Pinnacle Peak - Potential access issue

I talked with Pinnacle Peak Park staff yesterday. They are having problems with climbers not leaving the park before closing - especially on the weekends. By management rules they have to stay until everyone is out of the park. Not only is this inconvenient for the staff it also has the potential to put a strain on the park's already tight budget. The staff are getting very frustrated with the apparent lack of cooperation by some climbers.

Pinnacle Peak is a great place to climb. Please don't mess it up because you can't seem to realize that the park closes when that big bright yellow ball in the sky hits the horizon. When in doubt get out of the park early and hit Greesewood Flats for a brew.

Dief wrote:By management rules they have to stay until everyone is out of the park.

Paul,

Since things are usually about money (tight budgets and all); I know when I have to pick my kids up late from day care/after care I have to pay so much cash per minute after the appointed closing time. I have to pay it right then that night. Needless to say, I usually get them before the place closes . . .

This sort of system might give the steward/City some possible reward for their late night (cash in hand for whatever leisure activity they're off to for the evening) and gives the late leaver (whether climber, trail runner, whatever) a reason to get out of there on time? The steward is there anyway if the person/people get out late . . .

Appropriate limits could be placed on such a system as to when to call in the police/rescue, etc. Sort of an incremental system instead of the hard shutdown sort of thing?

Kind of tongue in cheek here, but hey, we all know that municipalities and people are usually motivated by cash? Seems like a potentially workable market based solution . . .

$5/minute? . . . Cash, Debit, Credit . . . Install a large digital readout at the entrance area that is visible from the Peak (but not the neighbor homes of course)? Cool.

Fred

It's pretty lame that the rangers have to wait for everyone to leave. I know, it's the "rule". It's just a bad rule. They should leave and lock the gate when there shift is up. If the people's car is locked in the gate then tough. They should have read the sign that says to get out by sunset or whatever the verbiage is. Leave them a ticket while they are at it. If the rangers didn't have to stay, then climbers could just park outside the gate. Everyone wins! But that isn't an option because of that rule.
That said, a rule is a rule and climbers need to obied by them so that access does not become an issue.

My wife and I were climbing here last year and we were hustling out of the park about 15 minutes before sunset when a ranger accosted us as we came off the trail. The exchange went something like this:

"You guys need to be out of here!"
"Sorry to cause trouble ... but I thought the gates closed at sunset?"
"Well, it is sunset!"
"Hmmmm ... looks like the sun's still above the horizon, boss."
"You climbers always think you can get away with something, don't you?!"

As we were loading the gear into the car, the same ranger was pleasantly saying "Good night" to a number of hikers coming off the trail. So if that's the kind of "trouble" the park staff's referring to with the climbing community, then I just don't get it.

I wonder if climbers get out late more often than hikers. If so I can understand the ranger's attitude. That doesn't excuse rudeness though.

I'd probably still be married if I got home on time more often after climbing there. Stuff happens and we may over stay due to unfortunate circumstances. Or whatever reason people give for being tardy. Including hikers.

I wish we could be up there at sunset again. You can't. Unless you fly. It is now an early bird area. Sad.

Hey everyone,
I just want to add, due to personal experience, the rangers DO NOT stay there until everyone is gone, they will merely call the Scottsdale Police Department, and shut the gates to the parking lot and leave. Also if you get caught up and need to still climb after night (My friend and I were climbing the summit from the North side, and needed to climb up to rap back down) they will write you up for Trespassing on City Property, a misdemeanor with a $113.67 fine if an adult or avg of 10 hrs of community service if a minor (I did mine at the park itself). This is after we explained our situation to the police, and courts. If you end up needing to be there after dark, for your own safety, I suggest you don't rely on the police. They won't bother to try and help you, but yell at you from the street with a loudspeaker.
So try not to get stuck having to be there after dark/sunset in the first place.

Happy Climbing!

- PPG -

I was the first court victim! We were coming down from South Crack and our rope got stuck. Had to go back up and retrieve it. We were told we were 15 minutes late getting to the parking lot and the police were already waiting for us. We were actually parked in the street and not in the parking lot. Even though we spent 20 or so minutes writing up the police report with the sun still on us, there was still plenty of daylight out when we drove away. I kinda question "what defines sunset?" Anyways $113.67 paid in court. You can not talk yourself out of the ticket no matter what. There are two boxes to check on the court ticket. Its either you pay the fine, or you reschedule to a higher court and get a lawyer to defend you. I paid the fine.

I still climb a lot at Pinnacle Peak, but leave a lot earlier to avoid the ticket. Rules are rules, however I believe the park closed way earlier that day than sunset. I believe they now have a sign that states the sunset time.

Rock on! Marty

The monkey o' steel and I had a unpleasant little note on my car after a day of climbing there. We ran (RAN) down the trail and, seriously, hit the parking lot at 6:02, and we'd parked outside the gate.

Ranger left a business card on the car that said "next time, you will be baned". Yeah, "baned". Still have the card somewhere.

Really happy about my experience there. Climbing was great, though.

-Brian in SLC