage was done at index by using wire.....but this isn't Index. Portland has a lot of andesite mixed in with varying qualities of basalt, so to say that wire is okay on basalt is not so clear cut. Even comparing Leavenworth to Gold Bar is an apples to oranges comparison. Saying people cleaned the boulders around Leavenworth with wire is opening the door for noobs to think they should clean the boulders around leavenworth with wire. The granodiorite of Leavenworth is like sandstone compared to the granite in the Skyhomish Valley.

Mike Brady wrote:

Carver is an already developed crag with fairly soft stone that sees quite a bit of traffic every year so a wire brush IS overkill. There are some derelicts routes here and there but its nothing a grout brush cant handle. IMO a wire brush is lazy because a stiff bristle synthetic does the same job with just a few more strokes but without doing any potential damage. Not saying any damage was done at index by using wire.....but this isn't Index. Portland has a lot of andesite mixed in with varying qualities of basalt, so to say that wire is okay on basalt is not so clear cut. Even comparing Leavenworth to Gold Bar is an apples to oranges comparison. Saying people cleaned the boulders around Leavenworth with wire is opening the door for noobs to think they should clean the boulders around leavenworth with wire. The granodiorite of Leavenworth is like sandstone compared to the granite in the Skyhomish Valley.

Interestingly, even Outdoor Research recommends a good wire brush: outdoorresearch.com/blog/ar…

BUT, Carver rule ( carverclimbingclub.org/rules/):

Never use wire brushes on any of the rock at Carver. The rock can be cleaned with plastic or natural bristle brushes only.

Patrick Beeson wrote:

Interestingly, even Outdoor Research recommends a good wire brush: outdoorresearch.com/blog/ar…

That is unfortunate to read from such a big name. There IS a caveat in the first sentence though, IMO there should have been a 2nd caveat that it is only to be used and the most compact stones. In fairness the wire brush they are referring to isnt stiff bristled. 

I know this is an odd hill to die on but I have seen the damage that a stiff bristled wire brush can do in the hands of a rookie and I have cleaned a boat load of stone (even in the jungles of the PNW) with synthetic brushes. The difference in efficiency is negligible and the damage of wire can be irreversible. I'm not arguing that people that know what they are doing shouldnt use them on appropriate stone, Im saying you can get similar result with synthetic and maybe recommending wire should be done a bit more discreetly and with knowledge of the local stone.

michal wrote: Cheaper the better. Go to Harbor Frieght they sell a wire brush with red handle (glue the handle to the brush), they are about  a dollar. Having personally put up hundreds of routes in WA, trust me a wire brush is fine . Unless it's very soft sandstone. Basalt is fine. Every single route at Index, Exit 32, Equinox is put up with a wire brush, shit I even seen wire brushes at Mineral. All Leavenworth and Goldbar boulders are put up with a wire brush, nothing lazy about it. Couple brushes, Leaf blower, drywall saw, saw, clippers, metal bars, beer. If working on ropes, rope guard, lots of lockers and spare biners, bosun chair, chest gear sling etc. If rebolting a bolt puller and all its counterparts, locktite.

What is the drywall saw good for aside from perhaps scaring onlookers?

Well the title of post is cleaning in the PNW in general. So just use your intuition on what brush to use at different places. Carver has the brush rule so that's an easy answer.

Would any nylon brush do?  

Austin Miller wrote: Would any nylon brush do?  

Grout brushes like the Grout Demon are awesome for the toughest stuff and well worth having in your kit. I also like getting a couple HDX (Home Depot) general purpose brushes. 

You will want different tools for different jobs. I have everything from a tooth brush to a broom.

Do not use wire brushes on basalt. You will damage the rock. People have destroyed some of our local rocks by wire brushing. 

Max, it seems like you and I are in the minority on this. This question has been popping up a lot lately and, by and large, people are recommending wire as a go-to as if the world is covered in bullet proof granite and as if there aren't tools that are just as effective without any negative impact. I have seen multiple people state that basalt can handle wire brushes, which is barely true in its most solid form.

 

Mike Brady wrote: Max, it seems like you and I are in the minority on this. This question has been popping up a lot lately and, by and large, people are recommending wire as a go-to as if the world is covered in bullet proof granite and as if there aren't tools that are just as effective without any negative impact. I have seen multiple people state that basalt can handle wire brushes, which is barely true in its most solid form.

 

I’m glad I found this thread. There’s a crag that I’ve been looking at going to for a little bit that is sandstone but I felt as though a wire brush would be way too harsh for that kind of rock(and just in general) as it is softer than most. Thank you guys for the suggestions I will be looking into grout brushes and hopefully having some good old times brushing away my days!

I've used wire brushes on more vegetation-covered rock out on the east side, which tends to be harder and more featured, but would strongly warn against using them for cleaning established routes at places like Carver, Beacon, Broughton, etc. These areas tend to have fairly slick rock anyway, and it's the lichen-crust that gives the feet any friction. If you're removing moss, you can often peel it off in large clumps if it's still a little wet. For brushing holds and feet, all you really need is a nylon-bristled brush anyway. I'm also a huge fan of weeding forks for digging out cracks.

Also, if you're doing new development, I would strongly recommend documenting (taking pictures, looking up species info) the kind of vegetation you're coming into contact with and refrain from removing anything you aren't sure of. It could be an endangered/sensitive species and areas could get shut down if you're not vigilant about documenting and preserving them.

Nate Ball wrote: 

Also, if you're doing new development, I would strongly recommend documenting (taking pictures, looking up species info) the kind of vegetation you're coming into contact with and refrain from removing anything you aren't sure of. It could be an endangered/sensitive species and areas could get shut down if you're not vigilant about documenting and preserving them.

Haha.  I know you know I just learned this lesson...... not that that is why we got shutdown, it was just the leg the stood on. Not sure if documenting would have help any

Had the same question just now. Glad this thread exists. Thanks for all the good answers. I’ll be purchasing a grout brush in lieu of a wire brush.