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how to send?

Original Post
ilya f · · santa rosa, california · Joined Jan 2021 · Points: 0

there's a route that has moderately difficult climbing for the first half (about 3 letter grades below my max), then a hard move i always fall on that's about halfway up, and easier but non trivial climbing to the top. if i instead climb an easy route right next to the hard route, stop at the move, hang out and rest, and then give the move a good try, i can do it maybe 25% of the time. if i immediately stop after that attempt (success or failure), rest and give the move another try, almost no chance of doing it.

what should my strategy be in trying to do the route? am i strong enough in terms of power? seems like it since i've done the move in isolation multiple times. do i have enough endurance? seems like training more of easier climbing wont help that much, although maybe i am wrong and need to be totally fresh leading up the move. i guess, do i train the move to be easier or the climbing around the move to be easier?

i'm guessing the answer is yes, but maybe someone will have advice on a strategy that might be more effective than another.

new to training, sorry if dumb question.

Luke Lalor · · Bellevue, WA · Joined Sep 2017 · Points: 10

Nobody can tell you if you can send a route or not. Here is how I approach a project with a cruxy section after some non trivial climbing.

Have you really sussed out the section below the crux for perfect beta / rests? How tired do you feel coming into the crux? Do you have crux beta dialed? Super dialed? When you try it together how close are you to sticking the move you fall on? Could more reps get you there?

It is kinda pointless to ask if you can do a route now or should train. That is a personal question. If you train more it will get easier. That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t (or should) project it now. What do you want to do?

Austin Donisan · · San Mateo, CA · Joined May 2014 · Points: 669

Doing a move 25% off-the-dog is pretty low percentage. And you can't even try it twice in a row? You need to explain that more.

As described I don't think you have a chance of doing this unless you find better beta or get stronger. If you want to work it anyway I would "lowpoint" the crux. Hang 1 bolt before the crux and try from there. After that works try from hanging 2 below the crux, etc.

ilya f · · santa rosa, california · Joined Jan 2021 · Points: 0

thanks austin, that's helpful. i'm still trying to formulate the right question to ask.

the move is holding a big 45 degree angled pinch on a vertical wall, high above my head and pulling up off of that with a really bad right foot smear. to engage the foot, i need to scrunch my body, resulting in me pulling the pinch in a less optimal direction. anyway it kind of takes a lot of my strength to keep pinching it while gathering up my body. i have less power for it the second attempt and it's already low percentage because my foot often slips anyway. so it feels at my limit but i've done it.

i was not trying to imply "give me shortcut" to send. i haven't really projected much so i don't know how to approach this situation from an improvement perspective. what should i focus on (vaguely) in the next month to maximize my chances? focus on power to make the move easier? focus on endurance to make getting there fresh? focus on the move itself and just throw myself at it to see if i can get past it in some easier way?

again, probably everything. your answer about 25% off the dog being low percentage - when you work moves on a project route and you say "i can do all the moves so now i can begin linking it", is that literal - "i've been able to do each move at least once", or is that more "ive been able to do each move pretty comfortably in isolation, have figured out micro beta, etc". so am i ready to start linking it now or work the move more or see that i am lacking in power / technique and focus on general improvement?

low pointing makes me think its the first answer but does that clarify it more?

thanks again for your input

Israel R · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Jul 2018 · Points: 87

Just because you've done a move once doesn't mean you'll be able to do it again, even from the dog. 25% from the dog is indeed very low percentage to try linking into from below. Twice in a row is a good rule of thumb before trying to add (a small number) more moves into it. When to go from working small links to low pointing is more of an art than a science. 

As you're getting experience projecting hard things, experiment and explore all the aspects of the process. Maybe you try to redpoint too early and fail miserably (not enough time working it), maybe you work it into the ground and the red point feels like nothing (too much time working it).

Caleb · · Ward, CO · Joined Jun 2013 · Points: 270

Doing the crux only once per session in isolation is pretty far from a send.  Training specific crux sequences and doing many burns on the same route take time and dedication.  This one seems like it will take a lot of both at your current level.  You will probably have more fun and progress faster if you climb a variety of routes that require a little less focus, but come back to this route somewhat frequently.  Look for slightly easier routes with similar movements and fill in a tick list of sends in the three letter grades between your current climbing and this project.  That will equate to general training for this route.  As you re-visit, it will either start to come together or you will run into obstacles that clearly indicate specific training.  You may have to pivot at that point and knuckle down into full project mode.  Or you may find yourself clipping the chains on a casual burn.  

Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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