How to move off hand/fist stacks when knees don't fit in far?

I'm an offwidth noob struggling on a 5.7 (  ) offwidth. The best purchase I've found is with a hand/fist stack, although it feels a little loose for that. The problem with that is that my knee fits only a few inches into the crack, so I can't seem to get a "grip" with my knee to move the hand-fist stack. Can't foot jam--the crack's too wide--and while I can sort of heel-toe cam, without some way to really lock in, I can't move the hand/fist stack on just that.

I can chicken wing, but only with my body in certain positions. I can also do what I'm gonna call an "elbow jam" where I sort of put my elbow in and flex, which actually holds me up really well, but I'm basically into the wall and immobile.

The crack diagonals slightly left and the left side sticks out a bit more than the right. Not sure if that changes anything. I've been going in with my right side first--haven't found a way to even get my feet into the crack left side first.

Any ideas? I'm kind of at a loss for more ideas on how to move upward.

Shove your leg in and flex your calf.

Agreed. Sounds like a place for calf locks unless you can get in a scum of some sort... also try moving up stacks with an intermediate sidepull move.

Okay, gonna go back and try that. :)

I'd agree with the "sidepull move". I think that falls under the category of Leavittation. Get two heel-toe cams in with your right foot high and left foot low. Then sort of lie-back to the left, keeping your right palm on the left side of the crack to hold the lieback. Once you're there, walk both hands up in the lie back stance, until your right palm is 6-12 inches higher. Then get a new hand-fist stack at that spot, move both feet up, and do it all over again.

Meaty Calf locks do not work for me whatsoever, I have very skinny calves. Counter rotated (both feet rotating in opposite directions outward) heel toe works much better for me, sometimes with upper leg inserted all the way up to the knee which allows a wee bit of layback off the crotch of the knee itself with lower leg/foot dropped down beneath in counter pressure.

Note, all this sidepull/layback body english works better when the crack has sharper, more defined edges. Rotating feet, catching the crack edge along arch to heel of the shoe can provide a lot of purchase. And semi laybacking/sidepulling is easier than trying to layback smeared hands around a rounded flare (unless the rock is very rough anyway and provides a lot of grippy friction.)

When it works, the fastest progress then is by bumping the hand stacks intact, but sometimes need to also layback off the hand, release the stack, then move each hand once (walk hands up) in order to restack. The semi-layback/sidepull position also allows one hand free to place or bump gear.

Cooper - wrote: I'd agree with the "sidepull move". I think that falls under the category of Leavittation. Get two heel-toe cams in with your right foot high and left foot low. Then sort of lie-back to the left, keeping your right palm on the left side of the crack to hold the lieback. Once you're there, walk both hands up in the lie back stance, until your right palm is 6-12 inches higher. Then get a new hand-fist stack at that spot, move both feet up, and do it all over again.

LOL, pretty much ditto, you said it more succinctly. Except reverse right and left depending on which side of crack you are  working from, and likewise in corners... mirror image depending on Left or right.

And the first time your leg gets stuck, relax!

Is the crack flaring or are the edges fairly parallel? The technique varies greatly depending on the size, but I use traditional offwidth technique a lot unless the crack is very parallel and unfeatured: arm-bars and chicken wings, with heel-toes and foot cams. Wiggle your back and shoulders to make upward progress. Use your whole body.
I also use face holds whenever possible, but my feet and legs, as well as chest and triceps, are doing most of the work. Kick your inner foot up into the crack, twist into a foot cam/heel-toe, press yourself up with arm bars or swimming techniques, and then lock yourself in with your outer foot (heel-toe or otherwise). Using momentum makes the process more efficient.
Stacks and knee or calf jams come into their own on vertical or steep, parallel cracks. A well-placed high foot cam works as well as a calf jam for unforgiving sizes. I agree with hick about positioning the hand portion of the hand-fist stack so you can lieback/sidepull/gaston the crack when bumping your stacks.

Sloppy Second wrote: And the first time your leg gets stuck, relax!

And every time! Stupid 'Big Guy' caught my knee 3 times on my first time leading/climbing it. I was too eager to leave the calf locks behind and should have waited for the crack to get a bit wider...

The popularity of stacking limbs in climbing media doesn't mean it's always the best option for every wide crack.
If your OW is 5.7 its really likely that you can armbar your way up the thing, which will make learning to calf lock a lot easier.
This thing was probably put up on tube chocks well before stacking was popularized.