Adze or hammer...age old question

Ok this is probably one of the most killed subjects ever, but I need advice. I'm looking to get a set of new tools and have been looking at the charlet moser aztar. The reason is the multi purposeness of them, for waterfall and mountaineering/alpine. However since I want a mix of the different aspects, what is the opinion on the 2 hammer or adze. I want to be able to use them for alpine, but I'm not too sure about the adze on waterfall. Does anyone use the 2 hammer for alpine or mountaineering etc? any help would be appreciated.
Scott

I've debated this too. In general if you're using them in Colorado or similar, I don't see a need for an Adze. IMO, you can usually whack the ice with a hammer then the pick on waterfall ice, if you're trying to clear for a screw. On big mountains/longer trips, an adze can come in handy. Otherwise if you're not doing that, I'd personally forego the adze and possible lobotomy. Some tools do have interchangeable adze/hammer. Nonetheless, if I go alpine with only one tool, I ALWAYS choose the hammer. Never know when you need to re-set an existing pin, pound in a picket, etc.

BTW -- I'm done with CM tools and Crampons. They are constantly changing the picks -- forcing you into a generic one a few years after the tool has been on the market. These don't usually work as well or are uncomfortable on the hand with sharp angles under the palm. On the crampons -- they have the worst design ever for the antibott plates for the M12 (?) crampons that came out a few years ago. Using the instructions (which were horrible) neither my partner or I could figure out how they were supposed to attach while in alaska. And, I do have an engineering background... just a sub-par design for a $35 piece of rubber.

Avery

I think Avery's points are good, it really comes down to personal style, etc. If it were me, however, I'd probably go with a hammer/adze set, more versatility. In an alpine setting using an adze seems much faster if you want to chop a bollard, using the pick later for fine tuning. I've also used an adze, admittedly very, very rarely, to chop steps in ice. I can't comment on the Charlet quality issues that Avery mentions, but will say I still use my somewhat old BD X-15's and appreciate the design which allows me to upgrade with BD's new picks. Anyway, food for thought.

I'd go with two hammers. Definitely for waterfall ice. If you plan a trip where you expect to be on snow most of the time, buy an adze and just switch out a hammer for that trip only. A headache is easier to deal with than a laceration.

Hammer and hammer. Unless most of the time your on alpine ice or money wasn't an issue. If you are going alpine and you want adze type activity maybe just suffer and cut with a pick. If steps are the reason then you may have to put on the crampons earlier.

Depending on your climbing, the most versatile combo is one adze/one hammer.  Unless you are doing solely ice falls, an adze is a necessity. Personally I need both, as an adze is a must for snow bar anchors in crevassed terrain.  In a pinch it also makes a better anchor than a hammer.  And how are you going to dig that anchor trench with a hammer ?  In doing a varied climb of steep snow, ice and crevasse, while also considering gear weight, the adze/hammer combo is the most logical. In extended trips. Or else you would need a snow bar in addition to both your tools.  An adze could also double as a snow bar in these situations, so why not just bring the adze to act as a bar and reduce weight ?  I had this very issue on Mt. Blanc.  After eight hours of hiking, skinning, ice climbing and crevasse rescue this combo proved to be the most versatile.

Jeffrey Frankenstein, this whole thread is pretty pointless 12 years on why you gotta play god?

Top-notch necro, right here.

Jeffrey went on a deeeep dive!

Can we make this question current? Hammer, hammer, versus hammer, nothing, versus nothing, nothing, versus hammer, adze.

Double adze or bust.

Ryan Pfleger wrote: Can we make this question current? Hammer, hammer, versus hammer, nothing, versus nothing, nothing, versus hammer, adze.

nothing/nothing.  fingernails only or its AID.