Starting a Trad Rack

Hey Colorado Climbers. Just moved to this beautiful state and am beginning my investment in a Trad rack.
If you have suggestions, lay em on me.
If you have gear to give or sell, lay it on me.

Good time to buy is now. Every retailer is trying their damndest to sell, sell, sell. Not knowing anything about what you want to do I'd go with the basics:

1. Doubles 0.4-3
2. Single 0.2, 0.3, #4 (could always get more small sizes)
3. Set of regular nuts sizes 4-11 (anything DMM is a good call)
4. Offset nuts are pretty tight for Colorado but optional (again, get the DMMs)
5. A crapload of non locking carabiners you'll actually want to clip (bigger, beefier ones). You'll need 1 for each cam and 2 for each alpine draw.
6. A half-a-crapload of locking carabiners
7. 10-12 60cm dyneema slings - alpine draws
8. 1-2 120cm slings
9. Personally, I like having 1 240cm sling
10. A nut tool
11. Probably more stuff I'm forgetting

Sam's list is very good. I like the Wild Country cams but the Black Diamond C4's are good and a little cheaper. I also like the Wild Country Rocks for stoppers, but BD or DMM are good too; I would double up on the four smallest sizes. Love the DMM offset nuts. Eventually you may want to get more specialized small gear, brass nuts, micro cams and Lowe balls. Right now there are a lot of options for micro cams and a lot of opinions about which are best. 

Hey Ryan,

Welcome to CO. I'll outline what I bought and what I already owned when I got my first trad rack.

Already owned:
Harness
ATC+ locker
GriGri
10 quickdraws
70m rope
4 small ish lockers
2 double length nylon slings
Prussik
20ft cordalette

Then, I got this rack on MP:
BD C4 #0.3-3
4-13 (pretty sure this is the range) BD nuts

And supplemented it with 6 alpine draws (Camp Photons, BD 60cm Dyneema slings). It has been plenty to do a few seasons with. In general, the people you'll be trad climbing with also have a rack, so doubles are a little overkill right out of the gate. The only thing I feel I'm missing are some smaller cams. Probably pick up some Z4s at some point. I have heard the DMM Offset nuts are the cat's pajamas, and wish I could try them. 

I'd recommend starting slower rather than just buying a bunch of everything all at once. You'll learn what you like, what you don't, what you need, what you don't. You'll use other people's cams and see if you like different brands. Get a single rack of the most common sizes, and a rack of nuts. Then climb. Then buy more.

Regarding nuts:
Yes, offsets are the bomb. 

BUT. I would strongly recommend starting with a set of normal nuts and become proficient at climbing with them. After you’re at the stage, pick up the DMM offsets.

It’ll make you a better climber. 

Sam R wrote: Good time to buy is now. Every retailer is trying their damndest to sell, sell, sell. Not knowing anything about what you want to do I'd go with the basics:

1. Doubles 0.4-3
2. Single 0.2, 0.3, #4 (could always get more small sizes)
3. Set of regular nuts sizes 4-11 (anything DMM is a good call)
4. Offset nuts are pretty tight for Colorado but optional (again, get the DMMs)
5. A crapload of non locking carabiners you'll actually want to clip (bigger, beefier ones). You'll need 1 for each cam and 2 for each alpine draw.
6. A half-a-crapload of locking carabiners
7. 10-12 60cm dyneema slings - alpine draws
8. 1-2 120cm slings
9. Personally, I like having 1 240cm sling
10. A nut tool
11. Probably more stuff I'm forgetting

This is a solid list and I second the recommendation for a 240cm sling in place of cordallette for anchors.  Most climbers are familiar with camalot colors/sizing so a rack of those is nice, I’d recommend x4 or z4 for your smaller pieces... if you get to a second rack I’d recommend a different company with different sizing like Metolius to help with placements that are “in between,” sizes.  Don’t buy used soft goods.

I have a set of lightly used dmm nuts I’d sell (I end up using my wild country most of the time instead).

Jared Fehr wrote:

This is a solid list and I second the recommendation for a 240cm sling in place of cordallette for anchors.  Most climbers are familiar with camalot colors/sizing so a rack of those is nice, I’d recommend x4 or z4 for your smaller pieces... if you get to a second rack I’d recommend a different company with different sizing like Metolius to help with placements that are “in between,” sizes.  Don’t buy used soft goods.

I have a set of lightly used dmm nuts I’d sell (I end up using my wild country most of the time instead).

I’d love to buy that full rack of nuts from
You!

I second the recommendations for dmm nuts. Hands down better (though those are the only two I've used). Also a single rack is fine to begin with. The only downside is you actually HAVE to use nuts OH NO. Ya unless you're flush with money get a single rack and nuts and you'll have enough to do a good amount of things. Then from there you will find what else you need.

Are you sure you want to be a trad climber? Make sure the answer is a resounding yes before you shell out a four figure sum. There is nothing sadder than a shiny rack of trad gear.

Wilderness Exchange (downtown Denver, a few steps north of REI) and Boulder Sports Recycler (northern Boulder) usually have a small selection of used gear for sale. Might not be classified as "essential service" by the governor though.

If you intend to start out leading routes 3-4 grades below your climbing limit, a single set of cams and nuts is sufficient. This works fine in for example Eldo or Boulder Canyon that tend to have short pitches (about half a rope). However, watch out for the length of pitches (especially in "alpine" areas such as for example Lumpy) as a nearly-full-rope-length pitch can take a lot of gear.  If you choose to double up selectively, I would suggest to double on small cams (0.2 - 0.75 BD size) and small/mid size nuts (#3 - #9 BD size). Whenever you hit Turkey Rocks or Vedauwoo, you need more larger cams though. As for brand of really small cams, I'm pretty happy with metolius.

I agree with Doc Drake above that "ordinary" (non-offset) nuts (especially BD or WC) is the best choice for beginners as they are easier to place well and clean (take out). DMM Wallnuts are slightly harder to clean, DMM offsets yet one step worse, and Metolius curved nuts are the worst. Note that the two smallest BD nuts (#1 and #2 of their full set of #1 - #13) are only for aid and not rated for lead falls. I rarely carry #12-13 as the weight of these large nuts is almost the same as a cam of same size. The BD shape is copied by a few other (sometimes) cheaper brands. As a beginner, expensive brassies are not yet needed, but keep them in mind in a year or three once you get on harder (5.10 and above) routes. I also think offset nuts are overrated. Among my favorite three partners and me, we have 100+ years of climbing, but only one of us has added offset nuts to the rack. Micronuts on the other hand is a different story. Offset brassies and peenuts come in handy sometimes, but not really needed on "beginner routes".

Carabiners is where you will save weight on your rack. I recommend to stay below maybe 35g each. Be careful with ultralights (such as Camp nano 22) as some of us have trouble handling those small sizes. So don't buy a whole rack of those without trying them out in the field first. I suggest to get color-coded biners for your cams (which means the color of the biner is the same as the cam). Someone wrote a "half crapload of lockers". I don't know what that exactly means but 3-4 is enough.

Stay away from tricams and hexes. A waste of money on gear that you most likely will retire pretty soon.

Learn how to build an anchor with your rope, and you won't need to carry around a bulky cordelett.

As this is CO, a helmet comes highly recommended for trad areas. I prefer a construction of foam as these tend to be lighter.

Patrik wrote: Wilderness Exchange (downtown Denver, a few steps north of REI) and Boulder Sports Recycler (northern Boulder) usually have a small selection of used gear for sale. Might not be classified as "essential service" by the governor though.

If you intend to start out leading routes 3-4 grades below your climbing limit, a single set of cams and nuts is sufficient. This works fine in for example Eldo or Boulder Canyon that tend to have short pitches (about half a rope). However, watch out for the length of pitches (especially in "alpine" areas such as for example Lumpy) as a nearly-full-rope-length pitch can take a lot of gear.  If you choose to double up selectively, I would suggest to double on small cams (0.2 - 0.75 BD size) and small/mid size nuts (#3 - #9 BD size). Whenever you hit Turkey Rocks or Vedauwoo, you need more larger cams though. As for brand of really small cams, I'm pretty happy with metolius.

I agree with Doc Drake above that "ordinary" (non-offset) nuts (especially BD or WC) is the best choice for beginners as they are easier to place well and clean (take out). DMM Wallnuts are slightly harder to clean, DMM offsets yet one step worse, and Metolius curved nuts are the worst. Note that the two smallest BD nuts (#1 and #2 of their full set of #1 - #13) are only for aid and not rated for lead falls. I rarely carry #12-13 as the weight of these large nuts is almost the same as a cam of same size. The BD shape is copied by a few other (sometimes) cheaper brands. As a beginner, expensive brassies are not yet needed, but keep them in mind in a year or three once you get on harder (5.10 and above) routes. I also think offset nuts are overrated. Among my favorite three partners and me, we have 100+ years of climbing, but only one of us has added offset nuts to the rack. Micronuts on the other hand is a different story. Offset brassies and peenuts come in handy sometimes, but not really needed on "beginner routes".

Carabiners is where you will save weight on your rack. I recommend to stay below maybe 35g each. Be careful with ultralights (such as Camp nano 22) as some of us have trouble handling those small sizes. So don't buy a whole rack of those without trying them out in the field first. I suggest to get color-coded biners for your cams (which means the color of the biner is the same as the cam). Someone wrote a "half crapload of lockers". I don't know what that exactly means but 3-4 is enough.

Stay away from tricams and hexes. A waste of money on gear that you most likely will retire pretty soon.

Learn how to build an anchor with your rope, and you won't need to carry around a bulky cordelett.

As this is CO, a helmet comes highly recommended for trad areas. I prefer a construction of foam as these tend to be lighter.

Dang Patrik. I so thoroughly appreciate your time in helping a fellow climber..

My thanks goes out to you and the rest of those on this forum who have given their time and consideration into helping me. 

I have 0.4-4 if youre interested. Id have to do some reading about what a good price is  

WC Friends are 25% off on backcountry.com right now - excellent cams. And you can get free 2-day shipping. 

I’m gonna catch some hell for this, but if you plan on alpine climbing at all in the near future, invest in a set of hexes or tri cams so you can start to learn how to place them...

Cue ensuing hex haters...

Tricams yes, hexes are not needed.

Ryan Sutton wrote: Dang Patrik. I so thoroughly appreciate your time in helping a fellow climber.

You live in the Front Range now? Look up 'Denver Social Climb' on Meetup. You just might see an event or two organized by Patrik, at least someday. Don't turn down the opportunity to climb with him. 

Even more useful (especially so these days of "climbing ban") than any gear you'll buy:

"How to rock climb", John Long
"Rock Climbing. Mastering basic skills", Topher Donahue, Craig Luebben

or any other book with lots of photos/discussions of gear placements and anchor building. Some people learn better "by doing", but seeing "real stuff" is a lot cheaper in a book than from hiring a guide. Some of our CO libraries have those, but they are unfortunately closed right now. Still, the $20-30 cost if this book will by far be the best investment on your rack. I suggest you shouldn't read this book. You should study this book. As if your life depends on it. Because it is. Study it more diligently than you have ever done for any school exam. Read it three times over. Make notes, highlight important issues, circle interesting details. And for the next three years, go over it as a spring refresher before you hit the crags after the slow winter season.

   ... and welcome to the intriguing world of trad. You'll see and visit areas more amazing than any sport crag you've ever been to.

Told ya...

Forgive me if I didn't read this thread thoroughly enough, but what is your experience climbing with such gear?

Assuming you have no traditional experience, you could forgoe buying a full double set of cams and just get singles in sizes .5 to 2 inches, maybe even a 3"... there are many routes that are either short enough, or mixed with bolts that you could get away with a single rack, and then find out if trad climbing is for you before committing another 700ish dollars to double up on sizes.

That's what worked for me anyways. My rack has accumulated over time. I started with nuts, tricams, and a few miscellaneous cams, and woud buy a new cam every few weeks or so until i had doubles.

Hell, knowing what I know now, I would have gone singles from .5 to 3 inches, and then after determining that trad was for me, bought a full set of totems.

Anyways, thanks for giving me something to talk about. Best wishes.