Scarpa vapor lace fit compared to TC pro?

Both shoe to shoe euro size and fit in terms of toe box and heel widths?

I'm 42.5 TC pro, wondering what size vapor lace to consider

I wear a roomie 42.5 all day fit in TC pros.   I wear a 42 in vapor lace.  They are a perfect fit for me and make the suction noise when I put them on.  I can keep them on for a whole gym session but wouldn't want them on for any longer.  Sometimes I take them off at the gym.    I have a wide forefoot and average heel.   Scarpas fit me extremely well without pinching the front of my foot.   Hope that helps.  

-Greg

40.5 edging performance tc pro (ever so slightly knuckled big toe).

41 vapor v performance fit, lace is exactly the same last.

Thanks, Very interesting. Seems a very different comparison comparing TC pro to Vapor vs comparing to Scarpa Techno X where people are commonly having to size up 1 or 2 whole sizes. Seems Scarpa's climbing shoe sizing is all over the place between different models.

I wear 38.5 TC pro: was a tighter edging shoe, now a comfy crack shoe. I have a pair of 40 bumble bee colored Vapor Lace that I can't climb cracks well in yet. It's about the same length as my 39 Katana Lace. So, 1 euro size difference between Sportiva & Scarpa is about right. There are some variations between models within each brand.

Compared to the TC, the Vapor lace toe box is narrower and has more asymmetry and a bit more downturn (similar to Katana Lace). The heel was a bit more snug as well but it's relatively soft so it can probably accommodate the same volume. 

mountainhick wrote:

Thanks, Very interesting. Seems a very different comparison comparing TC pro to Vapor vs comparing to Scarpa Techno X where people are commonly having to size up 1 or 2 whole sizes. Seems Scarpa's climbing shoe sizing is all over the place between different models.

Scarpa is actually pretty consistent EXCEPT in the techno X (pos shoe IMO). 41 is performance fit for vapor V, instinct velcro, or booster S. I had technos in a 41.5 and they stayed in a knuckled big toe fit for a flat last after 30-40 pitches.

Have you checked out SizeSquirrel? It literally solves this problem. 

Check it out: sizesquirrel.com

Eddie Ferrer wrote:

Thanks for the suggestion, Yes I have, but the Vapor lace is not even available as a result, and the results for the vapor V are entirely unclear:

For TC pro 42.5 there is a single lonely result

For TC pro in adjacent sizes 42 and 43, there are three more results which suggest a range of same size to size up 1 1/2 sizes.

4 points of data is not statistically consistent nor of useful sample size for anything definitive. It absolutely does not "literally solve the problem".

the stats including responses here and size squirrel for 42, 42.5 and 43 TC pros:

size down by 1/2 size: 1

fit same size: 1

size up 1/2 size: 1

size up 1 full size: 3

size up 1 1/2 sizes: 1

Hardly conclusive with only 7 points of data, but at least there's a trend

I am a 41 in my scarpa vapor lace, pretty tight fit, they kill my feet on longer slabby routes and I get a suction noise with them. 41 in TC pros seemed more comfortable, less knuckled. 

I'd say for the same size, the vapor lace is a bit tighter than the TC Pros. I second the Techno X thing. The 41 was unbearable in these.

Got the best data today on my own feet. I had the opportunity to try them on. I wear 42.5 TC pro, the vapor lace in 43 is a bit too snug, but I think will be a good performance fit once broken in. The 43.5 would be comfy after break in, perhaps becoming a little sloppy for me. The forefoot is a little too wide in the 43.5 as well. I also tried Tenaya Tatanka 42.5... narrower in the forefoot and side edge a tiny bit more solid feeling, but didn't feel like I could pull with the toe quite as much. Both of these have less downturn than any other downturned shoe I've tried, and seems I can tolerate it. Going to ruminate a little before deciding...

reboot wrote:

I wear 38.5 TC pro: was a tighter edging shoe, now a comfy crack shoe. I have a pair of 40 bumble bee colored Vapor Lace that I can't climb cracks well in yet. It's about the same length as my 39 Katana Lace. So, 1 euro size difference between Sportiva & Scarpa is about right. There are some variations between models within each brand.

Compared to the TC, the Vapor lace toe box is narrower and has more asymmetry and a bit more downturn (similar to Katana Lace). The heel was a bit more snug as well but it's relatively soft so it can probably accommodate the same volume. 

I recently ordered a couple sizes in the vapor 40.5 and 41 I think (though it might have been 40 and 40.5), and I found them incredibly tight and uncomfortable. I ended up going back to La Sportiva and getting the TC Pro's in a 39.5, which is about a tight a fit as I can stand. 

Reason I make this post at all, is that my understanding was that Scarpa, in general, has a wider toe box the La Sportiva, as folks generally comment that LS is a better fit for narrow feet. It's a purely anecdotal analysis, but I just didn't find that to be the case with the Vapor's  (YMMV), which seems to be a similar experience, echoed by Reboot. Definitely worth giving both a fitting, but I felt like I would have had to size the Vapor's potentially a size and a half larger than the TC's, and as we all know, you've got to try them on your own feet to be sure. 

My take now: 

The scarpas just run smaller in length. Based on my foot, a 43 1/4 Vapor lace would be equal to 42.5 TC pro in length.

In width, my previous/older TC pros (5 years or more ago) were perfect width for me. Second pair also very good. My third pair came wider in the toe box (too wide) which is 1/2 the reason I am seeking another shoe. The other 1/2 reason is if I can tolerate a sight downturn it will be helpful for some pulling on more than vertical terrain. 

The Vapor laces I tried today, 43 was the tiniest bit wider than my older TC pro fit, not as wide as the newer ones. The 43.5 was a little baggy in the toe box.I don't know if there are variations pair to pair in the vapors that would make a difference.

Digging this one back up since there seemed to be quite a bit of knowledge around the specific shoes I am interested in.

I'm interested in trying Vapor Laces or Vapor Vs, as an alternative to Katana Laces.  Here's the situation:

(10.5 street shoe)
TC Pros - 43.5 - All day trad but still good performance, I can sport climb near my limit in these.
Katana Lace - 43.0 - Aggressive fit for sport climbing, have to come off every pitch, make my feet sore.  I only use these for redpointing and hard onsights.
Katana Lace - 43.5 - Slightly less aggressive, but still need to come off every pitch, make my big toes sore.

I bought the larger Katana Laces to try to get that Katana performance (which is awesome) in a fit that would allow me to wear them for trad/sport multipitch.  Sadly, it hasn't worked out that way.  I think there is insufficient height in the area around the big toe which puts a lot of pressure on the top of the nail and makes my feet sensitive?  Who knows...

So, for those of you who have used the Katana Lace and the Vapor, how would you compare the fit and performance?

Thanks!

44 la sportiva, 44.5-45 scarpa

10.5 street shoe

42 Katana Lace just barely tolerable, don't own these anymore
43 Katana Lace "normal" one-pitch fit, painful to stand on toes for very long, heel tension bothersome after a while

43.5 TC Pros big toe not touching the end, felt useless, returned for 43s
43 TC Pros comfy yet usefully snug, can wear for 5+ pitches, could go down to 42.5 for a performance edging fit

44 Vapor Lace quite snug (good fit but not what I was looking for)
44.5 Vapor Lace comfy, toes still sensitive, somewhat baggy heel

Vapor V seemed less tight in the same sizes, like 43=performance, 43.5=snug, 44=comfy, but I've only tried these on, I don't own a pair.

For me, Katana lace, 42.5. Perfect fit. Except my heels hurt sometimes.  

Vapor lace, 43. Perfect fit. Except my pinky toes hurt sometimes.

TCpro, 42. Feels a little sloppy. 

Miura 44 performance fit
TC Pro 44 performance fit.
TC Pro 44.5 All day, toes flat
Vapor Lace 45.5 were tighter than the 44 TC
Ordered a 46 as I want something that can do several pitches

I also wear Force V in 44.5 performance and 45.5 all day
Street shoes I’m a perfect 45.5 TX3 shoe. 

Ha, two of my favorite shoes. My take (wide foot):

TC Pro 40.5 all day/MP shoe. flat toes
Vapor Lace 41: sportclimbing, slight curl, not crazy tight
Vapor Lace 41.5: trad, still relative performance
Vapor Lace 42: MP shoe, flat toes.
Miura Velcro: 39.5: sportclimbing, similarly sized as Vapor 41. (But la sportiva may have changed the sizes on these? tried another 39.5 and that one was way tighter).

So for similar sizing it appears scarpa ~= sportiva +1 or +1.5

*all my vapor lace's are the old orange model, no idea how the new yellow one fits.

Kyle Tarry wrote: Digging this one back up since there seemed to be quite a bit of knowledge around the specific shoes I am interested in.

I'm interested in trying Vapor Laces or Vapor Vs, as an alternative to Katana Laces.  Here's the situation:

(10.5 street shoe)
TC Pros - 43.5 - All day trad but still good performance, I can sport climb near my limit in these.
Katana Lace - 43.0 - Aggressive fit for sport climbing, have to come off every pitch, make my feet sore.  I only use these for redpointing and hard onsights.
Katana Lace - 43.5 - Slightly less aggressive, but still need to come off every pitch, make my big toes sore.

I bought the larger Katana Laces to try to get that Katana performance (which is awesome) in a fit that would allow me to wear them for trad/sport multipitch.  Sadly, it hasn't worked out that way.  I think there is insufficient height in the area around the big toe which puts a lot of pressure on the top of the nail and makes my feet sensitive?  Who knows...

So, for those of you who have used the Katana Lace and the Vapor, how would you compare the fit and performance?

Thanks!

You should check out SizeSquirrel, my original post on this thread was over a year ago and the site has grown tremendously, and our matching algotihm has been greatly improved as well. It recommends -.5 size from my Vapors to the Katanas... which seems to correlate with what people are posting in this thread...

Just to add some info into this thread on sizing, in case it comes up on somebody's Google search:

10.5 street shoe

43.5 Katana Lace (pretty snug, comes off every pitch)

43.5 TC Pro (multipitch shoe, pretty comfy but still performs well)

45 Vapor Lace (feels very similar to the 43.5 Katana, probably a tad larger)

So, +1 size between these two seems about right to me, similar to what other folks said.