Softshell Opinions? - Jackets

Primary uses will be ice climbing, skiing, alpine climbing,etc.

Anyone have an opinion about the following softshells?

Arc'teryx Gamma MX Hoody

Mountain Hardwear Dragon

Patagonia Windproof Talus Hoody

I have a Gamma MX and love it. I've never had anything that held up as good as this jacket ice and alpine climbing. It's Bomber, but expensive.

I have a Gamma MX Hoody. Definitely recommend this jacket. The dragon has windstopper so will be much less breathable, and kinda defeats the purpose of having a softshell IMO. Im not familiar with the windbloc in the patagoochi jacket but is likely similar to the dragon. The gamma is your best bet of the three if you want an actual soft shell (that is one that breathes).

I have owned two soft shells, both I still use interchangeably.

Patagonia Dimension - one of the first regulator series softshells.
Love it, still climb in it regularly and it's DWR is still alive and kicking after 8 years.

Arc'teryx Gamma MX - I like it. It's stretchy, warm and comfortable, but maybe not worth the 375 dollar price tag.

Most soft shells are really similar these days, stretch woven, DWR and weigh about the same give er take...My advice is to get the one that isn't going to break the bank and that fits the best on the budget you have...

is the gamma mx a laminate? I can't see spending as much as a gamma costs but they are pretty popular.

I've been beating a Patagucci ascensionist for 1.5 years now, all seasons but the hottest summer alpine weather. It survived an avalanche with 1 hole that i patched. I've worn in up some chimneys and off widths. It's really breathable which is great leading ice. I wore it for the bike Iditarod too and it resisted quite a bit of warm, wetish snowfall though it is definitely not waterproof. I intend to keep it until it dies. Mine is just over 17oz. Oh and i've seen them on sale under $100 several times.

The only thing i'm sort of tempted by is a hybrid softshell with waterproof shoulders like the eddie bauer or rab ones.

i wouldnt bother with a dead bird soft shell unless you can get a crazy sale ... most softshells are at the point where there is no functional difference between them if they use the same material

personally unless youll be using it in -15C and below weather all the time, i wouldnt get a membrane softshell ... ie. polartec powershield, windstopper, WB400, etc ... ... they dont breath as well as an event waterproof jacket, and when the DWR wears off in the field itll absorb water ... the whole point of a softshell is breathability, youll overheat in a membrane softshell going up with a pack if its anything warmer than -10 to -15C

go with either a non membrane softshell such as double weave, shoellerdryskin, etc ...

note that colin hailey just uses a fleece and windshirt and calls it a day ... thats the original softshell concept ... pertex and pile ... though its more likely R1 and Houdini now ... lol

the Gamma is honestly overpriced, over rated and made over there ... i have both a gamma sv and lt ... and i rarely use them

read more here ...

andy-kirkpatrick.com/articl…

coldthistle.blogspot.com/20…

verber.com/mark/outdoors/ge…

No the Gamma is not a laminate. This is its benefit over the softshells with windstopper/windbloc/etc. because it will breathe during high output activities such as skiing or climbing. And yeah its really burly. I've had mine for close to five years and dragged it over tons of rocks and aside from some wear on the wrist cuffs there are no other visible signs of wear. Yeah its expensive but cost per year is low if it lasts 5-10 years.

Yeah Gamma is no longer made in canada which sucks. And the mx is certainly lighter than the sv and heavier than the lt and WILL get used.

gamma is a laminate ... polartec powershield ... windstopper is more breathable ... i should know since i also have a dead bird solano ;)

i start overheating on day walks in my gamma lt, with a light midlayer underneath in -5C temps ... breathability at that point is stretched to the limit ....

i cant imagine bringing that thing up on an ascent and not overheating on the way up ... and be soaked in sweat

only saving grace is that its durable so gets used occasionally as a summer "belay" jacket

as said by others ... do with a weave softshell, or a fleece/windshirt ... or go yuppie and look cool while overheating =P

if youre dead set on a dead bird ... ill sell you my medium black gamma sv hoodie and lt ... excellent condition

I have the MX Hoody and love it. Very durable, breathes well, is warm, and blocks out wind and spindrift, and best of all.... it FITS ME. That's my biggest complaint with most of the performance clothing out there, it's still designed for fatties or for folks sporting it while walking to brunch in Manhattan. Arcteryx seems to keep climbers in mind, so the sleeves are relatively longer for climbing and swinging tools, the pockets are placed such that they are useable with a harness on. And the garments overall have a slimmer profile - plus they have tall versions, which makes it even better.

edit to add: when going alpine climbing, where breathability needs to be maxed and weight minimized, I go with separate insulating and wind layers... current setup is a NanoPuff and MontBell wind shirt. Combined 200g savings over MX hoody, and more versatile.

I've been using the Patagonia Ascensionist for about a year and a half now. I'm actually on my second one, since there was some issues with the seams. I've climbed ice, snow, and rock in it. I've also cross-country and tele-skied in it. It ain't waterproof, but it breathes, stretches, and dries fast.

The talus hoody is nice, except that it has insulation to it, which limits you to very cold or very low output days. I have a separate, custom made jacket for that, although Patagonia's fleece lined softshells have always been good.

The Dragon will not breathe as well as the Gamma MX or the Ascensionist, and will be about even with the Talus Hoody, but will be colder.

Huh ill be damned I guess I didnt realize that powershield is a laminate. It certainly isn't like windstopper though - I've found it to breath better. And as far as I know its not waterproof like windstopper. Either way Im not complaining with mine.

windstopper aint waterprooof .... i found out the hard way ;)

shoulda realized that if it was it would be called "waterstopper" ... before i got rained in

Ah. I have found my source of confusion. I am mixing up laminate and membrane. Laminate just implies how the material is applied to the jacket. The Gamma has a laminate but no membrane (I think).

Well the windstopper material is waterproof but is not seam sealed which is why you get wet (at least thats what I thought).

Thanks everyone for the information and opinions.
I tend to be a warm person especially during the approach.

What is a recommendation from RAB? What other jacket from Arcteryx, Mountain Hardwear, Patagonia, etc. that is less insulated?

Thanks

Agree with everything Bearbreeder said. I have the Gamma MX hoody. Because of the fleece lining, the jacket is an overkill for any high-output aerobic activity. And I live in the NorthEast where winters are way colder than where you guys are, and I'm female (i.e. am always cold). In fact it is so warm I wear it with a mid-layer on below zero windchill cold days at ski resorts riding chairs (well sometimes it has to be supplemented with a sip of Jameson, but it's still pretty warm and I don't look like a Michelin man like everyone else on the mountain). If I were to spend that kind of money I'd look into Patagonia M10 or Stretch Element shells or some of RAB shells made with eVent.

The Ascensionist is not insulated at all. I run average for men temperature wise and during high aerobic output it's been good for me down below -20F (Alaska or northern Minnesota) with only layers that fit underneath. For winter on normal early AM Park approaches I wear only a cap 1 base layer and the Ascensionist, regulating temp with the zipper and a hat and pace. I add an R1 hoody on top when I bust out of the trees unless it's really warm.

Im not the sure the breathability of the Patagonia H2NO will help much. The event in the RAB jackets would be excellent however. And yes the Ascensionist would likely breath very well also.

Dang. This conversation has me wanting another jacket for the arsenal. The Ascensionist is on sale at:

patagonia.com/us/product/pa…

Anyone have and used the First Ascent Front Point? What about the Patagonia Guide Hoody?

Dang, at $149.40 on sale for that Patagonia Ascensionist, I want one of those! But wait, I already have one. Sweet!

Go for the Ascensionist... it's awesome.

Coop,
Check out these from Rab
Fusion Jacket I am waiting for Rab to make this in a bright color. I have the pants and they are now my favorite climbing pant hands down!
Exodus Jacket cool soft shell that is really weather resistant. Climbed in a waterfall this past week and didn't get wet. Breathes really well to is a stretch-woven material no laminate or membrane
Vapour-rise Lite Tour Jacket This is my go to jacket amazing breathable jacket that does great when slogging up hill for miles
Vapour-rise Lite Jacket same as above without a hood

Fusion Pant Hybrid pant that breathes well and has waterproof seat and knees
Treklite Pant Great all around climbing pant good for Rock and Ice really stretchy
Exodus Pant Really cool stretch woven pant OK for ice but is a better BC ski pant.

Do you still have my contact information email me if you want more details
Dallen

my most used softshell is a MH chockstone that i picked up for $50 ... works fine with cap4 down to -10 to -15C or so when active ... below that i throw on my atom lt

at that price the ascentionist at 150$ vs the dead bird gamma mx at 375$ ... no contest

or just use a fleece and windshirt ...