Rigid VS. Non Rigid Ice Climbing crampons

Curious as to what everyones thoughts were on Ice climbing Crampons.
I have been climbing this season with a pair of Grivel G12's they have been great; looking to expand the quiver.
Inbetween the Grivel Rambo's and the New Petzl Darts curious as to everyones thoughts 

Another crampon to consider is the Cassin Blade Runner.

There are pros an con to each set of crampons, so you need to decide what's the most important to you:

- The Petzl Darts are really light, but they don't have a replaceable front point and don't have the mini front points that the Rambos or Blade Runners have, which really help with stability on the ice (well, the Blade Runners do for sure, I've never used the Rambos.....which is discussed in my next point).

- The Grivel Rambos are nice, but I've never used them because they don't seem to fit narrow boots very well. They don't seem very adjustable if you want to make tweaks on the fly. Heavy.

- The Cassin Blade runners feel super solid because of the way the heel sucks up into your boot (which makes them feel stiffer too). Just make sure they fir your boot, because occasionally the way the heel is shaped won't allow them yo be put on properly (I've only seen this on one pair of ice boots however). Lighter than the Rambos, but still on the heavy side.

I climb on the Rambo's and like them.  Used to climb on G14s which were nice but Rambos are better.  It could all be in my head, but rigid crampons just feel more solid. Of course people climb real hard stuff in all kinds of crampons.  You should also check out the G21 or 22s?  They seem pretty popular.  Not sure if they qualify as rigid.

Rambos are hands down the best performing crampons out there, stable and solid. However they walk like shit

I think one thing to consider is your average approach; rigids aren't really intended for walking, were semi rigids are a lot more friendly.
Cassin products have durability issues, so, even though some folks consider Blade Runners a decent crampon, just look at all the durability comments that have been posted regarding Cassin tools.
I am also not a fan of BD crampons; stainless just doesn't compare to chromemoly
A semi rigid with a vertical front point(s) will suit you fine, and being that it looks like you are close to a major climbing area, take advantage and see what you can beg, borrow and steal.
I currently climb on an old pair of BD Bionics with Krokunogi front points
That being said, the most badass crampon I have ever used ;DMM Terminators

...The Petzl Darts are really light, but they don't have a replaceable front point and don't have the mini front points that ...

At Outdoor 2019, Petzl announced an update to their Dart crampons that makes them fully modular (similar to the existing Lynx) and replaceable, as well as changing the point geometry and adding an anti-balling plate. I'm assuming that's what the OP is referring to.

Another Rambo climber here.. love them and have been climbing on them with ZERO issues for over 10 years with Scarpas and Sportivas which they fit fine. I appreciate that the points are replaceable, though their forged steel really is incredibly durable.

I don't really see the benefit of having non rigid crampons in technical ice climbing to be honest.
The extra movement allowed in them seems to be a source of their destruction with countless stories of busted bails, and the few ounces of weight savings results in inferior stainless parts snapping.

I'd recommend the Rambos and never worry about your poons again.

a lot depends on your style:  as an "old school" ice-meister who was climbing wi5 before footfangs were invented, I'm happy in heavy boots and rigid poons - DMM terminators, because they damn well work, and because DMM continues to supply parts for them even though the Terminator was discontinued years ago -- long standing company policy, and a good reason why DMM customers tend to be extremely loyal...

but if you're younger/stronger/more gymnastic, and ambitious about modern "mixed" climbing, you'd likely prefer something lighter & less "clunky" -- like the dart.  and any climber who actually USES heel spurs would most likely prefer a much lighter boot than I do.

one critical factor of significance to alpine climbers is the tendency of rigid poons to collect/hold snow.  most alpine ice climbers I know avoid rigid poons for this reason.  I've resolved the issue for myself by creating custom anti-botts for my  Terminators from plastic detergent buckets

kinda boils down to would you rather climb on a boot/crampon combo that feels like standing on a ledge on WI6, or have a setup that enables to use your feet like hands on new-age-mixed ground?

Curt Haire wrote: a lot depends on your style:  as an "old school" ice-meister who was climbing wi5 before footfangs were invented, I'm happy in heavy boots and rigid poons 

Super Guides and SMC rigids!  Then Kastingers and Chouinard/Salewa rigids.

beccs wrote: Another crampon to consider is the Cassin Blade Runner.

There are pros an con to each set of crampons, so you need to decide what's the most important to you:

- The Petzl Darts are really light, but they don't have a replaceable front point and don't have the mini front points that the Rambos or Blade Runners have, which really help with stability on the ice (well, the Blade Runners do for sure, I've never used the Rambos.....which is discussed in my next point).

- The Grivel Rambos are nice, but I've never used them because they don't seem to fit narrow boots very well. They don't seem very adjustable if you want to make tweaks on the fly. Heavy.

- The Cassin Blade runners feel super solid because of the way the heel sucks up into your boot (which makes them feel stiffer too). Just make sure they fir your boot, because occasionally the way the heel is shaped won't allow them yo be put on properly (I've only seen this on one pair of ice boots however). Lighter than the Rambos, but still on the heavy side.

Yea I was referring to the new 2019 Darts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGfTwkeq5_8.  They would be going on my Nepal Evos

Timmy Rickert wrote: Yea I was referring to the new 2019 Darts. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rGfTwkeq5_8.  They would be going on my Nepal Evos

Be careful if you try the Rambo 4 on the Nepals. The boot might not be as curved as that 'poon likes.  I know it's a stretch, but consider that older boot models fit best with an older crampon style. A conversely poor match would be a Trango Harpoon/Footfang (straight heel-to-toe) on a lightweight Phantom series boot.

Gunkiemike wrote:

Be careful if you try the Rambo 4 on the Nepals. The boot might not be as curved as that 'poon likes.  I know it's a stretch, but consider that older boot models fit best with an older crampon style. A conversely poor match would be a Trango Harpoon/Footfang (straight heel-to-toe) on a lightweight Phantom series boot.

Odd.  I use the Rambos on Nepals with no problems.  But they are the old Nepals before the Cubes and all that crap.

Stagg54 Taggart wrote: Odd.  I use the Rambos on Nepals with no problems.  But they are the old Nepals before the Cubes and all that crap.

I don't know that there's a problem, just saying that "curve matters" and to be on the lookout for mis-matches. I also THINK that the various versions of the Rambo crampon over the years have become more curved to adapt to curved boots. What version are your Rambos? It's only the R4 that strikes me as radically curved.

Gunkiemike wrote:

I don't know that there's a problem, just saying that "curve matters" and to be on the lookout for mis-matches. I also THINK that the various versions of the Rambo crampon over the years have become more curved to adapt to curved boots. What version are your Rambos? It's only the R4 that strikes me as radically curved.

I wasn't disagreeing with you.  Sorry if it came off that way.  Fit totally matters.  In fact I would say it matters more than anything else.  I was just surprised with your choice of exmaple because I had never had any issues.  And yes I do have the Rambo 4s which do have a healthy curve to them.  I have seen the old ones and they are not as curved.

I can only recommend Rambos if you only plan go cragging with them and/or you absolutely have to have a heel spur.  And even then, make sure you get a version with the yellow rubber antibotts.  The ones with the hard plastic anti-bots (black) perform like roller skates, when flat footing on bulges.

I sold my Rambos because I wanted to use the same set of crampons for both crafting and alpine climbs.  Darts are almost as good for climbing  vertical / overhanging ice and much better for everything else. 

Gunkiemike wrote:

I don't know that there's a problem, just saying that "curve matters" and to be on the lookout for mis-matches. I also THINK that the various versions of the Rambo crampon over the years have become more curved to adapt to curved boots. What version are your Rambos? It's only the R4 that strikes me as radically curved.

No worries; my post was largely speculative and a caution only. I spoke up since I had a sole curve-related compatibility problem in the past with old poon + new boot. Charlet Grade 8 and SCARPA Freney XT, in case anyone is curious (though both are probably uncommon now). Your data point re. the R4 and Nepals is a good contribution to this thread.