Has anyone realized that the shoelace knot is more complicated than any knots used for climbing?

Thoughts?

Will Anderson wrote: Thoughts?

Tying a shoelace is two knots. So twice as hard. 

Another reason to get lace ups - display your mad knot skilz.  ;)

I realized when I started climbing that I was accidentally tying a double-slip thief's knot instead of a double-slip square knot and now I can't help but ask if people are doing the same if they have their laces come untied. "You mean the over-under, loop-de-loop and pull can be done wrong?"

Honestly I disagree, the figure 8 has more steps and requires more attention than a shoelace knot. 

I have trouble tying the laces on my Nepals. They always slip off the top hooks when I'm tightening them. Thanks for listening.

Andy Eiter wrote: I have trouble tying the laces on my Nepals. They always slip off the top hooks when I'm tightening them. Thanks for listening.

Same.  Worse, I get em tight, but they slip off the hooks after walking around a bit.

Turner wrote: But have you seen the dragon bowline...

(There are videos by guides in case anyone is a doubter).

John Reeve wrote:

Same.  Worse, I get em tight, but they slip off the hooks after walking around a bit.

That happens to me too (once I eventually get them tied in the first place).

Let’s just invent a climbing rope you can Velcro like shoes... I’m gunna be rich in 2020!

Turner wrote: But have you seen the dragon bowline...

What is a shoelace knot?

Darren Mabe wrote: What is a shoelace knot?

A double-slip square knot

John Reeve wrote:

Same.  Worse, I get em tight, but they slip off the hooks after walking around a bit.

Between each set of hooks tie half a square knot before you pull em tight onto the next set of hooks. Xam showed me that a while ago and it makes a huge difference :)

No, I had not, and it's kinda true. Good observation.

Yeah, I learned to tie my shoe laces wrong when I was a kid, too.  Similarly, I learned a sub-par method of belaying when I was first taught.  I've corrected both.

Here's a fun site.  I use a method I found here for my slippers.  Those leather laces won't stay tied for long with a "standard" knot:  https://www.fieggen.com/shoelace/tying.htm

Cheers!

GO

William P wrote:

A double-slip square knot

Thanks

Thaddeus F Baringer wrote:

Between each set of hooks tie half a square knot before you pull em tight onto the next set of hooks. Xam showed me that a while ago and it makes a huge difference :)

Thanks... makes sense.  Very helpful.

My rope tied itself into this knot yesterday... We pulled it, it came through the anchors just fine, snagged in some grass on the ledge, and when we got it out, this knot was at the end. 

I’m still confused about how this happened.

Interesting passage from the Wikipedia page on the reef (same thing as square) knot:

"The reef knot's familiarity, ease of tying, and visually appealing symmetry conceal its weakness. The International Guild of Knot Tyers warns that this knot should never be used to bend two ropes together. A proper bend knot, for instance a sheet bend or double fisherman's knot, should be used instead. Knotting authority Clifford Ashley claimed that misused reef knots have caused more deaths and injuries than all other knots combined. Further, it is easily confused with the granny knot, which is a very poor knot."