Am I using my Petzl Basic wrong?

All the threads lately got me curious about solo top rope and I thought I'd give it a shot. I couldn't find a micro traction locally so I picked up a Microscender and a Basic. The Microscender is sweet, I'm really impressed with it, but I can't figure out the best way to use the Basic.

I started with a configuration right out of Petzl's solo toprope guide.

Looks good, until I weighted it. Then it looked like this.



I didn't like how the carabiner swings under the ascender, and I especially don't like that it hits the black plastic handle that opens the ascender at the same time as it is basically pulling the rope away from of the groove that it sits in.

So I tried it a different way, with a bungee cord chest harness, and carabiner attached to the bottom of the ascender. This seemed much better to me. It eliminates my above concerns, and the chest harness keeps slack out of the system. I used 5' of bungee cord. I didn't want it on the back of my neck so I put it over my shoulders and clip it to the back of my harness. It looks kind of like suspenders.



Except that it's exactly what the manufacturer tells you NOT to do with an ascender.



I recognize that the probability of it failing in either configuration seems pretty low, but I would like to have more confidence in this piece and my ability to safely use it. This is a rare incidence when my own risk assessment is directly opposite of the manufacturers recommendations.

So what do you guys think?
-either way is fine?
-attach to the top?
-attach to the bottom?
-???
-take it back and get a microtrax?
-make a friend solo toprope is lame?

Pretty sure it's backwards in the first photo, you should have the biner in the bottom hole like your second photo. Also the new version of the basic isn't recommended for tr solo because it doesn't lock the rope in like the old version did

Edit: found this guess i was wrong

mountainproject.com/v/10652…

Using the carabiner through the top hole helps secure the rope in the basic, and should help keep it from becoming separated from the older type ascender, as one plus. Not so much with the new design.

In your chest harness photo there is no security for the rope. An odd angle fall and the rope could come out. If using this setup maybe place as small a carabiner as you can through the top hole. It cannot hurt from what you already have going on.

I would recommend using a quick link connection for the microcender. With it trailing you, the carabiner can get in a funky position sometimes and you may not be able to always tend to it.

Personally, I use the Rescucender as my primary and the Microcender as my redundant device. I climb in a dry and ice free environment for the most part, so I don't use toothed devices for this purpose.

I would also recommend you have your system down pat and know how to rescue yourself before launching.

Be careful using things in a way not recommended by the manufacturer. With all of this said, I might suggest getting a device more suited for the task (not so floppy, big, can trap the rope, etc).

Edit to add:
Also, make it a habit to always lock your lockers. Even just playing around with the setup. Helps you not to forget when it really counts.

Top hole to chest harness (or equivalent), bottom hole to harness is exactly what's illustrated in the Petzl manual for my Basic Ascender. But the comment above is spot on: the new model of the Basic is not "approved" by Petzl for TR self belay due to the redesign of the upper hole. I have one of the earlier models which IS OK'ed for self belay if you want it.

Good info here. I appreciate everybody's help.

I think part of the confusion is that I didn't realize the different generations of basic ascender were so different. But, I also feel that Petzl's website has conflicting information. See the picture below, the drawing shows an Ascention model, the text below it lists the Basic as an acceptable primary device (no mention of whether that is the new or old model). Then below that, there is a picture of the NEW version of the Basic. The picture of the NEW Basic shows up at the bottom of every single page of the solo toprope guide,

However after digging a little deeper I found this, which indicates the new Basic isn't acceptable. I feel dumb for not catching that earlier, but hopefully this helps clear things up for others so they don't make the same mistake.



Also, Big Feet's suggestion to use a quick link for the Microscender seems like good advice. Taking that one step further, I could actually girth hitch the device and also girth hitch the other end of the loop to my harness and not have any metal pieces to potentially cross load. The cool thing about the Microscender is that you don't even have to remove it from the rope when you switch to rappel. You can leave it attached and it becomes a backup to your rappel device.

Lastly, I totally agree about practicing the system before really climbing on it. That's why I'm playing with these devices 2 feet off the ground in my garage. My original intention was mostly to practice switching over to a rappel, but I found that after a few test runs, I had all these other questions.

Chris Nebel wrote:All the threads lately got me curious about solo top rope and I thought I'd give it a shot. I couldn't find a micro traction locally so I picked up a Microscender and a Basic. The Microscender is sweet, I'm really impressed with it, but I can't figure out the best way to use the Basic. I started with a configuration right out of Petzl's solo toprope guide. Looks good, until I weighted it. Then it looked like this. I didn't like how the carabiner swings under the ascender, and I especially don't like that it hits the black plastic handle that opens the ascender at the same time as it is basically pulling the rope away from of the groove that it sits in. So I tried it a different way, with a bungee cord chest harness, and carabiner attached to the bottom of the ascender. This seemed much better to me. It eliminates my above concerns, and the chest harness keeps slack out of the system. I used 5' of bungee cord. I didn't want it on the back of my neck so I put it over my shoulders and clip it to the back of my harness. It looks kind of like suspenders. Except that it's exactly what the manufacturer tells you NOT to do with an ascender. I recognize that the probability of it failing in either configuration seems pretty low, but I would like to have more confidence in this piece and my ability to safely use it. This is a rare incidence when my own risk assessment is directly opposite of the manufacturers recommendations. So what do you guys think? -either way is fine? -attach to the top? -attach to the bottom? -??? -take it back and get a microtrax? -make a friend solo toprope is lame?

The last image you provided is what cavers typically do when ascending fixed lines, although they usually use the Petzl Coroll. The reason why Petzl says not to do that is they assume you are not using an upper body harness or straps of sorts, and so if you were trying to use that method without an upper, well, try it and you will see in an instant why it's a problem. However, it's acceptable with a upper body sling or harness to hold it with the old Basic. I have not used the new one, however, and therefore cannot really comment on it's suitability other than the harness setup you have indicated in the photo is standard in caving.

Reviving this from the dead, having been messing around with the new Basic and Croll for rope soloing-  

What 20 kN said is right, using a Basic or Croll with a chest harness (improvised or not) works suitably (this is in 'frogging' style single rope technique).  When caving, I always use a croll, but that only really matters because it is attached directly onto a metal d-ring that sits parallel to my body, and the froll's lower attachment allows it to sit flat. It's top is also more conducive to a non-improvised chest harness (like the Petzl Torse).  Since climbing harnesses are flexible and you're attaching it with a biner or maillon, this distinction doesn't really matter.  I've used a basic as a chest based ascender attached with a biner through both my tie in loops (though realistically on the belay loop would also be fine) and with a sling to keep it up.  

The way Chris originally attached his basic works in original models. As Chris later noted, the new model is not recommended for this due to risk of carabiner interfering with the catch. But I've found that with a properly shaped carabiner or maillon, there isn't actually any angle at which this interference can occur.  Nonetheless, I still only use this as my second point of attachment, after the croll with the chest harness for rope soloing.  Anyone else feel free to chime and tell me I'm going to die (actually though, will happily take critique).  Still going with throwing safety knots below occasionally.

(Unrelated, but for ascending, I use either a basic or a croll in the chest location, and then another ascender attached by sling to my harness with another, long sling to serve as a foot loop.  The second ascender ideally is a basic or croll, but also can be a friction hitch of some sort since you are manually raising this one)