Rope Access/ Fall Protection

Hello,

I'm interested in putting together an "all purpose" fall protection , tree climbing, rock climbing kit for safety and work access. I have no experience rock climbing, but spend a lot of time on ladders, on roofs, and in bell towers for my work as a maintenance man. My immediate need is for fall protection on a roof. I can buy a one hundred dollar OSHA compliant fall protection kit that has everything I need for roof fall protection. The system utilizes a steel plate that is nailed to rafters near the ridge beam of the roof. I'd prefer to have a rope access system up and over the roof (or up and over a tree branch) that gives me protection or access from the ground up. I still don't understand why the OSHA compliant kit only protects you after you've climbed on and off a ladder and up to the peak of your roof. I realize that I may be looking for a new toy in all of this. I've spend a lot of time on roofs and in high places with no fall protection and I'm sure roofers would think I'm acting like a chicken boy.

Here's a post from stack exchange that has answered my question:

"If you're not a climber, then don't buy a climbing rope for doing roof repairs. If you're going to buy a rope for a very specific job, then you should get the right equipment for the job.
For about the same cost as a climbing rope you could get a full roofers kit that comes with a:

• 5 point safety harness
• 50ft lifeline
• anchor plate
• 3' shock absorbing lanyard:

A couple reasons why you shouldn't use climbing gear for roof repairs: If you slip, you are most likely going to end up upside down as soon as you slide off the roof if you're wearing a climbing harness instead of a body harness; You put your expensive climbing rope at risk of damage that will make it useless for climbing (nails, saws, getting stepped on, sharp edges, etc.) You risk overloading the rope with more shock when you take a fall on a short length, the dynamic qualities of a rope are most effective if you have a good length of rope to absorb the shock.
Unless your plan is to use repairing your roof as an excuse to invest in some climbing gear so you can get into climbing after, then I would recommend buying a roofers kit, and asking your roofing questions on this SE site.
If you are using the roof as an excuse to buy climbing gear (I come up with any excuse I can), then what you want to do is get a good single rope that's >10mm of whatever length you want, a chest harness, a personal anchor (lanyard/sling) and a mechanical ascender. Anchor one end of the rope to the ground on the opposite side of the house you're working on, either to a tree or your truck or something that's a lot heavier than you, then simply throw the rope all the way over the top of the house. Don't tie into the rope, instead put the ascender on the rope and tie into your harness with your personal anchor, then run it through a biner on your chest harness and clip it into the ascender. Voila, you've just rigged your own roofers kit out of climbing gear."

Is this sound advice? Is climbing equipment highly specialized or can it be used safely for different applications.  My question boils down to this: Can a tree climbing harness in conjunction with a chest harness be used for fall protection/ rope access? What about a rock climbing harness/chest harness?  I'm not concerned with OSHA compliance because I'd be using this at home. Should I stop dreaming about an all purpose utilitarian climbing kit and buy the roofers kit?

In case anyone freaks out, I take this very seriously and will take climbing lessons if necessary (after the pandemic).  I'm a really active 35 year old and weigh 145. I know I wouldn't float to the ground if I fell, but I'm pretty nimble and strong and can handle the physical demands of climbing. I also exhaustively research tools and techniques before implementing them. Just in case you're worried about some random dude on the internet. : )

Thanks for any advice.

​TreeStuff!​​​

IRATA tech here..

So what matters is a rescue plan.  Think of your self dangling from your roof hanging in your harness.  
How are you getting down ?  Do you have the equipment to do so ?  a rope grab and an ascender is great, but they don't rap well.  

and yes.. Just get a chest point and you will stay upright.  

Id forget the ascender, use a dynamic rope and a  gri gri.  At least if you fall, you can Lower yourself.  
No point hanging on the side of your house waiting for the fire truck.  Lol

Oh, and say goodnight to your evestrough if you fall.  

Are you telling me that this post is inappropriate for this forum, or that I should buy gear at treestuff.com?

Thanks Franco!  Is a tree saddle acceptable for this purpose?

Could this kit be built for under $500?

So i googled it ( like a thong for men) lol

Im not familiar with it.  Id go with a no.  In all honesty, id just use a climbing harness.  Keep it simple.  Anchor the line, slap a gri gri on it, knot the brake strand a foot or so away from the device and get to work.  Lol

A shock pack takes about 2 kn to open.  And some packs are designed for heavier or lighter people.  you may be in for a rude static awakening.  Id use dynamic rope and a 6 pack of beer and rope protects for hard edges.  Whatever you wanna use is okay, just test your system in a tree first low to the ground.  Make sure its works well enough.  

Good luck dude !  Also, the camp goblin is a dynamic fall arrester.  Short lanyard.  

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=thlKlgrDLKA.  Check out the video.  Might help.  And you did mention a new toy...

Daniel Burns wrote: Hello,

 My immediate need is for fall protection on a roof. I can buy a one hundred dollar OSHA compliant fall protection kit that has everything I need for roof fall protection. The system utilizes a steel plate that is nailed to rafters near the ridge beam of the roof. I'd prefer to have a rope access system up and over the roof (or up and over a tree branch) that gives me protection or access from the ground up. I still don't understand why the OSHA compliant kit only protects you after you've climbed on and off a ladder and up to the peak of your roof.

I can speculate why, with a parallel to rock climbing.  Terrain is rated as classes 1-5.  You can look this up for a official description, but roughly, Class 1 is walking on flat ground, class 2 is walking on uneven ground, class 3 is where you are spending time use your hands to move on the terrain, class 4 is steeper and less secure and you are actively using your hands and feet.  A fall on this terrain could easily lead to injury and possible death.  The definition of class 5 is that a fall on that terrain if unroped would likely lead to death.

So using the ladder to get to the roof to put up the safety gear is class 3 - easy and nobody going up should be falling.  Getting to the peak on a one story house is class 4 - easy but DO NOT FALL.

Essentially what you are asking is, why isn't the safety standard that I should be roped on class 3 and class 4 terrain?  In climbing, most experienced climbers will never rope up on class 3 and only very rarely on class 4.  Typically, if you are climbing with an inexperienced person, you might provide a rope for THEM on class 4 and coach them and watch them carefully on class 3.

Again, this is speculation but  the answer probably is, if you are doing this for your job, you are supposed to be an experienced professional and you will not be considered to be in an unsafe position by upclimbing a ladder (class 3) and a roof (class 4) to attain the peak.  But for the "class 5" aspect of bringing up your supplies and to do work which involves moving around, you then should be roped for safety.

Use the proper PPE for the job.

Using PPE doesn't make you a chicken.

Work positioning vs Fall pro vs Rope Access vs rock climbing is all different.

Depending on your experience and knowledge you can use the last two (RA/RC) pretty well for all things. You probably won’t meet the OSHA or site standards for a job site. But you can use them on your own for personal work around your house/etc. if you have the likelihood of falling/becoming stuck/need a rescue the first thing I would recommend if making sure you system is rigged for rescue and you have someone who can lower you to the ground. Putting yourself in a position that fire/emt’s Have to be called to get you is not what you should plan on.

If you are using a static line/climbing harness for a roofing job You have a few options.

- Descender (Grigri, Rig, etc): easy to self rescue, but you don’t want to work with excess slack in the system so it requires constant tending.

- Backup (ASAP/Duck/shunt/etc): using this alone is a fine capture device for low angle work (if you don’t need to meet OSHA standards). The issue come in the event you fall and require a rescue if the system isn’t rigged to lower.

your “all in one” kit likely will cost thousands of $ and you need a lot of experience to know what you are doing. Taking a 40 hour rope access course or being a AMGA SPI doesn’t make people professionals and most know enough to get themself into a lot of trouble, but not out of it. 

Depending on your situation and why you are using these things (personal vs occupational), I would be more than willing to give you specific advice for a specific job. 

phylp phylp wrote:

I can speculate why, with a parallel to rock climbing.  Terrain is rated as classes 1-5.  You can look this up for a official description, but roughly, Class 1 is walking on flat ground, class 2 is walking on uneven ground, class 3 is where you are spending time use your hands to move on the terrain, class 4 is steeper and less secure and you are actively using your hands and feet.  A fall on this terrain could easily lead to injury and possible death.  The definition of class 5 is that a fall on that terrain if unroped would likely lead to death.

So using the ladder to get to the roof to put up the safety gear is class 3 - easy and nobody going up should be falling.  Getting to the peak on a one story house is class 4 - easy but DO NOT FALL.

Essentially what you are asking is, why isn't the safety standard that I should be roped on class 3 and class 4 terrain?  In climbing, most experienced climbers will never rope up on class 3 and only very rarely on class 4.  Typically, if you are climbing with an inexperienced person, you might provide a rope for THEM on class 4 and coach them and watch them carefully on class 3.

Again, this is speculation but  the answer probably is, if you are doing this for your job, you are supposed to be an experienced professional and you will not be considered to be in an unsafe position by upclimbing a ladder (class 3) and a roof (class 4) to attain the peak.  But for the "class 5" aspect of bringing up your supplies and to do work which involves moving around, you then should be roped for safety.

The view on fall protection has changed a lot in the past 5-10 years.

While experts in rock climbing don’t usually rope up for 3/4 class. Workers aren’t allowed to make that decision if they are following industry standards. 
While I don’t always follow OSHA standards on myOff time, falling off a roof that could have been protected with 50’ of static protects me as a homeowner and also protects the income I would not have in the event I am injured in a fall. It’s hard to explain to your homeowners insurance why you took a 20’ fall off a roof and you can expect it will cost you a lot of $.

Can I finally make a post? I couldn't reply yesterday because my account is too new.

Thanks a lot for helping me out. I've gotten more valuable information here than on any of the other forums.