Slow Climbers on Small Walls

Christian Hesch wrote:

OP, apologies for giving you contradictory information but you do *not* need to high step, as that may be much slower for you to deal with the balance issues that come with climbing your waist past your piece - what *will* help you immensely (besides simply getting faster at recognizing and slamming gear in), is finding/recognizing "same/same" combos. I do my best to read the upcoming 15-20ft, and try to set up my ladder(s) so that they have the two pieces I need to get through the next 20 or more ft, before changing size. 

I like this! Sort of the old "crack jumars" idea. I do sort of have a rule to not back clean more than 2-3 pieces before leaving one. I'll usually leave one when I get a super bomber placement and back clean anything that is less than amazing. If the crack above me looks to go from #1 to #2 to #3, I would try to alternate the #1 and #2 until the #1 doesn't really fit any higher up eg the crack is getting wider as I go up. Then I would leave the #1 and alternate the #2 and #3 until the #2 doesn't fit anymore. Yeah, could help speed things up a bit.

I think the problem with my speed is more general. For example, when the guide book says the approach is an hour it almost always takes me at least 2 hours. I climb with this one guy and whenever we are on the approach or headed back to the car, I literally have to run to try to keep up with him while he is walking. It is good though, I have noticed that I now try to keep that same pace when I am with other people and they are starting to fall behind.

Charles Winstead wrote:

Tommy Caldwell, Dawn Wall, 7 years.

I think you took my response personally. You asked for community input, I gave you an honest opinion. If you want to concentrate on progressing through one skill set at a time practice low, dial it in, and fire up high. If you want to faff around tuning everything at once, by all means have at it. Just have  a lot of fun, whatever you’re doing.

Hi Abe, I got no time for hating and most definitely did not take your comment personally. I appreciate your feedback very much. You have called out a certain perspective: that my goofing off on small walls might interfere with other faster climbers.

So, here’s the thing. If you follow “The Road to the Nose,” you’re going to find yourself on crowded routes. My way, the “small walls” approach avoids the crowds.

The only reason we were on Washington Column was because my buddy saw it in road to the nose. When I went up onto Gold Wall with my son, there was no sign that anybody had been there in years. I expect the same with Flying Buttress Direct.

What I’m wondering about is how effective my strategy is vs working on the separate skills one at a time. Seems to me that the hardest part of big walling is getting all your gear to the base, hauling it and sustaining the effort for multiple days. The climbing is not all that hard for me. I find hard aiding to be somewhat less physically strenuous than hard free climbing.

Frankly, I am somewhat bemused that the registration requirement so obviously leads to the conclusion that I have come to: no campsite, no problem just get on a big wall.

Certainly the hardest part of the Flying Buttress Direct will be getting wall kit up there.  That’s a real fitness-opportunity schlep. 

You mention "Road to the Nose", but have you actually followed it at all? It lists 24 sessions before you get more than 1 pitch off the ground, with some of them covering a lot of ground (1000' of C1 2 days in a row).

Don't get me wrong it doesn't seem "fun" (which is why I have no aid skills), but it's probably 100x more effective than what you're doing.

I don't think there's anything wrong with prioritizing having fun (I do it all the time, or else I would actually boulder), but there's probably a better balance to be had for you than climbing 1 pitch a weekend.

Did the Nose back in the day and most of the road to the nose as well. Not looking to repeat everything. That’s why I’m going out on the more obscure stuff. I mean, from the looks of it, nobody has been on Gold Wall in years. Lichen and moss all in the cracks. How many people do you really think climb Flying Buttress Direct in a year? Love that weird out of the way stuff. I do know what I’m doing, I’m just really freaking slow. Probably has something to do with being 53. I’ve been back on the climbing scene about a full year and am getting better / faster every time I go out.

Charles Winstead wrote:

DProbably has something to do with being 53. 

Another slow 53 year old checking in... I'm not climbing enough these days to get faster, so count me a bit jealous. It's in the plans and works to be physically closer to frequent climbing in the not so distant future, but not quite yet. I think you nailed it, frequent practice makes us more efficient. I look forward to getting faster, but in the meantime, sometimes I just want to gaze at the view and spend time with my partner.   

you guys better get after it while you are 53!  that is light years  better than 60! believe me! get er done. 

Lots of people are saying it’s too hot and too smoky to be climbing in the valley right now. I say “the heck with that!” I’ve got the last week of July and the first week of August blocked out. After all I’ve posted here, anybody want to team up for Flying Buttress Direct or perhaps Pegasus?

Charles Winstead wrote:

Lots of people are saying it’s too hot and too smoky to be climbing in the valley right now. I say “the heck with that!” I’ve got the last week of July and the first week of August blocked out. After all I’ve posted here, anybody want to team up for Flying Buttress Direct or perhaps Pegasus?

Climbing in the Valley at that time of year? No thanks.

Charles Winstead wrote:

Lots of people are saying it’s too hot and too smoky to be climbing in the valley right now. I say “the heck with that!” I’ve got the last week of July and the first week of August blocked out. After all I’ve posted here, anybody want to team up for Flying Buttress Direct or perhaps Pegasus?

Dude, I just got baked off the Central Pillar of Frenzy a couple weeks ago. It was miserable. 

I approve of you being mental enough to do a wall in Summer, but I am not mental enough to join you. Could maybe get talked into it if a wall got a fair amount of shade throughout the day? And I would also bring like two gallons of water per day. 

Ricky Harline wrote:

Dude, I just got baked off the Central Pillar of Frenzy a couple weeks ago. It was miserable. 

I approve of you being mental enough to do a wall in Summer, but I am not mental enough to join you. Could maybe get talked into it if a wall got a fair amount of shade throughout the day? And I would also bring like two gallons of water per day. 

Here’s what one person said about the adjacent route Steck-Salathe: The lighting wasn't so great, but I for one wasn't complaining about being mostly in the shade mid-summer. - 

It is North facing, so, could be true. Although, I got baked of West Face of LT in the summer and it’s also north facing. Dunno.

re: 2 gal/day uh, per person or total?

Charles Winstead wrote: re: 2 gal/day uh, per person or total?

Per person per day.

Your body can easily lose a liter per hour up there.

Charles Winstead wrote:

Lots of people are saying it’s too hot and too smoky to be climbing in the valley right now. I say “the heck with that!” I’ve got the last week of July and the first week of August blocked out. After all I’ve posted here, anybody want to team up for Flying Buttress Direct or perhaps Pegasus?

Have enjoyed the thread. First wall was Spaceshot with a buddy fixing so far and sleeping on the ground, jugging and topping out the next day. Crazily, my first real wall effort was Triple Direct on El Cap. However, it was was August. We thought: "We're a slow party, the wall will not be crowded that time of year". In a nutshell, that was a basic tactical mistake. We had to haul more water. At the end of day one, we'd drank twice the water we'd planned on, ended up 400 feet short of where we intended to end up, and eaten no food until we settled in for the night. Our assessment of our prospects of success: If we come up short again on day 2, we are looking at an extra night and day on the wall, which would have us running out of water on the final day near the top of the wall and prime for rescue. We bailed. No shame, no regrets, only poorly thought out logistics and a severe misconcention of just how hot it can be up there. We didn't slow anybody down, though. No one else was fool enough to be up there, lol. After that, I turned my attention again to day walls in Zion, and did Moonlight and Touchstone in a single weekend. My point, brother, is that heat and smoke are real and might be the difference between success and failure. But i wish the best and I am glad you are getting after it!

LL2- yeah, I saw pictures from the Valley yesterday. It looks worse than I expected. Also, forecast is for 90 degrees. May have to put my big wall hat away until Fall season. Just ordered 2 new ropes- 9.7mm 70m lead rope and 8mm tag/haul rope. Guess it’s physical training and sport climbing for the next two months.

July/August/Smoke yeah, not good odds at all 

And as far as age goes, well, my tiny little woman 53 year old Asian friend, Selena Pang, is a crusher and psyched to get better. She’s like me, we’ll stop when we’re dead! 

What you are experiencing is completely normal. Your don’t suck at big wall climbing. What you describe seems to be a mismatch between reality and expectations fostered by the Internet. Just to state the obvious…what we read here on MP is permeated with self-selection bias. The sample of climbers who post their big wall accomplishments here is, on average, very experienced. They probably got their experience because they have enjoyed the process of [slow] climbing when they were just starting out. Ask yourself honestly ‘why do I climb?’ The answer to this question might be better able to guide your endeavors than more advice from the Internet. Cheers man! I am about your age and I feel you. Factor in more days and accept heavy hauling—- happy sending!

Thanks Nora, I was on a roll there for a bit, but hot weather, fires and smoke shut me down. Hope to back at it this fall.

Hello everyone, It is Fall! I'm looking to get back into it. One of the things I realized after the last 6-8 weeks of not going to the valley and only sport climbing and trail running is that none of my partners are stoked about climbing the routes I want to climb in the manner in which I want to climb them. I have a list of climbs and a style that I think I could manage, but not a compatible partner who is at the same or similar level.

So, anyone want to do Flying Buttress Direct this Fall? What about Gold Wall? My plan for both is to arrive late in the day (after picking up my big wall permit), get a good start (a few pitches), sleep on my ledge and get up in the morning and top out on day 2. Hike out and go home.

I have ideas for other routes that are basically pretty short, but have just enough aid pitches that they would probably require (yippee!) sleeping overnight.

September 28-30 is available! October 11-14 is looking good.

My schedule is a little freaky, so I can't plan much more in advance than that.