Mt Sill Swiss Arete conditions - crampons and ice axe required?

We're planning to climb the Swiss Arete at the beginning of June. Wondering if cramps and an ice axe are necessary for the approach along the side of the glacier before glacier notch, and to traverse the bottom of the L-shaped snow-field to the base of the arete. A couple descriptions I've looked at suggest they aren't necessary, but was hoping for other opinions from those who have climbed it. It's early season and a heavy snow year (well, heavy compared to the past couple years). I'm hoping they aren't necessary - I don't own so would have to rent.

Thoughts?

Thanks.

I haven't been there that time of year but can guarantee that you will need crampons, an ice axe, and will also need to know how to use them. A slip on a 20 degree snow slope can kill you.

^^+1 . Climbing a snow slope without axe and crampons is a bad idea. Its better to bring them and not need them, than go all the way in and have to turn around due to inadequate preparation.

Agreed - take an ice-axe and crampons, you're going to need them for the glacier, the gully up to Glacier Notch, and the L-Shaped Couloir, plus descending all of that too - I'm assuming you have a permit.

Thanks Chris. That's what I was looking for - direct info from someone who's done it. And yeah, I reserved the permits a while back.

The Supertopo suggests you can avoid the glacier by hiking on the talus slope above the east edge of the glacier, and you can avoid the L-shaped snow field by hiking below it to the sit-start of the arete. But based on your description it sounds like this isn't a valid option. We'll bring crampons and axe.

Where are you planning on camping? That will determine your approach to Glacier Notch. I usually camp in Sam Mack Meadow and take the left gully out of there, underneath the moraine then up onto the moraine ridge which heads up toward Thunderbolt, then contour around the glacier to the base of the gully. But that's a long approach for this climb. I'm sure there'll be an acceptable amount of snow so you can probably pick your route.

Here's someone's photo of Temple Crag from 3 May. The base of the Swiss Arete is roughly the same elevation as the summit of Temple, so I wouldn't count on being able to skirt the snowfield right now, in an El Niño year. If temps are warm at a minimum bring an ice axe. If it's cold at night you may need crampons in the morning for Galey Notch or get a later start.

@Chris - We're also planning to camp at Sam Mack meadow. The map and description I've been looking at shows a 'trail' leading from the beginning of Sam Mack meadow to Gayley camp (granted, I've never been to the area so I can't say from experience). Then from Gayley camp you skirt the east side of the glacier to Glacier Notch. I see what you're talking about though, where you take the gully toward Thunderbolt, then contour around on the moraine ridge through Gayley camp. We'll have to make a game-time decision based on the conditions, but I suspect we'll take the trail directly from Sam Mack to Gayley camp, since that seems like a shorter approach. Obviously open to hear your thoughts though.

@Fossana - Nice find on the picture, thanks. Sounds like the Glacier Notch is pretty shaded in the morning, which further emphasizes the need for crampons + axe, unless, as you mention, we get a late start and the snow softens.

When the snow conditions are good a more direct approach (bypassing Sam Mack) is to go straight up the drainage from Third Lake past Galey Camp. This means you'll need to be able to cross the N Fk of Big Pine either at the dam at Second Lake or the seasonal snow bridge/log jam at Third.

Have fun and post pics!

Awesome, good to know. We might do that direct approach depending on conditions and what other people are feeling. Thanks for the tips!

Fossana's option is great if you don't want to go to Sam Mack Meadow, about the same distance as the Meadow approach but adds a 1000 feet of elevation gain. Here's a diagram of the Sam Mack approach, about 2 miles and 2200 feet of gain to the bottom of Glacier Notch - pray for snow in that gully.

Here are two photos from May 4:

Nice, looks like a good bit of snow still. We'll see what it's like in 2 more weeks.

This is the approach route we are planning to take - glacier trail. Looks like it goes up the steep slope on the left at the beginning of Sam Mack meadow, then heads to Gayley camp and around to glacier notch. Have you done this approach? Would you recommend yours over this? Thanks.

fossana wrote:When the snow conditions are good a more direct approach (bypassing Sam Mack) is to go straight up the drainage from Third Lake past Galey Camp. This means you'll need to be able to cross the N Fk of Big Pine either at the dam at Second Lake or the seasonal snow bridge/log jam at Third. Have fun and post pics!

I used an Ax and pons.... and I think the best way is to go just like Fossana says.... Cross at second lake, and go up along Temple Crag... do this at like 4a when all is frozen and you will beat the folks going via Sam Mac. Sam Mac is the way to go to U notch....

have fun, I rate the SA to be one of the best mt. climbs in the Sierra. Don't get lost on the route... remember the FA was done using pitons, thin ones only, don't get suckered into heading up the good looking hand cracks at the crux, remember they did a "tension traverse" to the right, with Knife Blade for the pro.

Happy, safe climbing.

Thanks Guy. Looking forward to the trip. I'll let you all know what route we end up doing and what the conditions are like. Appreciate all the beta.

We camped out on the Palisade glacier two weeks ago split boarding, it's still winter time up there. We hit snow at 3rd lake. I'd definitely take some sharp pointy stuff to travel around up there. The rock is definitely starting to thaw out and shed. Even if you don't need them on the up...crampons are a game changer on the way down.

Took the trail once in 32 years when I soloed Starr's Route on Sill, late season, no snow in the back of Sam Mack Meadow. I agree with Guy about the more direct approach to Sill from Third Lake, but I have a problem with altitude sometimes so camping at Sam Mack Meadow has been helpful for me when climbing the next day - less elevation gain. Camping at Third Lake will give you an easier backpack haul, compared to camping at Sam Mack Meadow. There's a really nice campsite at the creek crossing before heading up to Sam Mack Meadow - but I wouldn't recommend that if doing Sill. Looks like you have a few options so pick one which works for you.

Chris.... I like to camp at 2nd lake. I suffer from elevation sickness too, if I try to sleep above 10,000 I wake up sick... and then need a few days to get usta the elevation.

c-gator.... If your a really good climber you might wish to look at "Dead Larrys Piller" its a 5.10... and is left of the SA, looks mind blowing, steep all the way to the top.

I found the climbing on the SA to be challenging, your doing moves at 14,000... the 4th class at the top had my vision turning into "black and white dots" pretty cool, no? And its a long way back down to your car.... anybody who can do that CtoC is a monster.

take pics

Thanks for the beta, everyone. The trip was great.

To circle back on this: ice axe was mandatory, unless you are braver than me. You could get away without crampons if hiking later in the day when the snow softened for kicking steps, but with a pre-dawn start crampons were required (and much better than the post-holing later in the day).

We camped at the nice campsite just after third lake and the glacier trail junction. This made the approach to Sill pretty long in the morning, but there was no snow there and a great spot to camp. Snow started on the slope to Sam Mack. Sam Mack itself was mostly snow, and Glacier trail leading from Sam Mack to the glacier lake was mostly snow, with bits of dry rock and trail. Going from glacier lake to Sill we ended up walking around the right (west) side of glacier lake and crossed the glacier to glacier notch. This was much easier and faster than our friends who took the left (east) side of the glacier which was slower due to snowy talus. Glacier notch was mostly dry (and very loose, as many have already mentioned). The Swiss Arete was a blast. All solid, fun moves. There was some snow on the route, but it was easy to avoid.

Our friends were going to summit via the 4th class Starr route, but they turned back because the 4th class portion before the summit was fully snow covered. On the descent we rappelled (two single-length, one double-length rap) this section due to the loose, soft snow, and long tumble down if you slip. The rest of the descent in the afternoon to third lake was glasading down the L-shaped snow field and the steep section of the glacier, then walking through soft snow with more post-holing than one would wish.

Regardless, an excellent trip. Some photos...

Guy- Dead Larry's Pillar looks wonderful. If it were at 4000 ft I'd love to jump on it. Alas, my confidence and ability spirals downward at 14k ;)

Fossana- You're approach beta seems good, but we didn't do it because it looked like an inconvenient mixture of talus and snow. Plus we couldn't resist hiking around the beautiful third lake. Definitely a good option if there was more snow.

Chris- In retrospect I think your approach out of Sam Mack would've been best given the conditions. Glacier trail was a bit grueling due to the mixture of soft snow and boulders.

Way to Gooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!!

Good climb, no?