Intense cramping during long multi pitch climbing (anybody have a solution?)

Hi,

I have keep having this issue where my muscles  (mostly in the hands) get intense cramping intermittently during long multi pitch climbs. Sometimes to the point where the fingers lock up into a claw so bad I have to use the other hand to pry the fingers open. I've tried increasing electrolytes (salt pills and pedialyte) and it hasn't solved it. Last time I was climbing a long crimpy route (Sendero Luminoso in Potrero Chico), and it happened for a lot of the last few pitches. I was able to finish the climb, but had to have my partner lead the last few pitches because of such intense hand cramps.

I knew it was an issue, and so had prepared but it still happened anyways. My muscles aren't tired and I'm not maxed out, cramping is my biggest limitation for tackling long routes. 

Pre-climb: Drinking intensively the entire day before with lots of electrolytes (salt pills and pedialyte) and bananas, peanut butter and salty breakfast.

During climb: 1L of water and 2L of pedialyte during the climb (was in in the shade all day, high around 70 degrees that day), popping 2 salt pills per hour for 8 hours. Lunch of peanut butter sandwiches. Still cramped up.

I'm clearly getting a lot of potassium and sodium, is there another electrolyte or something else I'm missing? It seems like even when I prepare, I get these intense hand cramps. Anybody experienced this and have a recommendation for it?

Any guidance would be really appreciated!

I have found magnesium supplements helps immensely with both dehydration and fatigue induced muscle cramps. 

Electrolytes are basically any ion your body needs to function, sodium and potassium are the two major ones but calcium is also a requirement specifically for muscle function. You’re obviously taking in some via the Pedialyte but make sure the additional salt pills have calcium (and Magnesium at lower levels) too. 

Maybe try a different electrolyte supplement (there’s so many options if pedialyte isn’t working) and reduce your overall salt intake, 2/hr salt pills seems kind of excessive because THAT much sodium + your salt load up prior increases dehydration. Also, make sure you’re having enough sugar intake. Glucose = Energy (ATP) and that’s actually what releases muscle fibers from the “locked position”. Calcium is the ion that actually puts muscle fibers the “locked position”.

I’ve never really had debilitating cramps, but what I find helps me immensely with big multi-pitches and long hikes are runner gels — the gels with both electrolytes and high sugar (maltose or glucose). I stuff my pockets with 2-4 of them and have them throughout the day. Try those instead of salt pills?

Teddy, do you / did you drink alcohol the night before that last big climb?

Chris Small wrote:

I have found magnesium supplements helps immensely with both dehydration and fatigue induced muscle cramps. 

this^^^  and ultrasalts

Teddy, do you typically train antagonist muscles? Also, how often are you peeing throughout the day? I get the same hand cramps and I find avoiding alcohol, getting decent sleep, addressing muscle imbalances, and most importantly, peeing regularly to rebalance the electrolytes goes a long way. For cold weather climbing, I'll also have 2 hand warmers in each pocket and keep my fingers warm while not climbing and rewarm mid-pitch if possible

I've been wondering if it's not too little of a certain electrolyte but rather an excess causing this issue. In our WFR training, our instructors also suggested it could be a carpopedal spasm from a deficit of carbon dioxide in the blood, for which the solution is to breathe into your hand

Could be tendon issues  or overuse 

You might be consuming too much salt and/or not enough of the other electrolytes, as others have said. I'm extremely prone to cramps of accessory muscles and in my case, switching to a potassium/magnesium-heavy electrolyte powder (Prime) from a sodium-heavy one pretty dramatically improved things (as did switching up my top-belay stance and rope handling every few minutes to avoid irritating the same wrist/elbow/neck/calf muscles). 

Look at the RDV for sodium, magnesium, and potassium - I'd bet you're nowhere near the recommendations for the latter two and well above it for the former - few supplements/drink mixes have very much magnesium/potassium due to some liability concerns around over-supplementation risks.

Maybe if I was climbing in full sun exposure on a hot slab I'd want more sodium but this has worked well for me, as I'm usually chasing shade or good temps.

I’ve had very similar issues with cramping on big days. The GU electrolyte capsules work wonders for me when I start to get crampy. They provide almost instant relief for me. 

Popular in the ultra MTB scene: Tums.

I had a fellow racer pass me a couple during a 20+ hour endeavor when I started cramping and they quelled it almost instantly.

Teddy Kisch wrote:

Last time I was climbing a long crimpy route (Sendero Luminoso in Potrero Chico), and it happened for a lot of the last few pitches. I was able to finish the climb, but had to have my partner lead the last few pitches because of such intense hand cramps.

I knew it was an issue, and so had prepared but it still happened anyways. My muscles aren't tired and I'm not maxed out, cramping is my biggest limitation for tackling long routes.

Looking at your ticks, I suspect you might’ve been more maxed out on Sendero than you think.  I used to have this problem all the time, but when I eventually got a number grade stronger, it went away.  When I could barely climb 13a, long 5.12/12+ multipitches would get me every time.  Now I can do 13- relatively easily and mostly climb on 13- to 13 multipitches without issue.  I suspect that if I was trying 13+/14- long routes, I’d cramp for sure even on the ‘easy’ pitches.  

Quinine

I had this problem a few years ago and found that even more electrolytes solved it for me.  Now every 1L of water gets a packet of LMNT.  

If you want to geek out there was a great podcast with the CEO of Precision Nutrition about this topic(don't recall the pod but I am sure you can find it)

https://www.precisionhydration.com/performance-advice/ - lots of good stuff here and they even did a free phone call with me to help sort out my issues

made in the usa real salt brand salt and salt your food

 and trace minerals

https://www.traceminerals.com/pages/zerolyte

tri-iodine to help thyroid regulate

several types of potassium suuplements u can take

we need three times the potassium to sodium intake daily

mag mind magnesium from l-threonate the only form that crosses blood brain barrier

and life flo magnesium lotion

Teddy, I have had similar issues with the claw just as you described: my fingers painfully clutching into a fist and being unable to open without my other hand prying it open

I found that if I planned ahead the day before a big climb I would never have issues. Here were my three most do’s: 1) hydrate plenty the day before and day of. 2) take electrolytes! (Coconut water did the trick for me). 3) stretch those finger/hand/forearm tendons good! 

I really started to take the claw seriously when it flared up at a very in opportune time on a notorious long sketchy trad climb in Mendoza canyon…still one of the scariest moments I’ve ever had on the sharp end.

Good luck

I’ll approach this from a different angle than the others:

how is your breathing? Are you hyperventilating? Hyperventilation syndrome can cause this “claw” effect (I get this sometimes when im nauseous or dry heaving).

Start eating 4 eggs for breakfast and some sort of beef for dinner(preferably grass-fed steak). You can't fuel your body long-term on some salt water, a banana, bread and peanut butter, especially climbing at the level you do.

I recently had two long days separated by two lighter days.   Cramps after 1st day.  None after second.  I think water and electrolytes were an issue on the first day which was hotter and involved less available water.  And I think most understand that drinking large volumes of plain water in cases like this can contribute to muscle cramping.

Still, an arbitrary source (National Library of Medicine) states there are likely many different mechanisms and, if so, a single strategy for prevention or treatment is unlikely to succeed for all.

"Abnormal spinal reflex activity" is another proposed mechanism. Some possible mitigations:

• regular or "passive" stretching (irregular habits can contribute to cramping); but "static" stretching may not help
• pickle juice was mentioned as having some effect at reducing the duration of cramps - thought to be neurological in effect
• Quinine - best evidence was reduces cramp intensity, not so much cramp days or duration.

Good luck! Apparently, this is a difficult area to research in part because cramps occur unexpectedly and usually resolve before tests can be done.

Jared E wrote:

I’ll approach this from a different angle than the others:

how is your breathing? Are you hyperventilating? Hyperventilation syndrome can cause this “claw” effect (I get this sometimes when im nauseous or dry heaving).

Generally, my breathing is totally fine. I wasn't tired or burnt out. And I think it wasn't totally an issue of climbing way past my level for long multi pitch, because I've had the same experience on easier climbs. For example, on pitch 8 and 9 (a 12a and 11b), the hold type switched (I think less crimpy?) and I was using different muscles, and I sent both pitches because my hands weren't cramping nearly as bad in a different position. 

Definitely will take others' advice on getting the right nutrients and having a really solid set of meals multiple days beforehand. Thanks to everyone for the advice, really appreciate it!

Cherokee Nunes wrote:

Teddy, do you / did you drink alcohol the night before that last big climb?

I don't drink at all. So I don't think it was that. :-) 

Peter Y wrote:

Teddy, do you typically train antagonist muscles? Also, how often are you peeing throughout the day? I get the same hand cramps and I find avoiding alcohol, getting decent sleep, addressing muscle imbalances, and most importantly, peeing regularly to rebalance the electrolytes goes a long way. For cold weather climbing, I'll also have 2 hand warmers in each pocket and keep my fingers warm while not climbing and rewarm mid-pitch if possible

I've been wondering if it's not too little of a certain electrolyte but rather an excess causing this issue. In our WFR training, our instructors also suggested it could be a carpopedal spasm from a deficit of carbon dioxide in the blood, for which the solution is to breathe into your hand

I don't train antagonist muscles nearly enough, so this could quite possibly be contributing to it. I slept pretty well, was peeing fairly regularly (probably not enough though, and I avoid alcohol entirely. Will definitely do more antagonist stretching, thanks for the tip!