Best order for first three flatirons?

What's the best method for doing all three flatirons? Our ideal routes are Direct, Freeway, and then East Face. Which should we start with? We're probably going to solo Freeway and simul the other two.

3-2-1

Simul the first. Downclimb the second. simul the third.

Alternatively solo the 2nd. simul the first. then cut behind the 2nd on the climbers trail that extends past the sunset flatironette. This 'trail' takes you to the scree field north of the third. then just make your way to the third and simul that.

Those are the 2 best ways to do it. If you want to do it all by normal trails then you should climb the 3rd. then solo the 2nd. then climb the first. That is the most direct route imo with no added hijinks.

I've done 1-2-3.  Not obvious to me that there is any substantial benefit to doing any reasonable order over any other, but it would seem 1-2-3 or 3-2-1 are the obvious choices.  I've done them solo and slightly prefer to get the 1st "out of the way" as it's noticeably harder than 2 and 3.  With all due respect to the above poster, I'm not sure how anyone would know what is "by far the most common."  Lots of random guys (and somewhat fewer gals) do these all the time, but it's not as if there's any obvious way to know who else is doing what.

2-1-3 is the fastest. 

I'm glad my question generated some discussion, thanks y'all. Think the weather would be fine to do it early next week?

pfwein wrote: With all due respect to the above poster, I'm not sure how anyone would know what is "by far the most common."   Lots of random guys (and somewhat fewer gals) do these all the time, but it's not as if there's any obvious way to know who else is doing what.

I suppose one presumption is no better than another, but there are groups like SMSC and BTR that have a lot of people do them on a regular basis for time and probably have a pretty good idea what the people keeping time do.  IE: On one of these chat lists you can look up what people have planned/done/discussed for the last 10 years & what their comparitive times were if they reported back.  Perhaps that is what he did?

Zeb Martin wrote: I'm glad my question generated some discussion, thanks y'all. Think the weather would be fine to do it early next week?

Send it, things could be worse. 

Tony B wrote:

I suppose one presumption is no better than another, but there are groups like SMSC and BTR that have a lot of people do them on a regular basis for time and probably have a pretty good idea what the people keeping time do.  IE: On one of these chat lists you can look up what people have planned/done/discussed for the last 10 years & what their comparitive times were if they reported back.  Perhaps that is what he did?

Perhaps.  If so, I'd readily concede that would almost certainly show what is the fastest and would be good evidence as to what's the most common, depending a bit on how much faster is (as doing 1-2-3 or 3-2-1 is slightly more obvious than starting with 2, I may guess either of those orders might be more common, but it's just a guess).  The advantage of any particular order isn't obvious to me, but maybe I'm missing something (and maybe we're talking about somewhat different ascents and/or descents, although the OP was pretty clear about the ascents at least).

pfwein wrote:

Perhaps.  If so, I'd readily concede that would almost certainly show what is the fastest and would be good evidence as to what's the most common, depending a bit on how much faster is (as doing 1-2-3 or 3-2-1 is slightly more obvious than starting with 2, I may guess either of those orders might be more common, but it's just a guess).  The advantage of any particular order isn't obvious to me, but maybe I'm missing something (and maybe we're talking about somewhat different ascents and/or descents, although the OP was pretty clear about the ascents at least).

Well, if you look at doing 2 first, you realize that you start at the lowest point and exit part way down the trail back to the base of 1, and that the run back down to 1 is pretty quick, then you exit off the back of 1 and diagonal over to the base of 3 with no vert gain, then can run back out from the top of #3, which is a road part way and promotes moving pretty fast when tired.
If you do 1 first, you get to a very high point, then have to go all the way back down to 2, on its left side, then down to 3 (nothing lost there, really) and then out.
If you do 3 first, you come down through the talus well positioned to do 2, and from that well positioned to do 1, at least.  But you never get to take advantage of letting your heals fly on the road.

Reviewing Bill Wright's flat iron speed records page might also still reflect how the trifecta times came down, and where the record (which has been well contested) was set, which also represents some objective truth.  Haven't looked at that for a while.

I know that quite some time ago, however, that the speed record for the trifecta was actually 1,2,3 in that order in 1hr9min something.

You know, the right way to answer this is probably to get the right people involved in the discussion.   I am not that fast, though I might better represent what "mere mortals" would best benefit from.  It takes me at least 45 min to do the 1st or 3rd alone (48:?? last time I did either one), and 40-something to do the second.  There is a handful of guys who have done those in sub 35-min fact recently, Kyle Richardson ran the 3rd in just over 30 min, car to car.  Those guys would know a lot more about what is actually fastest.

 When do you plan to do this? You should expect snow ice and water on the lower parts for at least a few more days .

Greg D wrote:  When do you plan to do this? You should expect snow ice and water on the lower parts for at least a few more days .

They'll be fine on Sunday, I bet.

Tony B wrote:

Reviewing Bill Wright's flat iron speed records page might also still reflect how the trifecta times came down, and where the record (which has been well contested) was set, which also represents some objective truth.  Haven't looked at that for a while.

The most recent record (2014) is 1h 7m and was done 2-1-3.
​https://fastestknowntime.com/fkt/stefan-griebel-flatirons-linkups-boulder-co-2014-10-30​​​
https://www.strava.com/activities/213664320

BTW the people behind FKT are Peter Bakwin, Buzz Burrell and Jeff Schuler. https://fastestknowntime.com/team

I would usually suggest 2-1-3 as the order you go, but do remember all the off-trail parts are going to be snowy, so that makes travel on them a bit annoying - you have to cross some large boulders if you cut in back of the Second towards the Third, and travel on those get pretty awkward when they're covered in snow. If you want to keep on trail, 1-2-3 works fine.

I would also suggest microspikes to get down the First/Second trail - it's a popular trail for hikers, so it gets packed down. A lot of the new trail work has left the trail in an intersesting state, as they've stopped for the season. And if things are clear enough, consider doing Free For All, rather than just Freeway, to tick another summit. The Second would then be perhaps your hardest flatiron for the day. You can most likely rap from the top if you have some webbing to donate. If not, Freeway seems like somewhat of a filler route.

Long Ranger wrote: 
I would also suggest microspikes to get down the First/Second trail - it's a popular trail for hikers, so it gets packed down. A lot of the new trail work has left the trail in an intersesting state, as they've stopped for the season. And if things are clear enough, consider doing Free For All, rather than just Freeway, to tick another summit. The Second would then be perhaps your hardest flatiron for the day. You can most likely rap from the top if you have some webbing to donate. If not, Freeway seems like somewhat of a filler route.

At least some of the work on those trails resumes this weekend, last I heard, safe weather & conditions provided...  working behind Overhang Rock.
But maybe that changed.  Did they finish on the descent trail from the 3rd did you hear?  That was getting close last time I was up there (helping for a day).

Also, you can down-lead and down-follow the back of the second at a very easy grade (5.2 to 5.4) if you don't want to leave webbing or just down-solo it, which is what people do most of the time.

2-1-3 is fastest. It isn't even close. The link from 1-2 sucks and the link from 3-2 sucks for the standard summit routes (DEF/FFA or FZY/STD) so going 1-2-3 or 3-2-1 adds hiking.

If you need your numbers to align for some reason, another variation of trifecta worth trying is 3-2-1 with South Sneak on the 2nd. That has some clean links between the rocks, plus it's a fun scramble.

Tony B wrote:

They'll be fine on Sunday, I bet.

Well, after extensive research on the phrase “at least a few days” it turns out that Sunday would meet that criteria. So thanks for agreeing with me. 

But I’ll see your bet and raise you a half day. I bet that portions of the routes will still be wet Sunday morning and portions of the descents will have packed snow and ice. This would be a gentlemen’s bet. So no trump like name calling tantrums if you lose. 

Greg D wrote:

Well, after extensive research on the phrase “at least a few days” it turns out that Sunday would meet that criteria. So thanks for agreeing with me. 

But I’ll see your bet and raise you a half day. I bet that portions of the routes will still be wet Sunday morning and portions of the descents will have packed snow and ice. This would be a gentlemen’s bet. So no trump like name calling tantrums if you lose. 

Whatever are you talking about?  And what does this have to do with Trump and name-calling?
If you read what I said, I don't see any major disagreements or agreements unless that's what you are looking for.
What I said was that my guess was that today would be good climbing.  I climb in the flats all winter some years.

I'm sure you can find some damp spots this AM.  I'm sure that by mid morning you can also climb it just fine.
No less, it's not a matter of great concern to me and I'll be in Eldo today anyway.
If it concerns you greatly, have at it & let the gang know what you find.  Else, I am supposing maybe the O.P. will.

So I'm currently on the Flatirons loop trail and we decided to turn around since the ridges look snowy. Also didn't bring microspikes because I didn't revisit this thread until now and am currently self-arresting with a nut tool down the trail. At least I'm having fun!!

Tony B wrote:

They'll be fine on Sunday, I bet.

I’ll bet they are still sketchy on Tuesday. 

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/117990629/35-meter-rope-left-of-the-1st-flat-iron-rappel#ForumMessage-117996592