Scarpa vs Sportiva Gear question

I've been climbing in the Solutions for like 1 year and a couple months, Ive had a pair of Instinct VS since i bought my solutions and Ive only worn them 5-6 times. I really like them since i started using them. So here's my question, I just learned Solutions are mainly a bouldering shoe, even though i trashed them outside on sport (oops) and they are not for edging really. Im looking for a great Sport Climbing specific shoe. My thoughts are the Drago, Miura, Instint VSR (I dont really understand the differences in the VS VSR and the S as it pertains to Sport Climbing), or just use my VS for sport and buy another Solution for bouldering because i loved them so much? Ive only been climbing a year and half, and am now starting to work on projects outside so i really want a great sport climbing shoe, so just looking for a little guidance from you gurus. Maybe you guys can chime in with that you've liked the best for sport climbing? Thanks! 

Bouldering shoe? A friend of mine climbs low .13 eldo trad in solutions.

Solutions don't fit my feet as well as the instincts do. But I know a lot of great climbers that use them for everything. If they fit and work for you, use them.

BTW, hard sport routes are just long boulder problems strung together.

It's more about the footholds you're trying to stand on than the manner of protection for the climb.

Jorg Verhoeven freed the nose in solutions, so that kinda shows that it's really up to personal preference and what kind of holds you're standing on. Some people boulder in TC Pros, others do the ultimate trad route in solutions. 

Jon Welch wrote: 

BTW, hard sport routes are just long boulder problems strung together.

and hard trad is just sport climbing without bolts

Solutions are great for sportclimbing (more so than bouldering I would say).

From the shoes you mentioned the Miura will be way stiffer and better for edging (which can be an advantage for certain routes and a disadvantage for others). The Dragos and VSR will be quite a bit softer than the solutions and the Vs are pretty much the equivalent to the solutions from Scarpa.

I think if I were you I would just keep climbing in the solutions if you like them (maybe you can get your current pair resoled). Then if you find a good deal for a Drago, VSR, Phyton, Skwama or something like that just try it out and see if you maybe prefer a softer shoe for some routes.

Solutions are softer and use a stickier rubber, which makes them more sensitive and which is why they are marketed as a bouldering shoe. The miura, for example, is stiffer and uses and less sticky rubber that’s a bit harder. Sense it’s stiffer, the power needed to stand on tiny footholds gets more evenly distributed down your entire foot, where a solution might bend at the midsole. The harder rubber will be less likely to roll on really small edges. For sport or trad, it’ll be long enough that your calf/foot endurance might make a difference. As everyone is saying though, it’s basically preference when it’s comes down to it. If I switch shoes I find that I get used to whatever shoe I’m wearing in a couple climbs.
Also the instinct vs is stiffer than the vsr and uses edging rubber, where the vsr uses stickier, softer rubber. The vsr is like the solution version of the vs. Don’t know about the lace.

Nick C wrote: Solutions are softer and use a stickier rubber, which makes them more sensitive and which is why they are marketed as a bouldering shoe. The miura, for example, is stiffer and uses and less sticky rubber that’s a bit harder. Sense it’s stiffer, the power needed to stand on tiny footholds gets more evenly distributed down your entire foot, where a solution might bend at the midsole. The harder rubber will be less likely to roll on really small edges. For sport or trad, it’ll be long enough that your calf/foot endurance might make a difference. As everyone is saying though, it’s basically preference when it’s comes down to it. If I switch shoes I find that I get used to whatever shoe I’m wearing in a couple climbs.
Also the instinct vs is stiffer than the vsr and uses edging rubber, where the vsr uses stickier, softer rubber. The vsr is like the solution version of the vs. Don’t know about the lace.

If I remember correctly, the lace is slightly stiffer than the VS

Instincts and the solution are actually built on the same rand (foot shape model), and by the same footwear designer (heinz Mariacher). That's why you like them. The vs stands for Velcro strap. Not "s for sport climbing".  Vsr is the same exact shoe with grip 2 rubber on the sole vs edge.  They were designed about 18? years apart, the result is the instinct has similar performance with a lot more comfort.

As for sport v trad v whatever shoes: your foot knows what works for you better than the marketing department at either brand. The rock you climb dictates what midsole and rubber are best for you regardless of if it has bolts or cams in it. Many good climbers own several pairs of shoes for different types of rock: face v crack v edgy v smedgy (not for sport v trad). 

Wow thanks so much dudes! Extremely informative. My friend gets a discount at Scarpa so i was looking at those shoes otherwise yeah i would just get another pair of solutions because i loved them so much. And my brother wears Miuras and he loves them. 

Jakob Melchior wrote: Solutions are great for sportclimbing (more so than bouldering I would say).

From the shoes you mentioned the Miura will be way stiffer and better for edging (which can be an advantage for certain routes and a disadvantage for others). The Dragos and VSR will be quite a bit softer than the solutions and the Vs are pretty much the equivalent to the solutions from Scarpa.

I think if I were you I would just keep climbing in the solutions if you like them (maybe you can get your current pair resoled). Then if you find a good deal for a Drago, VSR, Phyton, Skwama or something like that just try it out and see if you maybe prefer a softer shoe for some routes.

Hey Jakob, my friend told me if i do get them resoled its still not going to be even close to what it was. Is that legit?

Nobody in SLC area carries Dragos, or Furia S, do any of you guys know if they fit the same as VS Instincts? 

Jeff M wrote:

If I remember correctly, the lace is slightly stiffer than the VS

if that is true it would be the opposite of the miuras

The first rule of my friend gets a discount at Scarpa is never post publicly about my friend gets a discount at Scarpa.

Schyluer Jarman wrote: Nobody in SLC area carries Dragos, or Furia S, do any of you guys know if they fit the same as VS Instincts? 

I have dragos and instinct VS's and they definitely fit differently. Its less about the size than the volume of shoe though, so I would recommend trying them on or buying a couple pairs and returning the ones that don't fit.

Also, a good resole (rock & resole) shouldn't make the shoe "completely different". My solutions are on their 2nd resole and still feel 95% as good as new to me. If i was climbing 5.14 it might make a huge difference, but I'm not, and it hasn't. 

LL2 wrote: The first rule of my friend gets a discount at Scarpa is never post publicly about my friend gets a discount at Scarpa.

My bad. :0

Chuck D wrote:

I have dragos and instinct VS's and they definitely fit differently. Its less about the size than the volume of shoe though, so I would recommend trying them on or buying a couple pairs and returning the ones that don't fit.

Also, a good resole (rock & resole) shouldn't make the shoe "completely different". My solutions are on their 2nd resole and still feel 95% as good as new to me. If i was climbing 5.14 it might make a huge difference, but I'm not, and it hasn't. 

Chuck you are a life safer. Thanks for letting me know they fit different. Ill look at resole as well

So much depends on fit and what’s fun to climb in. Also sizing. Also where you climb (rock type) and what you need the shoes to do and how strong your feet are.

I have 4 shoes in my quiver that cover IMO every rock type and climbing style.

LS Testarossa (best on very steep, small edges, nubs. Great sport climbing shoe)
LS Solution (bouldering, slab climbing, steeps, technical. If I owned 1 shoe, this would be it)
LS Futura (extremely soft and sensitive, great smearing on slab and just shy of vertical. Similar to Drago)
5.10 Anasazi Pinks (stiff comfy trad shoe that works on slab, and small holds up to vertical)

Plenty of people use Solution’s (or Scarpa instinct) for every style of climbing. Sized right (or by owning different sizes of each model) they’ll do it all well enough, except maybe crack climb.

I don’t like to have shoes with overlapping traits.

The shoes you listed - Drago, miura, and instinct - are vastly different shoes.

Want a soft shoe? Drago, Genius, or Futura
Want a copy of solution? Instinct
Want a stiff do it all shoe? Miura lace, miura VS (very different from the lace), Otaki, or Vapor V

Again, Solution’s are my one shoe to rule them all.

Sport climbs come in all varieties. What function do you want from a new shoe that the Solutions lack?

Try on as many shoes as you can and in a variety of sizes too. Get whatever fits your foot best/whatever you feel most confident climbing in.

Schyluer Jarman wrote:

Hey Jakob, my friend told me if i do get them resoled its still not going to be even close to what it was. Is that legit?

you're friend did not get a good resole, I have some shoes that are on their 3rd resole and still climb like new

Schyluer Jarman wrote:

Hey Jakob, my friend told me if i do get them resoled its still not going to be even close to what it was. Is that legit?

It is definitely worth getting it done by a good resoler as long as the shoes are still in good shape. A authorised La Sportiva resoler should even have the official vibram soles in the Solution shape.

Maybe they lose a little bit of tension but especially for indoor climbing they will be perfectly fine. Relatively soft shoes with half-soles (and especially P3) take re-soles very well and Solutions should be fine for even 2-3. Also, you don't have to break in a new pair with is huge if you have downsized them for a propper performance fit.