Girth Hitch as Tie In ?
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Thinking about people complaining about fig 8 being difficult to untie...why couldn’t you girth hitch the rope to your harness as a tie in? (Rope up through the tie in points, around the bottom strand, back down through tie in, then complete a retrace 8) |
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Yes. |
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Do you want to tie an 8 around the harness points, or make an actual girth hitch then finish with a bowline or something? Just use a Yosemite finish, and don't kill yourself with some reinvented solution to a problem that was solved decades ago. |
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I feel like that would become kinda messy and difficult really quick and not really sure how much it would do to help. If you're really concerned about getting the knot undone, people are really happy with the bowline or some overhand retrace knots. Might fall under KISS |
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I use a bowline with Yosemite finish. Easy to untie. |
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This is a solution in search of a victim... |
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The only time you should really be tying in with a girth hitch is when going into the middle of a line for glacier travel, aka using an alpine girth hitch (and even then there are downsides to using this system). Other than that this is a solution looking for a problem. |
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K.I.S.S. |
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t.farrell wrote: Thinking about people complaining about fig 8 being difficult to untie...why couldn’t you girth hitch the rope to your harness as a tie in? (Rope up through the tie in points, around the bottom strand, back down through tie in, then complete a retrace 8) Try falling on it and report back. It sounds like a safe enough experiment. My money is that a couple falls and the figure 8 will still feel equally hard to untie. |
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Tieing in with a girth hitch is called a cow hitch with a better half- essentially a girth hitch tied with the end of the rope. |
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t.farrell wrote: Thinking about people complaining about fig 8 being difficult to untie...why couldn’t you girth hitch the rope to your harness as a tie in? (Rope up through the tie in points, around the bottom strand, back down through tie in, then complete a retrace 8) There is already a solution to the figure 8 being too hard to untie after falls. The solution is a bowline, with many variations. I am not sure what is accomplished by your girth hitch PLUS figure 8 that isn’t accomplished with less bulk by any of the common bowline variations. |
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1.5/10 |
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Lena chita wrote: Just pondering stuff on a rainy day. I’m well aware of the alternatives. Couldn’t find anything in the internet about it so figured I’d ask here. |
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The figure 8 is 80% efficient compared to rope strength and a girth hitch is only 50% adding a girth hitch will weaken the system |
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I use a girth hitch when i tie in the middle of the rope. (i.e. single pitch <35m with one half rope). The advantage is that there is no bulk compared to two Figures of 8. |
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Whatever it was that Fran said....Either a bad troll, or tremendous idiot. |
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You know, I have lots of random weird thoughts that flow through my head. I don’t post questions about those thoughts on forums. |
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Lena chita wrote:People moved to figure 8s from bowlines as the bowlines (where were common to tie in with) were becoming undone and there were fatalities. Multiple. A figure 8 works great, never heard of one unting mid pitch. What I use to do when I was guiding and had a fat...**cough** heavier*** client who I knew would be hangning on the line was to simply run the rope an extra turn through the harness tie in point so its wrapped around there twice, then tie the figure 8 normal. Works great for easing the untying, is fast and near identical to the normal way. The only difference is that you wrapped the rope one more loop around the tie in points so it's a full circle. |
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A clean, simple retrace 8 will always be the preferred tie-in method as it is redundant and easily recognized by most climbers. If you reinvent the wheel, you decrease your margin of safety because you lose that broad recognition. |
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Billcoe wrote: People moved to figure 8s from bowlines as the bowlines (where were common to tie in with) were becoming undone and there were fatalities. Multiple. For me, this is not much of an argument. In the most general sense it becomes “Peopled moved to being couch potatoes from climbing as there have been fatalities with climbing. Multiple.”Or add any comparison like * sport vs trad * lower vs rap * rap with no backup hitch vs backup hitch * commute by bicycle vs commute by bus |
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Fran M wrote: I use a girth hitch when i tie in the middle of the roppe. (i.e. single pitch <35m with one half rope). The advantage is that there is no bulk compared to teo F8. Fran - I apologize for the harsh glibness of my earlier response. I re-ead yours and and your edit link (although link itself didn’t work). My take is that the article is further proof of “Climbing’s” slide, and Blake’s recommended “Tool for your bag of tricks” is in my opinion more like adding an anvil... Adding this, as he says, cuz you forgot more proper methods is needless at best, stupid at worst. But OK, to each his own reinvention of the wheel.In a more “realistic world” than his, I can just see a bunch of glacier gumbies in crampons and packs festooned with pickets, all tripping and flopping on the snow trying to extricate themselves from their “easy loops”... Then to your own specifics where I made some assumptions based on your statements. Correct me if I’m wrong here. You are tying into the middle of a single half rope with a girth hitch (to use two strands of a half strength rope with a half strength knot = risk homeostasis) to lead presumably... the potentially dangerous part is if you lead using actual half-rope technique-alternate clipping Or do you use twin technique on your half ? Don’t want to bog into too many details, but No matter how you cut it, I can see absolutely no advantage over a bowline on a bight for any of the applications discussed (save slightly more bulky)...no Biner clips (unless the tail for a backup) easy to untie, super strong, no diving through loops, etc. Articles in Climbing aside, I say just “don’t “ But then I’m just a noob so I may be mistaken... |