New and Experienced climbers over 50 #21

Nick Goldsmith wrote:

Ok , I guess my lack of judgement on this topic is one of the reasons I am not a guide. and I did eat a brownie last night...  seriously lori you are climbing all these 10s so i just got stoked and recommended some of my favorite climbs and completely forgot your  diabetic issue. 

Nick. I know.  Exuberance.  Me, too.  Thanks for  your friendship.    

Lori, I too feel like all the commentary about what you can or should do, is odd. But I felt Nick’s recommendations warrented pushback. For what it’s worth my commentary did not relate to diabetes, or your climbing prowess. I think the climbing on those routes is great and you’d have no problem with individual pitches. My pushback to Nick was a reflection back to other comments you have made about your endurance limits regarding hiking and exertion measures from your device after certain climbs. These are themes you discuss here almost daily.  

For example the hike to Sugarloaf, which you have commented on several times as difficult for you, is about 600 feet gain in 1/2 mile. I’m the worlds slowest hiker (my mitral valve prolapse really slows me down going uphill) and it takes me about 20 minutes. The approach to Angel Food Wall, where group Therapy and Tunnel are located, takes me about 45 minutes (I’m slow, as I said, the typical person takes 30 minutes). This is one of the easiest approaches for multi-pitch routes in Red Rocks. The approach to Black Velvet Wall is even longer. Follow these approaches by 500 feet of climbing and then descents (gully or rap) then reversing the journey back to trailhead.  This is why I thought Nick’s comments were whack  

None of this is beyond you if it was a goal for you.

Let’s take the focus off Lori. People can feel free to suggest a list of alpine car to car objectives for me that I can ignore. Or suggest a tick list of hard sport routes I have no interest in ever doing. My friend Jay has suggested I should come to Vedawoo and climb off-width with him. Maybe Russ can suggest a list of J Tree training routes for me in advance of a trip I’ll never do. 

Lorie  asked for  a project  suggestion...

phylp phylp wrote:

Lori, I too feel like all the commentary about what you can or should do, is odd. But I felt Nick’s recommendations warrented pushback. For what it’s worth my commentary did not relate to diabetes, or your climbing prowess. I think the climbing on those routes is great and you’d have no problem with individual pitches. My pushback to Nick was a reflection back to other comments you have made about your endurance limits regarding hiking and exertion measures from your device after certain climbs. These are themes you discuss here almost daily.  

For example the hike to Sugarloaf, which you have commented on several times as difficult for you, is about 600 feet gain in 1/2 mile. I’m the worlds slowest hiker (my mitral valve prolapse really slows me down going uphill) and it takes me about 20 minutes. The approach to Angel Food Wall, where group Therapy and Tunnel are located, takes me about 45 minutes (I’m slow, as I said, the typical person takes 30 minutes). This is one of the easiest approaches for multi-pitch routes in Red Rocks. The approach to Black Velvet Wall is even longer. Follow these approaches by 500 feet of climbing and then descents (gully or rap) then reversing the journey back to trailhead.  This is why I thought Nick’s comments were whack  

None of this is beyond you if it was a goal for you.

Let’s take the focus off Lori. People can feel free to suggest a list of alpine car to car objectives for me that I can ignore. Or suggest a tick list of hard sport routes I have no interest in ever doing. My friend Jay has suggested I should come to Vedawoo and climb off-width with him. Maybe Russ can suggest a list of J Tree training routes for me in advance of a trip I’ll never do. 

Yes.  Can I get some suggestions for really good 5.13s for a zero ape index, not tall, 64-year old male ?    

Phylp, "My friend Jay has suggested I should come to Vedawoo and climb off-width with him". My suggestion is that maybe you need some new friends!!!!

Allan. I brought our friend Ed up an off width on upper Willard. He laybacked it and then held up his hands. "see these hands, They don't jam"  ;)

I apologize for an extra post this morning.

I set out for a hike to nowhere this morning and felt such incredible peace that I found myself in a kind of tearful awe. It’s taken a long time to be able to roam without a compass, to be defenseless and free, to feel like I am OK wherever I go and whatever happens. Far more important to me than any climbing project is the ability to  be peaceful and secure in nature. Small snakes slither across my path and every kind of lizard, ravens perch high up… it’s all home now. What a gift. I could walk long miles and not look back.

I really set out to finally identify this rock formation that I have been looking at from a mile away but every time I got up close it’s gone. This time I got right up on it and now I’m wondering if there is any way to set it up for a climb . Right up that ridge, right to the very top. It would probably be a rigging feet but wow!  Picture Lori standing at the very top, waving.  

another power place for me is this leaning tower and I believe it was Bob who put a route up there. I have been begging him to climb it and I am sure if he thought I could handle it it would already be done. I now see the way up, it’s a thin crack to the left beyond a short roof and then onto the face which looks really amazing. Today I was OK it was just sitting and watching it.

OK I’ll chime in with a list of some climbs I don’t think Lori has been exposed to. But all well inside of her skill set.

Upper Right Ski track… 5.3 three star beginner climb, 0 approach, steep exposed climb with big jugs and great exposure 

lands one on summit of intersection rock… then a full 170 foot rap. 

Bacon Flake… 5.8 introduction to vert layback that has good feet..walk to base- about 150 yards. 

Tip Toe 5.7+ … at trash can, good face climbing, again 0 approach… 

All Booked Up… 5.6 crack.. at Houser Gully.

Young Lust 5.8 three stars… a slightly challenging approach- with a guide who can show the correct way it a simple thing to do.

Double Dog Leg… 5.7 Three stars… about 60 feet right of Young Lust.

If you get through the list- in the order I listed you should not get spanked and will learn some new things about climbing.

But before you go get killed on those Tahoe rock approaches you must go to new Jack city and Holcomb… for all the zero approaches and great rock climbing.

Lori if you wish to go visit those spots let me know- I’ll round up a rope gun… Holcomb is up in the Pine trees and it’s a cool pleasant escape from JT furnace. New Jack has zero approach- Tony can hang at the base in lawn chair. Big Bear has some good restaurants for aprez climbing.

You have good goals and the list I gave will challenge your skills and will add to your quiver.

Have a happy day, how’s garden doing?? Right now I’m struggling with getting plants to grow from seeds. Hopefully one of you gardeners out there will chime in. Carl’s advice to water early has made a huge difference. Thx. 

Growing from seed is easy.  Take a size 2 coffee filter and get it fairly damp.  Put a few seeds in between the layers and close the filter up so the seeds are inside.  Put the filter in a baggie and blow some air in to inflate the baggie before sealing closed.  Put the baggie in a cool place.  Get the filter damp again every 4 days as needed.  In two weeks look for the seeds to be sprouted with about one inch of plant sticking out the top and a bit of root out the bottom.  Plant in small pots in potting soil and keep the soil wet.  Watch them grow!

I do not recall how long the hike in and out was with Black Velvet but I recall having an epic while descending Yellow Brick Road and missing my flight back to Bos.
What I do remember is the epic hike in and out for L29 wtih Eric E (lurker here :)). 4 hours ecah way!! To rub it in, I was told afterwards at the climbng shop that it should take about 2 hr if I knew the 'proper trail'. LOL.
I have been told that the hike to Crimson Crysallis is long and tough and one party would race another to get to the climb first.  Sounds like fun!

Guy Keesee wrote:

OK I’ll chime in with a list of some climbs I don’t think Lori has been exposed to. But all well inside of her skill set.

Upper Right Ski track… 5.3 three star beginner climb, 0 approach, steep exposed climb with big jugs and great exposure 

lands one on summit of intersection rock… then a full 170 foot rap. 

Bacon Flake… 5.8 introduction to vert layback that has good feet..walk to base- about 150 yards. 

Tip Toe 5.7+ … at trash can, good face climbing, again 0 approach… 

All Booked Up… 5.6 crack.. at Houser Gully.

Young Lust 5.8 three stars… a slightly challenging approach- with a guide who can show the correct way it a simple thing to do.

Double Dog Leg… 5.7 Three stars… about 60 feet right of Young Lust.

If you get through the list- in the order I listed you should not get spanked and will learn some new things about climbing.

But before you go get killed on those Tahoe rock approaches you must go to new Jack city and Holcomb… for all the zero approaches and great rock climbing.

Lori if you wish to go visit those spots let me know- I’ll round up a rope gun… Holcomb is up in the Pine trees and it’s a cool pleasant escape from JT furnace. New Jack has zero approach- Tony can hang at the base in lawn chair. Big Bear has some good restaurants for aprez climbing.

You have good goals and the list I gave will challenge your skills and will add to your quiver.

Have a happy day, how’s garden doing?? Right now I’m struggling with getting plants to grow from seeds. Hopefully one of you gardeners out there will chime in. Carl’s advice to water early has made a huge difference. Thx. 

Thanks Guy! I have been “exposed“ to some of those you named and wouldn’t mind exposing myself to the rest. The weather is hot after all.   seriously, thank you and everyone for trying to come up with a definitive list. I would love to go to new Jack. I have a feeling I might get a new taste for sport climbing there. As for Tony, he says he cannot bear to watch me climb anymore – – is this bullshit or am I just such a scary climber to watch? As in, such a lousy climber it’s painful to watch. 

We have been discussing Half Track on intersection rock. That looks like a fun challenge. I haven’t stopped thinking about all the routes on Little Hunk and even more so having another go at That Old Soft Shoe.

Thanks to Phylp for clarifying some thoughts. I am really curious… I know I have gone on and on about Sugarloaf. Apologies for the redundancy but I still don’t know if I hiked the easiest trail. Phylp  did you hike up from the street or did you park at the elementary school? I did take my time and stopped along the way to check out boulders and other formations but no way could I have breezed up in 20 minutes.  It could be I really am just slow.

Todd… I thought of you, and Carl, with this rock/boulder.  I don’t know if you can see the first bolt.  It’s a pretty stunning problem.  Not certain but I think you grab the horn and move up on the right. 

Tony Yaniro is perhaps most famous for the FFA of Grand Illusion at Sugarloaf.  His tick list is very long, far ranging, and impressive I am sure.  For example, I think Equinox at JT?
He is a little before my time but I know a bit about his role as tthe US head routesetter for intl level comps in the early and mid '90's. Including the X Games at Newport, RI. The Men's final route looked awesome, most of the competitors looked like they enjoyed it. But it was tough and it spat off all but one, including the Euro superstar of that era; Francois Legrande.
I remember being a little surprised that he is not all that tall.

Re growing from seed, some things reseed themselves and all you need to do is just watch for them to show up and not weed them out. Then let them set seed and do the planting on their own. I have parsnips all over the place, but rather nice lettuces, too. Flowers, etc 

Other things are tough, literally. Some wildflowers need to be frozen, some seeds need to, uh, go through a digestive tract, etc.

If it's just the struggle to direct sow into the garden, and keep them wet enough to get going? Make a little trench for your seeds, the depth it says. Lay them in it, spaced appropriately. Go to any store that has potting soil and grab waterless mix, controlled moisture mix, some kind of label like that. It has something or other in it that retains water for a long time and keeps soil moist. It'll save your ass for hanging baskets, patio pots, shit like that too. Otherwise, they need water every time you walk away.

Anywho, sprinkle that potting soil over your seeds in their little trench. Gently firm it down, and water it gently but thoroughly.

Then (this is the real old timer trick), cut some burlap bags up, lay those over that seeded bit. Water that down. 

Water it regularly, and peek now and then to see if stuff is going. The burlap both shades the soil and holds moisture. The potting soil is an easy thing for seeds to push through, plus, it also holds moisture.

The easiest thing, though, is to let stuff go feral. Kinda like the gardener.   

Best, Helen

Re Tony Yaniro, he was a seriously strong climber bitd, who also put up routes in quite a lot of places. They are still some of the hardest routes in my neck of the woods, 12+ clear back at the start of sport climbing. Not just hard, some I've seen are crazy hard, and look really improbable to even envision routes on those faces at all. But he did. This is also back when anything you could think of was being tried out, including some manufacturing. But, these were hard lines, and are still fun and challenging today.

Best, Helen

EDIT to add:

https://www.mountainproject.com/area/110170627/the-einstein

Read the comments for some background. I've seen this, it's spectacular! Tony Yaniro pic from Leslie Gulch

And a pic of Grand Illusion, credited as the first 5.13b/c

I’m heading back tomorrow from my friend’s memorial service in Arizona.  Been climbing for a few days with my brother and his wife Leslie who is 69.   Here she is in the cave on Stoned Monkeys, 10a.   We’ve been getting up early and climbing in the shade and conditions are much better than back east at the same temperature.

Great to hear from you, Ward.  Doubly glad SmiBro and Leslie are out there too.   She looks strong.  Tell them I said "hi".
It is all about the humidity.  All those dry places are great for climbing many more days of the year!

I put off the gym by a day to give my arm some time to recover.  Today was the day.  It seemed to go okay.  So maybe it is going to behave.  I have a trip to a little crag in western ma this weekend.  Alan and Eric, I bet you've been to Mormon Hollow? 

After that I plan to start training in the gym for my trip to Rumney.  Ward, maybe I'll run into you there.

GO

Gabe, Mormon is one of my favorite crags, not far from my house, but even closer for Ward, just down the hill for him. I was there last Saturday—great conditions and not too busy.

When will you be there? If on Saturday  it is possible I could come over and join you—though  it is raining hard here right now and Mormon can be slow to dry.  Alan

S. Neoh wrote:

I have been told that the hike to Crimson Crysallis is long and tough and one party would race another to get to the climb first.  Sounds like fun!

My first trip to RR I really wanted to do Crimson Chrysalis. I knew the reputation for being busy, so we got a very early start, parked outside the loop and started hiking by headlamp. Not a race, but we did pick up the pace when we heard some other people coming up behind us (they were heading for a different route). Jim said he’d never seen me hike so fast! Anyway, we get there first, I rack up and am already on the first pitch when another party shows up and asks if they can go ahead of us because they will be ‘super fast’. Um…. I’m already climbing? We tell them they can coordinate a pass if necessary. Jim links the 2nd snd 3rd pitches to give us some breathing room, and we make great time with nobody else in sight and relax on top for a bit taking in the views. Then the raps…. Holy cow they should consider placing rap stations off the climbing line. We had to rap through 3 parties - most were super cool, one was not, but that’s another story. Funny thing is - the super fast party that wanted to go ahead of us was still on pitch 4, not so fast. Guy was leading all the pitches, girl following in a tank top and shorts (we were in puffies and were freezing), and she looked miserable. We could still see them making their way up as we hiked out with the sun getting pretty darn low (short days that time of year). That is why people race to the start of CC! 

GabeO wrote:

I put off the gym by a day to give my arm some time to recover.  Today was the day.  It seemed to go okay.  So maybe it is going to behave.  I have a trip to a little crag in western ma this weekend.  Alan and Eric, I bet you've been to Mormon Hollow? 

After that I plan to start training in the gym for my trip to Rumney.  Ward, maybe I'll run into you there.

GO

Morman Hollow was the scene of the first "12a" I ever lead - since downgraded  :-(  That was 30 years ago.  I've been a few times since but like to go with a local because finding the routes and even the approach is a bit convoluted.  Maybe its just me.  Alan knows all.