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visit Utah early June versus August?

Original Post
kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608

Sharon + I are thinking about our first Climbing visit to non-SW Utah. We've visited many times in winter for backcountry and cross-country skiing (which once included some fun outdoor climbing in the low Wasatch front on a warm February day).

Likely have high-clearance but not 4WD (and not inclined to push my driving limits).

Since I've discovered from trips to France that I much enjoy quartzite + puddingstone conglomerate + limestone, I'm confident I'll find Sport climbing for me. But Sharon wants mostly the 5.6-5.8 range with easy approaches on this trip, so I'm concerned that's going to be mostly Trad or difficult approaches if we arrive early June.
Could she have more good options (Ruth Lake?) if wait until August?

Also for myself I like long easy ridge traverses, 3rd + 4th class, some low 5th solo is ok too. Is that mainly a Wasatch thing (which I could try already in May before Sharon arrives?) or are there good routes in the Uintas (or Henrys?) - (better saved for August?)

Thanks for your help.

Ken

ddriver · · SLC · Joined Jul 2007 · Points: 2,084
kenr wrote: But Sharon wants mostly the 5.6-5.8 range with easy approaches on this trip, so I'm concerned that's going to be mostly Trad or difficult approaches if we arrive early June.
Could she have more good options (Ruth Lake?) if wait until August?

I'm sure you'll get plenty of good responses, but I think the above concern is misplaced.  I suspect you'll find as much or more moderate sport routes with easy approaches in Big Cottonwood than you will in Ruth Lake or other Uinta locations.  Everything in Big is in season in June.  You can find easy sport in AF and at the Clamshell in LCC that time of year also.

Eric Chabot · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 45

In May the uintas will likely be full of snow, and if not they will have many many bugs. Also not much there below 5.8 but it really shines at 5.9-5.10.

Check out challenge buttress, redrum wall, the slips, and storm mtn in big cottonwood.

AF also isn't great below 5.10. there are only 2 crags (hard rock and serenity wall), one of which is gonna be really hot and the other is ahem recently developed aka choss.

bus driver · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2009 · Points: 1,531

Theres not a ton of difference in the weather between June and August. Either way, it will probably be hot. Most snow has melted from most places by June except for the highest north aspects. The Wasatch mountains will be fading from green to brown in June as the spring grasses shrivel in the heat. They will be brown and dry by August.  The sun sets pretty late in June so you can get more cool evening sessions in and otherwise just visit crags that will be in the shade.

Maple canyon will be good to go for either month and has a lot of conglomerate moderates with short approaches. Even some multipitch stuff. The Uintas can be good in May June or they can dry and mosquito infested or they can be buried in snow still.  You’ll just want to check.  August you’d be good to go there.  
Perhaps a visit to the City of Rocks too. Memorial Day is usually when it starts getting hot and crowded. But the walls allow for chasing shade. 
If you want a break from the tent, stay at Snowbird for a few days and climb the crags nearby.  There’s plenty of different rock types available without leaving the canyon.  Options include white limestone at the East Hellgate and Clamshell, multipitch moderate quartzite on Suicide Slab or 4th class up the S Ridge of Superior. Albion basin at Alta has sporty quartzite,  and long dolomite style routes at Devils Castle (find a partner, Devils Castle is likely above your lady’s comfort zone). Or, there’s shady north facing granite and bouldering down the canyon at PentaPitch and Stifflers Mom.  South side granite routes are good in the morning or evening.  The Albion Basin campground is a high elevation alternative to Snowbird but may not be snow free in June. 
You’ll want to reserve a campsite at Maple or City of Rocks for the most stress free camping experience. Www.reserveusa.com Weekends are particularly busy. 
You are correct that the long ridges will be easier to find in the Wasatch.  S Ridge of Superior is the one that comes to mind. Also some nice ones in Big Cottonwood Canyon.  In my opinion you’ll be be good to go either month and be able to find climbing that suits both of your styles but you just will need to pay attention to where the shade is or start early.  

Brian in SLC · · Sandy, UT · Joined Oct 2003 · Points: 22,419

Early June?  I ski pretty much into mid and sometimes late June most seasons in the Uintas.  There can be rock available to climb, but, the approaches will be snowy at and pretty damp at most locations.  Most Uinta climbing is at around 10k' in elevation.  And, when the snow does melt, the skeeters will be fierce until it dries out a bit.  

See Moosehorn below (18 June 2017).  That's a fairly short approach roadside crag in the background.  Snow is 10' deep at least.

August is full of monsoonal weather with some fairly heavy t-shower activity but also days where its ok.  Very hit or miss.  Uintas is a short season location for sure.  BCC isn't.  Gets hot in the summer but there's a bunch of shady crags.  Folks climb on the quartzite if its dry pretty much year 'round.

Upper elevation ridge traverses will likely still be snowy for sure in May, but, even into June (both Wasatch and Uintas).  Tons of scrambles in the Uintas.  Try "Scott" on summitpost for beta (he wrote a guidebook on the Western Uintas).

Maple would be great.  
Brian in SLC · · Sandy, UT · Joined Oct 2003 · Points: 22,419
bus driver wrote:The Albion Basin campground is a high elevation alternative to Snowbird but may not be snow free in June. 

Devils Castle 10 June 2018.  This year should have more snow (we're hoping but on track!).

The west-to-east traverse of the castle is one of my favorite scrambles in the Wasatch...
Ken Noyce · · Layton, UT · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 2,658
kenr wrote: Sharon + I are thinking about our first Climbing visit to non-SW Utah. We've visited many times in winter for backcountry and cross-country skiing (which once included some fun outdoor climbing in the low Wasatch front on a warm February day).

Likely have high-clearance but not 4WD (and not inclined to push my driving limits).

Since I've discovered from trips to France that I much enjoy quartzite + puddingstone conglomerate + limestone, I'm confident I'll find Sport climbing for me. But Sharon wants mostly the 5.6-5.8 range with easy approaches on this trip, so I'm concerned that's going to be mostly Trad or difficult approaches if we arrive early June.
Could she have more good options (Ruth Lake?) if wait until August?

Also for myself I like long easy ridge traverses, 3rd + 4th class, some low 5th solo is ok too. Is that mainly a Wasatch thing (which I could try already in May before Sharon arrives?) or are there good routes in the Uintas (or Henrys?) - (better saved for August?)

Thanks for your help.

Ken

Personally I always find that June is much more condusive to climbing than August for the wasatch, though obviously not for the uintas as they will still be snowed in.  That said, while there is some fun climbing in the uintas it is certainly not a destination I would make a trip specifically for, the wasatch on the other hand would be well worth it.  As far as the types of climbing you mentioned, in the wasatch you have quartzite in big cottonwood/mt. olympus, all over the Ogden area, and in Rock Canyon by provo.  For Limestone you have AF canyon, Logan canyon or Rock Canyon with some additional limestone crags scattered around a bunch of other areas.  For comglomerate you have the obvious Maple Canyon, but you also have Echo Canyon, and a bit more in City Creek Canyon.  For sport climbing in the 5.6 - 5.8 range with easy approaches, I can't think of any area in the world better than Maple Canyon, but you can find plenty of that in all of the areas I mentioned above as well.  As fas as easy ridge traverses, I'm sure some exist in the uintas, but because the uintas are a much older range than the wasatch, they tend to be less ridgy whereas there are a ton of ridge traverses that you can do in the wasatch.  Hope this helps!     

kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608

Thanks so much for all the help.
And all the specific suggestions for where to climb.

So looks like we'll start with June.
. . . (then decide to come back in August?)

. . . (? see if I do some backcountry skiing ?)

Ken

kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608

So now that we're getting into the details of thinking about reservations for flying + sleeping, we're running into that key point that always deterred us from even considering Utah as a summer climbing place:
It actually gets hot around Salt Lake.
. . . (and the long-term forecast for May + June this year is for significantly hotter than normal).
. . . (which I guess is why I kept talking about the Uintas).

Compared with our usual late spring / summer trips to the Eastside Sierra California -- where we have Mammoth and June Lake as familiar mid-elevation (non-hot) bases. To us the Salt Lake valley is like Bishop CA - (nice for early spring, but would not cross our minds to base there in summer). The obvious Utah equivalent to Mammoth Lakes is Park City, but seems like the Guardsman Pass road often does not get plowed open until mid-June. We called the Brighton Lodge and they said of course they won't be open any time around Memorial Day weekend because there's snow (which never stops them in February). Sleeping up in Little Cottonwood (in addition to being rather expensive) seems wierd to be driving down to the valley several days so Sharon can get to the fun quartzite over in Big Cottonwood.
Therefore . . .
* Sharon now wants to shift her dates to May.
* I'm more inclined to bring my skis.

We're sort of thinking we'll just "bite the bullet" and base in the valley. Thinking now of
Provo as a base.
. . . Sort of halfway between Maple and Big Cottonwood.
. . . Close to the southern Wasatch giants that I never got to ski (and I've skied on Timpanogos only once a long long time ago, never skied the main gully on Box Elder).
. . . I remember being disappointed when I figured out that most of the skiing in Tyson Bradley's Utah backcountry skiing guidebook was not accessible in winter -- lots more than just the Wasatch - (Tushar? Henrys?)

? Suggestions or Corrections about that approach?

Ken

P.S. Not sure why it took me so long to figure out the Wasatch as a spring skiing / climbing destination versus California.
. . . The Eastside Sierra is greatly over-rated as a corn-skiing region - (most of the slopes face north).
. . . Lots of nice Eastside ski runs have long / unfriendly driving or hiking approaches.
. . . Owens RIver Gorge seemed exciting as rest-day-from-skiing crag 20+ years ago, but lots new more
. . . . . interesting rock (in more attractive settings) has been discovered since.

kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608

Key stimulus in my thinking about northern Utah . . .
France last September I was working with lead local developer Philippe drilling 10mm bolts into fun moderate quartzite in a wonderful setting just 15 minutes off easy asphalt road in Le Monetier-les-Bains (see on MountainProject). I had found two nice pitches on an earlier trip top-roping with Sharon, and he was glad to bring his drill and stuff and hang on a rope with me. I assumed that I would pay for the hardware, but he said that was supplied by the national French climbing access org.

I commented that I was finding lots of the fun climbing in the world was on quartzite, and he agreed and mentioned other crags in France.
Then he showed the superiority his experience ...
Philippe said,
"I have climbed the quartzite in Big Cottonwood."

bus driver · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Aug 2009 · Points: 1,531

Get an air BnB in Cottonwood heights. It is right at the base between BIg and Little Cottonwood and right near Ferguson Canyon all those crags in are only 15 minutes or less.  It’s hot but manageable. We all climb then.  Both canyons have shady sides and sunny sides.  Ferguson is a walk up but it’s a nice approach and shaded by trees all summer. (Similar to crawdad canyon in Veyo in SW Utah).  Provo may be fine but it also may be hard to find a drink. 

Eric Chabot · · Salt Lake City, UT · Joined Jul 2011 · Points: 45
kenr wrote:
Philippe said,
"I have climbed the quartzite in Big Cottonwood."

Fwiw the quartzite in Utah ranks like this in my opinion:

Big cottonwood < uintas < ibex

...but ibex, which can be nice in May, is very isolated from other crags, harder to get to, and may be somewhat of an acquired taste. But it could be combined with corn skiing in gbnp which I heard is good...
kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608

Ibex seems rather interesting to me, since nowadays I normally reach SLC by flying into Las Vegas. And I've gotten into a habit of sport-climbing around St George.

So last year I bought the Utah west Deserts guidebook to look for interesting (cooler) alternatives "sort of" in range of StG + Vegas.  Somehow it did not hit me from the guidbook about quartzite at Ibex. So thanks.

Ken

kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608
bus driver wrote: Get an air BnB in Cottonwood heights.  . .  . 
 Ferguson is a walk up but it’s a nice approach and shaded by trees all summer. (Similar to crawdad canyon in Veyo in SW Utah).  

We do like Crawdad, tho last I checked it's not open for climbing outside summer swimming season. So thanks for adding Ferguson to our list of options.

Cottonwood Heights / Midvale "axis" we're very familiar with from skiing -- sleep near a stop on the UTA bus line. We started preferring to be near the rail line also, at the first stop of the bus, to be sure to get a seat.

That certainly qualifies as "along the way" between BCC + Maple.
I guess we were just looking to try something different. Sharon likes to do cycling on our trips, and I remember the Provo River trail as more interesting than the Salt Lake bike trails.
And she might want to do some hiking around Sundance. 
. (Maybe also we were hoping the indoor gym at Provo might be better than Momentum).

Ken
Brian in SLC · · Sandy, UT · Joined Oct 2003 · Points: 22,419
kenr wrote:. . . I remember being disappointed when I figured out that most of the skiing in Tyson Bradley's Utah backcountry skiing guidebook was not accessible in winter -- lots more than just the Wasatch - (Tushar? Henrys?)

P.S. Not sure why it took me so long to figure out the Wasatch as a spring skiing / climbing destination versus California.

Not sure what you mean about Tyson's book...I think all of it is accessible in the winter.  What good would a backcountry ski guidebook be if the routes described weren't?  What specifically are you referring to?

And, the Wasatch really isn't that much of a spring ski destination.  We're not cold enough (ie lack of high elevations) for a good corn cycle.  Backcountry is pretty empty of skiers in especially May.  Conditions just aren't that great and certainly not dependably "good."

That said, some of us ski into May and June, sometimes July every season.  And, there's those that have an every month ski thing going for many many years.
kenr · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Oct 2010 · Points: 16,608
Brian in SLC wrote:
> ". . .  the Wasatch really isn't that much of a spring ski destination.  We're not cold enough
> (ie lack of high elevations) for a good corn cycle.  Backcountry is pretty empty of skiers in
> especially May.  Conditions just aren't that great and certainly not dependably "good."

Thanks for the warning. I don't have to decide to bring my skis until ilke May 14, so I'll have a reasonable clue about snowpack and likelihood of clear nights / refreeze cycles by then. Anyway based on the long-term forecast, May second half 2019 is not a good bet for northern Utah.

Not sure what mountain regions you think _do_ have reliable spring-skiing conditions nowadays.
Sierra is famous and does have higher elevations, but its higher peaks are notably farther South than the Wasatch or Uinta giants. And the Eastside Sierra faces overall ENE, while the southern Wasatch faces overall WSW. Both main ridges of LCC have obvious skiable S faces - (I have skied the S face of Lone Pine Peak). The number of skiers out on the southern Sierra is not large (and many turn out to be visitors from Europe who likely did not consider Utah as an alternate destination). Lots of days the Sierra spring skiing is on slush or "heavy" powder, not refrozen corn.

Washington Cascades have only one peak higher than Utah, and notably lower percentage of clear-night-sky refreezes.

Europe western Alps (higher) in recent years has had a big problem with cloudy nights and warm temperatures in May. Eastern Alps forget about anything resembling reliable skiing in May.

Brian in SLC wrote

"Not sure what you mean about Tyson's book...I think all of it is accessible in the winter."

I mean accessible for "normal" semi-lazy backcountry skiers with roughly-normal vehicles, and without winter camping.
I have skied with a lifelong SLC resident rather smart + experienced who was eager to explore more stuff outside the tri-canyon Wasatch, and his assessment was that lots lots more fun backcountry skiing could be enjoyed if a couple of skiers bought sleds for access. Or if some highway departments or land managers would just plow some key roads in winter.

Tyson guidebook: My copy is in storage now. My recollection is that the Tushar range has some worthwhile ski slopes, but in winter it's a long slog in from Elk Meadows / Mt Hollow just to reach those peaks. For "normal" skiers, makes more sense to wait until spring for roads to melt or get plowed.

Henry mountains: I did not notice how it was easy to get near the high peaks during winter without sleds (or helicopter?).
Fish Lake plateau?

I'm happy to be educated by those who know the details better.

Anyway . . . my old impression was that France Alps just had way more skiable backcountry terrain than Utah. After reading the Tyson Bradley guidebook (which I am glad for), my impression changed to recognizing that Utah has a large quantity of worthwhile backcountry skiing terrain. Key difference in France Alps is that they _plow_ key access roads in winter - (and _maintain_ a higher percentage of roads drivable by non-high-clearance vehicles year round).

Ken
Marc801 C · · Sandy, Utah · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 65
kenr wrote: I don't have to decide to bring my skis until ilke May 14, so I'll have a reasonable clue about snowpack and likelihood of clear nights / refreeze cycles by then. Anyway based on the long-term forecast, May second half 2019 is not a good bet for northern Utah.
Don't worry about that now. Long term forecasts for the mountains greater than 5 days out are essentially useless.
Current example:
A week ago the models all predicted dry and storm-less until mid-Feb. As of today we're expecting 2'-3' above 8K' by Tuesday.
ddriver · · SLC · Joined Jul 2007 · Points: 2,084

kenr, it always helps when people post their hometown, if they have one, to get some perspective.

I think you're wildly overstating the heat factor, especially in June.  I climb in Big throughout the summer, even on 100 degree days (maybe 6 per year in July/Aug) it is very reasonable.  Same with upper Little.

Do not stay in Provo.  

grog m · · Saltlakecity · Joined Aug 2012 · Points: 70
kenr wrote:
We're sort of thinking we'll just "bite the bullet" and base in the valley. Thinking now of
Provo as a base.

Provo, while a lovely place, is not where you want to be based out of. You don't want to stay anywhere between Lehi and Spanish Fork because it is the heart of LDS country. Your food, bars, alcohol, entertainment, and fellow climbers will be very lacking. You want to be in Salt Lake County somewhere, and somewhere east of I-15.  

Marc801 C · · Sandy, Utah · Joined Feb 2014 · Points: 65
grog m wrote:

Provo, while a lovely place, is not where you want to be based out of. You don't want to stay anywhere between Lehi and Spanish Fork because it is the heart of LDS country. Your food, bars, alcohol, entertainment, and fellow climbers will be very lacking. You want to be in Salt Lake County somewhere, and somewhere east of I-15.  

^^^ What he said.

Woodson · · Park City, Ut. · Joined May 2009 · Points: 180
kenr wrote: I mean accessible for "normal" semi-lazy backcountry skiers with roughly-normal vehicles, and without winter camping.

Anyway . . . my old impression was that France Alps just had way more skiable backcountry terrain than Utah. 

There is no better access to great backcountry right out your car door than the Wasatch, or very few places rival the Wasatch for that matter. Both Timp and Little Cottonwood can be stellar in May, it just depends on the melt freeze and snowpack (which this year, we’re already 120% of normal, with another 4 day storm lining up). You might wanna try the linkup of corn skiing in the morning in Little Cottonwood, then climbing in the afternoon. Hellgate is primed w many bolted routes, 200 feet from the parking lot at Alta. Or, Big Cottonwood Works as well, It’s all close. All that being said, nothing rivals the French Alps! 

+1 for not staying in Provo. If you’re eating out (maybe) or wanting a cool cerveza, the airbnb suggestion for Cottonwood Heights is a good one. 
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

Northern Utah & Idaho
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