Ski pulk pullers?

Bought a new pulk this year -- and have been waiting impatiently for enough snow to actually tow it anywhere. Tried towing an old wagon full of weight up the street, for exercise -- but the neighbors already think I'm a weirdo, so...

If there's anyone else on here towing a sled/pulk for fun, I'd love to discuss what/where/why/how it's going.

I dropped some dough, and got a Siglin 6'. I was worried about storing/transporting that length, but it turns out they easily roll up long-ways, to fit in a reasonable sized cube box. Total surprise.

I'm planning to use a climbing harness to tow it, for starters -- but I've got a nagging doubt that it might not work as well as a dedicated harness. The design is kinda different -- way less padding/stiffness in climbing harnesses, and you have to jury rig a good strong point for the pole connectors.

Hopefully gonna have some more data after next weekend -- we finally have enough snow coming in, close enough to a road, that it looks like a good time to play with it.

Hey Ryan, 

I'm psyched, your psyched on training.  The only time I've pulled a proper pulk sled for "training" is with clients on Denali Prep Courses.  However I have spent many hours towing my kids around the mountains on a Thule Chariot and we drag tires on asphalt at the Alpine Training Center.

The problem with towing the pulk for training is that it's pretty un-fun. However if you are preparing for an expedition like Denali or a crossing in the Arctic, you'll find front-loaded sled dragging will certainly make the experience more enjoyable!

I've been experimenting with the harness that SkiPulk.com sells ( skipulk.com/product/full-ha… ). It's worked well the one or two times I've taken it out. Is that where you got your Siglin? Shoulder straps seem to help, especially when you're going uphill.

Jason Antin wrote:

Hey Ryan, 

I'm psyched, your psyched on training.  The only time I've pulled a proper pulk sled for "training" is with clients on Denali Prep Courses.  However I have spent many hours towing my kids around the mountains on a Thule Chariot and we drag tires on asphalt at the Alpine Training Center.

The problem with towing the pulk for training is that it's pretty un-fun. However if you are preparing for an expedition like Denali or a crossing in the Arctic, you'll find front-loaded sled dragging will certainly make the experience more enjoyable!

Well, I assume that 95% of what makes pulling that Thule Chariot tolerable is the, ahem, cargo? ;-) So I suppose the fun is where you find it.

I have some particular practical considerations, but it boils down to this: I often need to carry more weight than other folks, in order to make a trip happen. Heavier loads translates directly into more access, more freedom, and less limitations.

I've found that I can mostly manage a 55-60lb backpack on easy skiing, but it really does limit my movement options, pace, and endurance... And even 60lb just isn't enough to meet some of my trip needs.

Pulling a load is also limiting, but not as bad as the same weight in a backpack. I seem to move better with the pulk, even loaded up to ~90-100lb. Not sure how other folks feel about that -- maybe it varies?

So I guess to me, "fun" and "not fun" aren't even really part of equation... X weight is the price of my admission to destination Y, and complaining about it doesn't really change anything.

mark felber wrote:

I've been experimenting with the harness that SkiPulk.com sells ( skipulk.com/product/full-ha… ). It's worked well the one or two times I've taken it out. Is that where you got your Siglin? Shoulder straps seem to help, especially when you're going uphill.

Yep, got my new one from SkiPulk.com... I bought their pole kit too. So if i decide to switch to their harness, it's just that one piece I need to change out.

I'll keep that in mind about the shoulder straps, too.

What kind of weight are you carrying, in yours?

I've done a handful of overnight or 2 night trips, so probably <40 lbs. Putting the weight in a sled instead of on my back does make things a lot easier whether I'm on skis or snowshoes. Having my center of gravity where it should be instead of raised up by a pack really reduces the effort required to maintain my balance, and I can ski at a decent speed on my way downhill.

Ive pulled a sled on two occassions going up to the hut at Katahdin in Maine and to some remote place in japan.  Both were mostly on closed, snow covered roads, but the final few mi and 1500 (?) vf to katahdin is on steep trail.  Worked fine and was great to pull so much junk.

I used an old BD couloir harness and chopped the leg loops off (glorified belt at that point).  Ive also attached the bars to the shoulder strap/pack connection.  Both cases i just used a voille ski strap making careful looks to securely fasten and avoid unnecessary bulk (and irritation).  

I also have the skipulk bars, used in both parallel and crossed setup, don't remember what was better for what, but definitely has potential to improve (i think parallel going up, crossed going down).

Obviously very common on denali

I pull the hip belt off my pack and attach the poles to the ice clipper spots on it. The trick is getting a solid attachment which I am still working on, but the last two years I have tied it as tight as possible with 4mm cord and it has very minimal play. Keeps the weight down a tiny bit as the hip belt is multi purpose. 

We built the fancy fiberglass fence pole pulks (designs used to be free off skipulk.com but I think they're behind a paywall now) for Katahdin. In playing around with them/training, we tried using just a waist belt (i.e. a heavy fanny pack), but I found that the load felt un-balanced, and I actually enjoyed it a little more using a lightly loaded backpack (Osprey Variant) with the sled attached to the vertical-ski slots on the sides of the pack. I did run into some issues with the rotation on every step (snowshoes) leading to some irritation/fatigue of my hip muscles, but that was probably an under-training thing more than a harness thing. If I were to do it again, I might try and experiment with some of the ideas above (attaching to waist belt on the pack) to move the load closer to the body. 

Thank you, everyone, for your input & sharing your experiences. I really appreciate hearing from you.

Some lessons from towing, this past weekend... Made it a few miles out with ~160lbs of gear + human volunteer. Great weather, great time, and utterly exhausted.

• The Siglin 6' is pretty flexible in the long axis -- it can be rolled up for storage/transport. But with so much weight, it tends to bend awkwardly instead of properly tracking on turns and slopes. We tied a pair of aluminum crutches to the side rails, tightly cinched, which made it considerably more rigid -- and also gave the passenger a comfy set of hand grips & foot rests.
• Backsliding on perpendicular slopes was a major issue with the heavy load, so we mounted an extra pair of climbing skins to the bottom of the sled, under the points of highest ground pressure. Worked great -- easy to clip & unclip, and the skins stayed in place really well.
• Side-slope traverses were nearly impossible, even on the gentlest examples. The skins helped a bit, but we definitely had to be careful to square up perpendicular to any slope. The sled would slide off sideways, and tip the load if it got far enough over.
• Hip harness (Metolius SafeTech Trad) didn't have nearly enough padding at the front of the hips, so the pressure got uncomfortable after a while. Also, the buckle style on those new SafeTechs is just horrendous, so difficult to cinch properly -- and nearly impossible to operate in gloves. Worst part was having to get in & out of my ski bindings, to step through the harness waist loop, every time I had to detach from towing.

So I'm looking at three main areas I'd like to improve -- long-axis rigidity, side-slope tracking, and everything about the harness.

Harness might be the easiest to solve -- I have some extra Osprey pack belts & shoulder straps that seem to meet the criteria. Or, I can knuckle under and buy the version that SkiPulk.com sells.

For the rigidity and side-slope issues, it occurred to me that I might be able to resolve both with a set of long (~5') fins made from UHMWPE angles (aka, "bedframe") bolted to the underside. SkiPulk.com sells short fins made from aluminum angles, so that's an option, too.

I don't know how much of this will affect folks towing lighter weights -- but maybe there's some crossover.

For katahdin we used some of these, or something closely analogous:

https://www.sportsmansguide.com/product/index/us-military-surplus-filbe-hip-belt-used?a=2263937&szc=000&clrc=000&utm_source=google&utm_medium=pla&utm_medium=pla&utm_channel=pmax&utm_campaign=19688460155&gad_source=1&gclid=cj0kcqiakkqsbhc3arisaeejujhiyet3ifchjnwusnbkb-qgixqdf49a7sgrdqph2vrodov8emrwrxwaairuealw_wcb

Army surplus places have em cheap. We just used spare wiregates to clip to the little loop on the sides. Easy to adjust, very padded

Not sure if this thread is still active but if it is; I have a long experience pulling pulks and thought I would add a few thoughts to it. I do long distance Nordic ski-touring, mostly in northern Norway and Sweden, as far north as 71° N.  I have more than 3.000km of dragging pulks around.  A couple of observations:  The Siglin 6 pulk in my view is a poor design (and poorly priced, to make one poor), the last thing you want is any flex in your pulk.  If you require a pulk that long then the 66" Emsco Beast would be an excellent choice, it will set you back about $50 (and does not require any reinforcement).  The Beast only weighs 7 oz more than the Siglin 6.  The argument about which PE material pulls better is kind of moot- HDPE pulls just as well UHMWPE in my experience, at any rate I put glide wax on my pulk if I remember to.  You can bolt UHMWPE runners on any sled if that is important to you.

My favorite sled is the little Jet Sled Jr. (43" long), I pack it with a 120 liter Rab duffle that also has shoulder straps on it, so I can put this whole bag-pulk ensemble on my back for short stretches where that is useful, like traversing paved roads.  I also fit a 20 liter square stuff bag in front of that.   I use the stock cover from the manufacturer to enclose the sled (goes over the duffle and everything.  I have installed four buckle straps of 1" webbing to hold the cover down.  To do this you must mount the brackets (alu profile) that hold the traces to the sled- under the sled (on the front slope) not on top, or else  the cover can't seal, they are better situated for pulling there anyway.  I can go two weeks autonomous with a 4-season tent and all food, fuel, equipment, and clothing using this sled.  I have runners installed on it, again because of bare terrain and roads.  I have an alu center fin, like a rudder, that I can bolt on the back to prevent any sliding on side hills- easy on, easy off with wing nuts (I do not use it much as the runners have aided tracking on side hills). I also have a back brake that prevents the sled from weighting me if (when) I stop during an ascent, it prevents the ulk from sliding backwards. That is my favorite accessory!  Simple to make: take a 6"x8" sheet of 1/4" HDPE, bevel one of the 6" ends to sharpen it.  Take an alu piano hinge, each leaf on the hinge should be 1" wide, (I got one at McMaster Carr) and cut it to a 6" length, bolt the non beveled 6" side of the HDPE sheet to it, bolt the assembly to the back of the sled using 3 x 1/4" machine crews and locking bolts.  Washers as needed. It should be bolted into a 1/16" alu plate inside the back of the sled to protect against impact.  For positioning: the flap should protrude 2" below the lowest part of the sled (including the runners if you have them installed)   I also designed a webbing with a buckle to hold it in the up position if I am skiing somewhere I might need to back up- on a lake or in a dense forest for example.  It works perfectly in all kinds of snow.  This sled is very easy to fly with as it is just about large-suitcase sized (I have to fly a few hours north to get to Scandinavia, sucks when they lose your "luggage"). 

For longer trips (or kitchen sink trips) I use a Paris Pulk with 2 x Rab 112 liter pulk-bags, so 224 liters load capacity.  A plus is the bags are blue and and the sled is orange so it is now in the colors of the world's greatest baseball team: The NY Mets.  I put some serious blue runners on the Paris, as the Paris sleds are thin and the bottom wears fast on rough surfaces.  They were pre-drilled and had all the hardware, made for a bigger sled, cut them to size bent them with a heat gun and bolted 'em on.  I am not a huge Paris sled fan- they flip over quite a bit (the slightly wider Jet Sled Jr. very rarely flips).  I used them on a trip last year from Ivalo Finland to Kirkenes Norway, they were fine for that trip as a lot of Finnmark is flat and many KM were straight up the frozen Pasvik River which forms Norway's border with Russia (good idea to have good land-navigation skills),skied to the three-country point where Finland, Norway, Russia meet- you can touch the Finn and Norwegian posts but not the Russian one..  One thing I do not like on the Paris is that the front lip points downwards sharply, maybe for structural reasons(?).  It plows deep snow, I am going to heat it and bend it up and then reenforce it with some thin alu sheet.  The Jet Sled Jr. handles better when skiing, much better.

Traces, attachments, and harnesses:  I have both the H-bar traces from Fjellpulken (I have two of their old fiberglass sleds in my garage) and the crossed-poll fiberglass traces like Skipulk makes.  I greatly prefer the crossed-poll system less slack and less chance of breakage.   My advice is if you have a spare 145 bucks just buy them from Skipulk, it will save a lot of cursing.  If not you can make your own.  Skipulk makes two styles of traces- their expedition ones have a ball joint on each end.  That is the best system, you can see the attachment for this on their site if you look at their expedition harness. This design is much better than their other one with the ring end. It is attached to the belt by a clevis bolt and a lynch pin so if you want quickly off of your pulk you just pull the pins, useful if (when) you go through the ice! With the other there is fumbling around and two hands involved.  I built the two ball joint polls myself with two  $5  internal threaded (femal) 1/2 inch ball-joints and two six-foot Sunguard 1/2" fiberglass fence posts. The advantage of these is all you have to do is thread the fiberglass rod with a die, epoxy the threads and screw on the ball joints, done.  No reducing nuts and threading sleeves, etc.. They are larger at 1/2" than the Skipulk ball joints which are 3/8", but also stronger.  You need to use a suitably sized channel to make the attachment brackets to go on the sled, and you need to make the 1/2" clevis pin/lynch pin assembly for the harness-end attachment.

I would like to post some pics but don't see that option.  

Just add snow!

Rockets Redglare wrote:

Not sure if this thread is still active

It is now!

I would like to post some pics but don't see that option.

On mobile, click the indicated button, and select the pics from your roll.

Rockets Redglare wrote:

I would like to post some pics but don't see that option.  

Please do.
I am waiting for your photos.

Comments from the peanut gallery, I enjoyed your post Rockets Redglare! I also have pulled a pulk over 4000 miles over the past few years on long distance trips here in Alaska. 

I began with the jet sled but I did not have the same experiance as you, perhaps because I often am on windswept / sidehill terrain. I had combusting swear words as this sled tended to tip over all the time. All the time! It'd just find a 3 inch cliff and flop over on its belly. I do ski with my Alaskan Husky pulling me, but that shouldn't make a differance. So then I moved onto a longer skinnier childrens sled, like the type found at target or walmart. This sleds plastic broke on me at the hinges. (user error, but it happens on trips!) I've also seen others used these sleds and the plastic shatters when its really cold (like -30f and below). So, I have a pile of those in the garage sitting neglected as well. Lately I've been using the 6" siglin, which you don't like. I also don't like it at all, as one user wrote "skiing becomes more un-fun" and I much appriciated this sentiment. The trips become more about the traveling, self-sufficiancy, the dealing with daily struggles, and less about estatic glee gliding around. Each year I get my siglin out, I start crying as I pull it out of the garage, in anticipation of our struggles. Once I get it attatched to my waist and moving, its most the time not a problem, but when its a problem, its a problem. I have two new sleds that I'm making that are now in the works, I go buy a sheet of UHMW plastic and shape it to my desired shape. My first one is very flexiable. I am reinforcing it, but I think I need to use a thicker plastic. I haven't noticed a differance on the "slidablitiy" of plastics say jetsled vs walmart sled vs uhmw sled. My main differance I see is durability and fragile-ness. Im not going to rip the uhmw plastic, but one sheet of it unmolded costs me $100 for a 5' sled fall '24. 

As for poles, I now use the ski-pulk poles, sled side ball joints, user side hoop joint. I then went to the skipulk website and now the poles are $150 instead of $75. So is the way of things these days, but their website now looks much more official and proffesional. Good to see our money is going towards a nice webdesigner! ha. 

I'm now in the process of designing another sled to make. I have been considering purchasing those Rab bags. I use one big "polar expedition" style bag for my siglin. I do tend to need more stuff (more food) as I travel with my Alaskan Husky, who eats amost 3 pounds a day. Her food is very heavy, but she pulls her share of the weight. I've also just used the waist belt instead of full shoulder harness to pull the pulk. Its never bothered me, but on hills I do have to constantly tug the waist belt up and readjust the skijoring harness, as they overlap. We've done some 300-400 mile trips without much significant hip rub, which actually is amazing!

Ok, well I thought I'd chime in here too, just for fun, since I enjoyed Redglares commentary. Remeber, the best sled is the sled that gets you outdoors. You don't have to start with the best, just start with something! Get outside! And then change it up as you go.

Happy skiing, gng

Gale Zief wrote:

...

Really appreciate hearing all that... Any chance you could post some photos? I think I understand what you're talking about, but it would be really cool to see it too.

... And I'm also hope Rockets decides to come back and figure out the phot upload -- or maybe just link us to whatever other platform is easier?

Couple of thoughts...  Do you use ski crampons?  If not, check 'em out - will help on difficult snow with that load.  Second, you should check out pack rafting.  You can put tons of weight INSIDE the tubes of your Alpacka and it still paddles like a dream.  Center of gravity is low, gear is dry.  It is like backpacking but much less work.  HMU for photos or more info.

Hi Guys!I’m new to this thread and love the discussion. I have built and use 4 different pulks now. I have 2 Paris Expedition sleds and two smaller off brand. I bought a harness (love it) from Skipulk.com as well as a set of their poles and attachment points and love them but ended I up needing some extra length on the poles due to the clips on the back end of my skins on my AT Skis getting caught in my brake chain. (That sucks!!) I ended up building a couple sets of poles now with some extra length and they work great. I haven’t fouled in my brake chain yet. I use these sleds to pack gear in for camping and for packing down our local trails for fat biking and for exercise and for towing my grandkids around! I I have extra sleds so that my friends can pull them and help with the work of packing down the trails. Ha ha! I use them with my snowshoes and my AT skis.
I do a lot of climbing and descending through trees and brush so I have added a chain brake and fins and both have their place! The fins are an absolute necessity when traversing a side hill and trying to keep the sled tracking behind me. They work great! They can also act as a break of sorts. Sometimes I retract them up out of the way if the trails firmly packed. The brake is a lifesaver when I’m on a downhill and trying to keep the sled back and from pushing me down the hill. I have a little paracord line that comes up to my hip belt and I can release it to deploy the brake and pull it back in to pull the brake back up.  I’ll add some pics of my sleds. 

Dave Pearce wrote:

..

Dave, I love your side fins. Thank you for the pics!

I wish I could figure out a way to do those on the Siglin... I rigged up some to test, but with the more flexible sides, they just bend instead of digging in. Seems like a dead end.

I did try a Paris, earlier this season, based on what @Rockets Redglare was saying -- and I quickly destroyed it. The HDPE plastic just wasn't durable enough for where I'm dragging it... I may have gotten spoiled by how tough the UHMW Siglin is.

This is close on my mind, because one of my main gripes with my bolt-on bottom fins has turned out to be swapping them on & off:

• Every swap requires unloading & reloading the pulk to access the inside of the holes.
• Playing with bolts, washers, etc in snow/darkness while wearing heavy gloves is awkward & slow, and it's too easy to lose hardware.

So I would LOVE to have something more like your side-mount fins, which look like an absolute dream work with.

For now, I'm just keeping my eyes peeled for a UHMW sled design with rigid sides.

Jay Anderson wrote:

Couple of thoughts...  Do you use ski crampons?  If not, check 'em out - will help on difficult snow with that load.  Second, you should check out pack rafting.  You can put tons of weight INSIDE the tubes of your Alpacka and it still paddles like a dream.  Center of gravity is low, gear is dry.  It is like backpacking but much less work.  HMU for photos or more info.

Yes on the ski crampons.

Pack rafting sounds interesting -- but the rivers just don't always go where I want to go!

Yeah, I have those bolt on fins on two of my other sleds and agree with you. Very painful to try and deploy them or put them away. I’ve been considering trying out a Pelican sled to get a little bit more rigidity. These Paris sleds have worked flawless so far, but the snow conditions have been favorable.
The Siglin seems pretty tough but I agree that it lacks the rigidity to support the fins like mine have. I wonder if you made an L bracket  mounted inside the sled which firmed up the side to provide support for the fin and the lower portion of the L was secured onto the flat bottom and you could create rigidity that way. You might use some 2” or 2 1/2“ x 1/8 aluminum so that you had something structurally sound to support the fin? Maybe you could bend the angle of the L to match the transition from the side of your Siglin to the bottom. Or you could just make it more of a “U”  shape and go all the way across and up each side with one piece: that should give it some good rigidity. Just a couple thoughts.