WildCountry Revo - First Impressions

I was going to buy my girlfriend a Revo for Christmas I guess I will hold off until the bugs are worked out

OK, quick and dirty writeup of my not-very-extensive experiences with the Revo so far.  

First off: I do not rope solo, nor do I care about rope soloing.

I spent a bit of time playing around with it on a spare rope on a climbing wall, and I have used it for 2 sessions in the gym, both top-roping and lead climbing.  My climbing partners took a few top-rope falls, and hangdogged a bit, but no one took any lead falls.  And we conducted a test of sorts where I let go of the brake strand (with a friend backing me up by holding the brake strand about 1 metre lower down from my hands) while my climber is hanging.  Said climber was prepared to fall for almost 2 metres but the locking assist function of the Revo arrested the fall after about a foot of freefall.

The device locks up when either strand is pulled at a speed that spins the wheel at 4m/s or greater.  So in theory, when lead belaying, the device can lock up on you if you whip out slack super quickly.  Whether or not that actually ever happens to you when lead belay is largely dependent on your belaying style and other situational factors.

Likewise, in theory, when top-rope belaying, the device can lock up if you VERY QUICKLY take in slack, this is probably easier to do if you ever employ the technique of jumping up while simultaneously taking in slack.

If you're climbing with fat or fuzzy gym ropes then you will probably need to choose your belay biner wisely.  Too fat of a belay biner and the belay biner pushes up against the rope, resulting in the device locking up frequently while top rope belaying.  I reckon most locking biners are probably not a problem in this regard.  I can speak from experience: AVOID the Omega Pacific Tephra.  The Simond Spider HMS BLC works great, and I'm sure many other belay biners do as well.

TOP ROPE BELAYING:

It functions very much like an ATC-XP BUT with LESS friction (especially when lowering) due to the rope doing a 180 degree turn wrapping around a spinning wheel instead of going through 2 sharp 180 degree bends. It feels like it has slightly less friction than the Omega Pacific SBG II (in the lowest friction setup - pictured here) when lowering, but roughly comparable to the Omega Pacific SBG II's second-lowest friction setup (pictured here) when holding a hangdogging climber WITHOUT the locking assist engaged.

As previously mentioned, the action of locking off the rope to hold a climber will prevent the locking assist from engaging, or staying engaged.  

Also previously mentioned was a way around it: if your climber calls for a take proceed to take up all the slack, but do not lock off yet!  Immediately use your other hand, your non-brake hand to push up both jaws.  Your thumb pushes up the jaws closer to you and your index finger pushes up the jaws farther away from you.  And then you may bring your brake hand down BUT you must maintain some slack in the length of the brake strand between the device and your hand to ensure that you don't pull the rope down over the engaged jaws, thereby disengaging them and releasing the locking assist.

Activating the locking assist while holding the weight of a climber does not appear to be possible.

While lowering there is a kind of "rattling" sound coming from inside the device.  The sounds make me think that the device is trying to lock up but the force of the brake strand holding down the farther jaws prevents it from happening.

LEAD BELAYING:

Ever since i started lead climbing (gym and single-pitch sport climbing) I have been searching for my Holy Grail of lead belay devices: a belay device that functions just like a tube, but has a locking assist function that activates when the climber falls and/or hangdogs.  I hate how the Grigri [2], Sum, Smart, Click-Up, Eddy, Jul 2, Matic, ATC Pilot, Cinch, Vergo, etc. require you to do something with the device (hold down lever, pull up on the loop/hook) in order to temporarily override the locking assist while you are quickly paying out slack, or, have your brake hand holding the brake strand in the not-so-locked-off position (Click-Up) to reduce the odds of it locking up while you are quickly paying out slack.

I was hopeful the the Revo would be it.

It's not quite it, but it appears to be at least 90% of the way there, far closer than any other belay device.

When it comes to paying out slack it is a dream come true.  Paying out slack is smooth and hassle-free.  No need to touch the device, let alone have to perform any additional actions beyond what you would do with a tube-style belay device.  Even when I was quickly whipping out slack for those high clips, or fast desperate clips, the device did not lock up.

None of my climbing partners took any lead falls.  

Really, the only thing the prevents this device from being 100% the Holy Grail of lead belay devices that I've been searching for for so long is that the only ways for the locking assist to activate are via the wheel spinning at 4m/s or faster, and by manually pushing up the two jaws with your hand.  So maybe not the best for belaying a hangdogger until you get used to the technique I described earlier.

The Revo is now my new go-to belay device for lead belaying in the gym and single-pitch sport.

The ATC Pilot and/or Jul 2 remain for now my go to belay device(s) for belaying a hangdogger.  This might change to the Revo once I burn into my muscle memory the technique for manually activating the locking assist.

The Omega Pacific SBG II will probably always be my go to belay device for belaying a non-hangdogging top-roper, or someone who is extremely unlikely to fall

Khoi wrote:

While lowering there is a kind of "rattling" sound coming from inside the device.  The sounds make me think that the device is trying to lock up but the force of the brake strand holding down the farther jaws prevents it from happening.

The Revo's lock cannot be overridden or disabled nor can it be loaded backwards which is why it is considered one of the safest if not the safest belay device on the market.  Even if you are holding down the jaws, preventing them from popping up, the lock will still engage.  I have personally tested this in 2 ways.  First, by lowering a climber fast enough to activate lock even though brake strand is holding down jaw and 2nd by holding down both jaws with my hand and doing a test pull with a rope.  By design the device will lock if the wheel spins faster than 4m/s no matter what the belayer does.  

And I absolutely agree with your assessment, I love this device but I wish there was an easier way to manually engage the lock while holding the weight of a climber.  The trickery required to manually lock them off will take some serious practice before I become comfortable doing it outside of a test environment.  

JDonigan . wrote:

Michael- I have had a similar problem with mine. although I only noticed it when taking weight or catching a fall and the forces of the 2 rope strands pry the device a little apart, it is enough to disengage the locking mechanism. not sure if mine will open as easily as yours without even touching the locking clasp. the locking carabiner keeps the device from swiveling open though. curious what WC has to say. 

I found using a locker with fat bar stock prevents the device from rotating open.  I was using a thinner locker and noticed the locking lever on the Revo open up, this is a non issue as the device still works just fine but in the future I'll be using a cheap fat BD locker I have that prevents any opening or rotation.

Kevin- thanks for the suggestion, I posted in another of the existing threads about the revo as i'm sure you're following and will see. 

I used the Revo all day yesterday on single pitch, multi pitch and top rope and it worked just like it was supposed to.  The complaint some have had about the locking mechanism lever opening slightly is most likely due to using skinny locking biners.  Using a thicker bar stock biner eliminates that issue all together.   The locking mechanism IMO is not needed as the locking biner holds the device shut  in the same way the Grigri does.  The locking mechanism if you look at it is not meant to hold a lot of weight, the biner takes the weight.  I would not be surprised to see the locking mechanism gone in future variations of the Revo.

Michael A Parker wrote:

... it is considered one of the safest if not the safest belay device on the market....

Who do you represent?

IMHO until we've had a significant number of users and a few accidents we don't really know how safe it is.

On Wed, I climbed with in trio who had one. All three of us belayed with it for the first few rounds. Only the guy who owns it was willing to take test falls from the anchors, and it caught him just fine. It feeds like a dream, but lowering is not buttery smooth.

It probably should be noted that after a few rounds, all three of us went back to the devices we preferred before: I use a megajul, another guy uses a grigri2, and the revo's owner used an ATC XP toothed tuber in high friction mode to belay my lard ass when on lead because the revo locked pretty consistently when lowering me. As the leader being lowered, I found it to be pretty jerky and halting, but we concluded it's likely because I'm so much heavier than the other two since they had smooth rides down.

Tradgic Yogurt wrote:

It feeds like a dream, but lowering is not buttery smooth.

Thats funny, I thought it lowered much smoother than my Grigri or any device I have.

Tradgic Yogurt wrote:

 and the revo's owner used an ATC XP toothed tuber in high friction mode to belay my lard ass when on lead because the revo locked pretty consistently when lowering me. As the leader being lowered, I found it to be pretty jerky and halting, but we concluded it's likely because I'm so much heavier than the other two since they had smooth rides down.

So the revo guy was incapable of holding the rope and constantly dropping you even though he was just lowering you, might want to rethink climbing with that person.

Tylerpratt wrote:

yup. only reason why i use a fuckin gri LOL

Pretty much.  Nothing worse than trying to boink on an ATC...

It’s pretty cool that you managed to get your ox cart to move with triangular wheels, but I think I’m gonna stick to my round ones.

that guy named seb wrote:

So the revo guy was incapable of holding the rope and constantly dropping you even though he was just lowering you, might want to rethink climbing with that person.

His lowering technique is just fine, I have no complaints being lowered by him on an atc or a grigri. It seems to be the nature of the revo to lock up a lot while lowering.

Tradgic Yogurt wrote:

His lowering technique is just fine, I have no complaints being lowered by him on an atc or a grigri. It seems to be the nature of the revo to lock up a lot while lowering.

How the heck does the Revo lock up if the belayer is holding the brake strand DOWN over the jaws of the device??????????????????????????????

Khoi wrote:

How the heck does the Revo lock up if the belayer is holding the brake strand DOWN over the jaws of the device??????????????????????????????

Fine, pick different words. I'm just reporting my experience with one.

Tradgic Yogurt wrote:

Fine, pick different words. I'm just reporting my experience with one.

You described your experience being lowered with the Revo, and you attributed the reason for the jerky and halting lower to the device.  

I'm trying to figure out how that can be the case.  I only know of one way to lower with the Revo, and that is the exact same way as lowering with a tube.  In said lowering method the brake strand pushes down on the jaws, thereby preventing it from locking up.  So I am VERY CURIOUS to hear of your experience, especially if it is actually due to the device, and not due to the belayer's less-than-proficient use of the device, resulting in a jerky and halting lower.  I can see maybe if the belayer is lowering a heavy climber, then they may not be used to a device that has less friction when lowering, hence resulting in a jerky and halting lower.

However, if your belayer was actually able to get the device to lock up while lowering, then I, and other users of the Revo, really want to know how he/she did it!  Like we have pointed out, it does not appear to be possible to get the device to lock up while the climber's weight is on it.

Khoi wrote:

You described your experience being lowered with the Revo, and you attributed the reason for the jerky and halting lower to the device.  

I'm trying to figure out how that can be the case.  I only know of one way to lower with the Revo, and that is the exact same way as lowering with a tube.  In said lowering method the brake strand pushes down on the jaws, thereby preventing it from locking up.  So I am VERY CURIOUS to hear of your experience, especially if it is actually due to the device, and not due to the belayer's less-than-proficient use of the device, resulting in a jerky and halting lower.  I can see maybe if the belayer is lowering a heavy climber, then they may not be used to a device that has less friction when lowering, hence resulting in a jerky and halting lower.

However, if your belayer was actually able to get the device to lock up while lowering, then I, and other users of the Revo, really want to know how he/she did it!  Like we have pointed out, it does not appear to be possible to get the device to lock up while the climber's weight is on it.

One of the main features of the Revo is it is (supposedly) impossible to override the autolock mechanism. If the rope is running through the device at more than 4m/s it will lock even if the jaws are being held down.  To unlock it in this case you have to lift up the brake side to let the jaw pop up then pull it back down.  If it was jerky and locking up it means the belayer was lowering too fast for the device and just needs to adjust their technique for a slower lower.

Khoi wrote:

How the heck does the Revo lock up if the belayer is holding the brake strand DOWN over the jaws of the device??????????????????????????????

It has two different ways of locking. It will lock if you exceed a certain speed, no matter how you hold the device or rope

If the device locks up while you are being lowered, your belayer is lowering you too fast. PERIOD.  Lowering on the Revo was incredibly smooth and was easy to keep it under control, even when lowering a 200lb climber.  However, if it does start picking up speed the device will lock, preventing climber from decking at an unsafe speed.  I know a lot of belayers that lower at unsafe speeds on an ATC and try to slow you down just before you hit the ground.  This isn't a game I like to play and am glad it locks up if the belayer lowers you too fast.  

Matt Robinson wrote:

One of the main features of the Revo is it is (supposedly) impossible to override the autolock mechanism. If the rope is running through the device at more than 4m/s it will lock even if the jaws are being held down.  To unlock it in this case you have to lift up the brake side to let the jaw pop up then pull it back down.  If it was jerky and locking up it means the belayer was lowering too fast for the device and just needs to adjust their technique for a slower lower.

Ah, yes, I forgot about that feature even though I watched it being demonstrated in the Wild Country video on the Revo.

So, if that is the case, then Tradgic Yogurt's belayer was lowering him at a rate of 4m/s or faster, which meant that he would have dropped 1 metre in 0.25 seconds, or half a metre in 0.125 seconds.  I don't think that is a speed that one should make a habit out of when lowering.

So there are 2 possible explanations for the jerky and halting lower:

1) Belayer was not used to the lower friction lower and was abruptly increasing and decreasing their grip on the brake strand.

2) Belayer was lowering too quickly.

EDIT:

3) The rope was a stiff and/or thick rope

I 100% agree if it locked while lowering someone was lowering way to fast, and it must have been hands free.  I used it for a few hours and TRIED to get it to lock on a top rope lower and was unable.  That is the part that scared me.  I kept an incredibly loose grip on rope and the climber fell way faster than I am comfortable with and I still couldn't get it to lock.  Now in defense of the REVO it was double looped at the top of the anchor so there may have been enough friction to not allow it to catch.  To me after that lower I seriously think you would have to go hands free to get it to lock on a lower. I'm sticking with my grigri after using it, it fed like a dream but the size, inability to easily lock up will cause me to stick with the tried and true grigri.  

Thanks