Who Uses DMM Phantom Carabiners?

I am considering buying some of these as racking biners for my C4s and Totem cams. I have been using Neutrinos, but would not mind shaving a few ounces off my rack. It would be great to hear opinions on the DMM Phantom. GO!

Very Nice Biner - similar in size to the neutrino. A bit small for my oven mitt hands though. Prefer the Spectre 2 which is 33g. Wish they made the Spectre2 with notches design but they're bringing it to the smaller size first with their new "Chimera".

The Chimera looks sweet. However, I am not sure when it will be available and if I want to wait for it.

What's wrong with the camp photon? is it the 2kn less breaking strength?

Tom Sherman wrote:What's wrong with the camp photon? is it the 2kn less breaking strength?

Photon doesn't have a shrouded nose, the wire gate isn't as smooth and the rope radius or "rounded edges" of the forging wear funny and get sharp.

DMM, IMO, has one of the best designed carabiner lines around with lots of little things being well thought out.

Tom Sherman wrote:What's wrong with the camp photon? is it the 2kn less breaking strength?

I have never seen one of the Camp biners, but have read some pretty unfavorable reviews. Again, this is all internet chatter, but supposedly the qc on the photon is pretty low.

Do you use them? What is your impression of them? I am not totally opposed to them, but not too excited about them at this point.

Mmmm, thought you were going to say something about the nose, but confused here. How is the phantom any different? Looks like it doesn't have a hood or a flare to protect notch.

I just saw Outdoor Gear Lab has some trash to talk about the Photons, but that being said all these commentary seem minutia in respect to a racking biner.

Now i'm interested to see how my bolt-end alpine draws, photon biners hold up over time.

Ya I use them for all my cams, i see other's do this as well. I've only been climbing for two years and only been using the photons ~8 months, so what do I know? But they have a huge gate opening, feel good in my hand, and are super lightweight. No complaints.

I'll take some pics of my bolt end biners on my alpine draws tonight. I had though to myself when I bought, i wonder how these are going to wear, because the photon seems to be the most pronounced of all the i-beam designs. It literally is the structural shape of a wide flange curled around into a biner. Unlike all these other products which give you some bar stock to curve around.

EDIT: and I can say i like the handle of them better than my neutrinos, if that says anything.

I really like the dmm alpha trad biners. They come in a colored rack pack to match your C4s. Kinda spendy but they handle really nice, especially with the clean nose.

Camp photons are great. Super light, cheap, and really big. Ive been updating my rack and almost souley have these on all my cams and alpine draws

NC Rock Climber wrote: I have never seen one of the Camp biners, but have read some pretty unfavorable reviews. Again, this is all internet chatter, but supposedly the qc on the photon is pretty low. Do you use them? What is your impression of them? I am not totally opposed to them, but not too excited about them at this point.

I haven't had any QC problems with the Photons...the only criticism I've seen is the lightness of the gate tension, which can allow them to cross-clip each other on your harness, but I haven't noticed that either. On the plus side, they are very light and open wide, so they are easy to clip and handle, especially clove-hitching larger diameter ropes. I don't generally pull rope through them on tension much, so I haven't seen any wear issues related to the exagerrated i-beam design either. They will snag more than a keylock or hooded carabiner, but most wire gates are of this design. The Phantoms are tiny...I've used them on other people's racks and find them to be small enough to cause problems in certain scenarios, but if you have small hands and thin ropes, they may be "just right"

I rack my cams (Dragons, Totems, and Master Cams) with DMM Phantoms. My partner racks his cams (C4s, C3s, and X4s) with BD Neutrinos. Honestly, there's not a ton of difference between the carabiners. I think the DMM Phantoms handle a little better.

Personally, I'm a little biased towards DMM. Their products are high quality, well designed, and very aesthetic. The biggest advantage I see to the Phantoms is the 9kN open gate strength, especially at a weight of 28g. I doubt it makes much of a difference overall, but it's one more thing to give me confidence on lead.

Camp Photons boast the same open gate strength with a weight of 29g. For the price, they could be well worth it. I've not handled them, so I can't give you any further insight on them.

I use the bd oz on my totems and aliens ... Works just fine

;)

I have Photons to rack a lot of my cams, I really like them. I haven't seen any issues with sharp edges wearing into them, but I think this can happen on any biner really. I have a Metolius Mini biner that developed a pretty sharp edge along the center raised rib in the rope radius. Used some emery cloth and smoothed it out.

That said I got my rack packs of Photons, 8 biners in each one, for $40-something a pack. They do what I need them too, but I love DMM stuff too. I have Dragons and 4CU's. The Dragons are beautiful cams and they work the balls, had the red one hold a whipper on two lobes after it walked. If it's between Neutrinos and Phantoms and you don't mind shelling out the cash, get the DMM's.

Thanks for all the posts. Actually, one of my partners just reminded me his "shitty biners" are photons. So, I have used them and was not all that impressed. They are light and cheap, I will give them that, but imho they are not in the same league as DMM or even BD.

I went ahead and purchased a 5 pack of the DMM Phantoms and am going to give them a shot. I'll post up after I have used them and let you know what I think.

NC Rock Climber wrote:Thanks for all the posts. Actually, one of my partners just reminded me his "shitty biners" are photons. So, I have used them and was not all that impressed. They are light and cheap, I will give them that, but imho they are not in the same league as DMM or even BD. I went ahead and purchased a 5 pack of the DMM Phantoms and am going to give them a shot. I'll post up after I have used them and let you know what I think.

"Poor little pizza, ain't good for nothin'. "

Anyone used the Edelrid nineteen g? The lightest carabiner

I have a couple DMM Phantoms, and they are OK. They would be great, but that annoying 'hook-nose of death' keeps them from being so. Try Heliums instead.

I tried some phantoms in the store and liked the action a lot, but the size (smaller than a BD oz but bigger than a CAMP nano) gave me pause.

Regarding nose-snag: I contacted DMM a little while back about the chimera biner (hooded nose version of the phantom). The rep estimated that they would be available in the states April, but it was just an estimate.

NC, let us know how those phantoms feel in use.

I've been using the Cypher Ceres II and been pretty satisfied. Good action, no snag, great price! ($35 for 6)

cypherclimbing.com/products…

Thad, how do the ceres compare in size to other carabiners (neutrinos and ozs might be a good benchmark).

Also interesting to note that the ceres are the exact same 'biner as the Trango phase:

trango.com/p-291-phase-rack…