Crampon fitting

Hi, I just bought a pair of new La Sportiva Nepal Cube boots. My first proper ice climbing boots ever. Before I used hiking boots with Petzl Lynx crampons. Kind of works, but you know, way too flexible. Anyway we went to try these out and the left crampon kept popping off the shoe. Is there anything obviously wrong with my setup? Maybe the front points are too back? Also after the climbing I noticed that I need to use a half step tighter setting for left shoe to get the similar tightness. Is this common that the shoes don't match? 

Those crampons should absolutely work on those boots.  From the toe bail photos and last photo it looks like they may just be too loose?  Have you tried adjusting them in one or two notches and seeing if you can force the bindings shut?  If I'm not afraid to lose a nail when engaging them, they aren't tight enough for me. Also, any particular reason why you felt the need to move the heel bail a notch back?  The frontpoints position looks correct.  (I wrote this while looking at my Cubes and Dart'19 setup as reference.)

For the non-matching settings, yeah, that is normal for me with Petzl crampons.  Their adjustments are so fine that small differences will be reflected in the setting used.

I had a similar issue. Same crampons also on LS boots. And since I don’t have too much experience with this sort of stuff I ended up just switching out the toe bail for a BD one that I also had and it seems to do the trick.

Okay, thank you for the input. Yeah that could be it. The left one maybe just weren't tight enough. I think I can force the left one a whole step tighter and the right one, one half step tighter without too much problem.

I do also have the BD Stingers. Nothing really wrong with them but I kind of feel more confident with two front point than just one. The toe bail of those BD crampons fits way better than the Petzl ones. So maybe I try that if the tightening won't work. 
Also I guess I could just learn to climb with one point but that's a another issue.

Yeah, in that case it is definitely a tightness issue. I usually like to get it to a point where there is basically no way in hell I can close them, then back them off a 1/2 notch.

I moved the heel bail just because it felt like it would fit better to the shoe. That way the crampons stays on even when it's open.

You know like this. But yeah it could be tighter fit if I move it to the center notch.

Heikki Pitkanen wrote: I moved the heel bail just because it felt like it would fit better to the shoe. That way the crampons stays on even when it's open.

You know like this. But yeah it could be tighter fit if I move it to the center notch.

Haha I don’t quite understand how the heel bail wire position is doing anything to keep them hanging on in that photo, but I’m glad you managed to get them to fit! 

Chris C. wrote:

Haha I don’t quite understand how the heel bail wire position is doing anything to keep them hanging on in that photo, but I’m glad you managed to get them to fit! 

It's because I simultaneously compensated the rail length to be shorter when moved the wire position back. However I think you are right. It's much tighter now when I moved just the heel bail wire and nothing else. The whole sole of the shoe flexed when I did that.

Anyway thanks again for the input. These seem way better fit now when I tightened both the rail and the heel wire. Can't wait to try them out. :) 

I’m a novice when it comes to setting up crampons, def no expert. Seems that the toe bail being set on the middle notch is putting the tip of the boot too far forward and also prohibiting the bail to seat correctly in the boot. If you moved the toe bail to the first notch (one closest to the front point of crampon) it would move your boot back a hair and align the wire bail into the boot better. Maybe???

Dylan Carey wrote: I’m a novice when it comes to setting up crampons, def no expert. Seems that the toe bail being set on the middle notch is putting the tip of the boot too far forward and also prohibiting the bail to seat correctly in the boot. If you moved the toe bail to the first notch (one closest to the front point of crampon) it would move your boot back a hair and align the wire bail into the boot better. Maybe???

Yeah that's exactly what I was thinking as well. Also I was thinking that if the front points are too far back I will kick the toe bail to the ice and that could be one of the reason why the crampon came off. Spikes do have a additional notch. It's possible to move them a bit forward. I don't really have an understanding how far they need to be and how far the front of the shoe need to be compared to the crampon.

The front points should only be far forward enough for you to get solid purchase on the ice. Unless you are climbing really soft stuff, I’d be surprised if your front points would dig far in enough for your boots to make contact with the surface. It’s a little hard for me to tell from the photos though. The farther forward your front points are, the farther forward your balance point would be while climbing. The farther forward, the more work it is for your body to keep balance.

As far as I know, on the Lynx it should be fairly easy to adjust just the front points. It could be something you do while toproping.

Okay, I just asked opinion of my climbing friend and he told me pretty much the same thing. So I guess these are forward enough. He also told me that the spikes on his crampons are quite back because they have been worn out/resharpened so much.

I’m going to try toprope next week and see how these work out. If they stay on I‘m definitely going to try and lead something. :)

Chris C. wrote: The front points should only be far forward enough for you to get solid purchase on the ice. Unless you are climbing really soft stuff, I’d be surprised if your front points would dig far in enough for your boots to make contact with the surface. It’s a little hard for me to tell from the photos though. The farther forward your front points are, the farther forward your balance point would be while climbing. The farther forward, the more work it is for your body to keep balance.

As far as I know, on the Lynx it should be fairly easy to adjust just the front points. It could be something you do while toproping.

FYI, Will Gadd disagrees with this suggestion:

​https://willgadd.com/a-simple-fix-frontpoints-and-tibialis-anterior/​​​

For technical ice climbing the front points and the secondary points (the first forward-slanting points on the sides or side rails of the crampons) must both contact the ice when placed with the foot level. If the toe bail is too far forward, and at least 50 percent of the people I see out climbing have the bail too far forward, then only the front points will hit the ice. Without solid secondary points in the ice the foot placement will be really weak and unstable, no matter how hard the climber kicks. The secondary points should protrude just slightly past the front of the boot if the bail is adjusted properly, and fully engage the ice when solidly placed with the sole of the boot level.

Based on the second photo, with the crampons viewed from the side, those secondary points are far too short and not nearly protruding past the front of the boot.

Good to know! 

Kyle Tarry wrote:

FYI, Will Gadd disagrees with this suggestion:

https://willgadd.com/a-simple-fix-frontpoints-and-tibialis-anterior/

Based on the second photo, with the crampons viewed from the side, those secondary points are far too short and not nearly protruding past the front of the boot.

I will be sending this to some people who very much need to hear this, thanks!

I have the same boot / crampon setup.

I have the left and right crampons adjusted differently to fit the boots.  Same with the strap in bindings on my BD Glidelite skis.  Normal for those boots.

I moved the toe bail to the rear most hole to get the secondary points far enough forward. 

Interesting and makes sense but now I'm a little bit confused where (which holes) should I put the back bail? I already got it very tight. The whole boot flexed invard. Maybe it was even too tight?
Now with the new adjustment it's tight but not that tight. I can compare the tightness to my BD Stingers crampons and Stingers are bit tighter than Lynx.
Sorry about the bad explaining. Maybe the pictures do better work at it.

Top view but the camera angle seem to be different than in my second photo. 

~45 degrees

Side view

Close up about the gap. Should I hammer this in for a better fit?

Rail setting. Left boot. The size is EUR 42/USM 9/UK 8

Back view. Notice the small cap. It's possible to take the rail in one notch but then I have to put the back bail in last notch. Now it's in the middle one.

Comapered to the Stinger. Looks now quite similar.

The front point of the stinger is a little bit lower.

I'm also running size 42 Nepal Cubes with Petzl Lynx - I don't have any photos but here is how I have the crampons set up to fit the boot.

- Toe bail in the furthest back position (the one farthest from the front points). This is to allow better secondary point contact as discussed above.
- When viewed from below, 'G' is the letter on the linking bar right before the heel bail. From above, 'H' is partially visible and 'G' is wholly visible.
- The heel bail is in the middle position

If I have time to pull my stuff out and take/transfer photos, I'll upload them here, but I hope this helps! It's probably not as tight a fit as some people demand, but I haven't noticed any wobbling while climbing and they haven't popped off yet.

This reminds me that I've also noticed that the fit is tighter on the right boot than the left, and that when I switched the heel bails between the crampons the fit got tighter on the left side. So it seems that slight variations in the bails can make decent changes in how snug the resulting fit is. That said, I don't notice any slop in the looser side, just that the heel bail is harder to engage on the tighter side.

I'm learning so much more about ice climbing and crampon fit these days and it would seem those Stingers are a much better fit. Like I said I've been using LS boots with the Lynx myself and honestly not too sure how I like them overall. From here on out I may have to start rocking some BD monos. Let me know if you want to get rid of those things!