When you totally suck, have you made it better?

Kent Richards wrote:An easy way to make it heaps better is to quit telling yourself that you suck...

That's a great piece of advice right there...

Unfortunately, it can feel damn near impossible to do when the mental shit is hitting the fan on a route that should otherwise be a walk in the park.

The best way I've found to get around this, is too climb with a great partner. Choose someone that understands what you are looking for, and encourages you when your shit starts falling apart. Try to reciprocate generously when it's their day to flail.

On a side note... Great thread, Shawn. It's nice to see that I'm not the only one struggling for no reason at random times.

Enjoyed this thread a ton.

3 years ago had Afib (275-315 beats per min). 2 cardio version and 1 major ablation set my workout life style back 2 years. Got back into gym. Few months into it almost snapped my right wrist in half when I failed on a power clean... Took 4-5 months before I could do a single push-up...

It's been a year since my wrist and today in the gym it was killing me and my climbing buddy reminded me at least I can climb, play with my kids and still enjoy a ton out of life. So I quit the pity party and moved on with a smile on my face.

Glad that I can do what I can and that my kids want to do things with me.

I stepped back over the rails of the freeway overpass when I saw MP's list and realized I've done half the top 10 all time classics. :)

But doesn't mean it's not a bummer to be fat and lame.

It's better to have climbed and crushed than to have never crushed at all.

It's better to have climbed and flailed than to have never climbed at all.

Ado. Ado.

Shawn Mitchell wrote:But doesn't mean it's not a bummer to be fat and lame.

Lots of people find ways to lose weight... My friend lost a lot of weight just by cutting down on alcohol & sugar, and climbing a few flights of stairs every day. I lose weight when I go on extended camping / climbing trips. In my 20s I lost a ton of weight by eating just salad & protein for a couple of weeks; it was a bit drastic and probably not good for me, but it's pretty clear evidence that cutting calories will work.

Kent Richards wrote:but it's pretty clear evidence that cutting calories will work.

Yeah, pretty simple formula relative to more calories out than in - shut cakehole, move extremities, repeat on a daily basis. That said, cutting the alcohol and sugar right of the top is a great way to start along with just walking every day. Gotta start somewhere and these two aren't a bad place to begin.

Healyje wrote: Yeah, pretty simple formula relative to more calories out than in - shut cakehole, move extremities, repeat on a daily basis. That said, cutting the alcohol and sugar right of the top is a great way to start along with just walking every day. Gotta start somewhere and these two aren't a bad place to begin.

I drank very little to begin with so cutting the alcohol out didn't change much. I do notice though that I feel better with no alcohol, and also it's pretty easy for one beer/wine to turn into 3 or 4 which is a decent amount of calories, and also drinking lowers my inhibition to eat more dessert or whatever in addition.

The refined sugar on the other hand, was massive, because at least for me, eating anything with a lot of sugar in it is a huge stimulant to my appetite. This turns out to apply to obvious things like dessert, but also less obvious things like conventional peanut butter. I don't restrict carbs in any other way, just no food with added sugar. In and of itself cutting out sugar didn't make me lose much weight, but when combined with a fairly gentle calorie-restricted diet (using Myfitnesspal app) the results have been great it's been surprisingly easy to stick to without all the sugar-induced cravings. The last time I weighed what I weigh now, I was about 16 (48 now) and much weaker.

I agree with cutting calories and physical activity to lose weight but I also feel what you eat is important too.

I have seen people get terrible results eating garbage at 2500 calories vs someone eating good food at 2500 calories.

When I trained for a Combine I weighed 184 and 26% body fat in October and 194 and 14% in May for the combine. 3200 calories a day of solid food (one Dairy Queen blizzard each Saturday) yielded some amazing results. Basically 48lbs of fat when I started and 27lbs when the comp came up. Gained 32lbs of muscle also. Had I ate garbage I know my results would no where near that good. I was 30 years old when I did that.

Even now when I have dieted if I eat garbage my results are lack luster.

So train right and eat good for best results.

Shawn Wilson wrote:I agree with cutting calories and physical activity to lose weight but I also feel what you eat is important too. I have seen people get terrible results eating garbage at 2500 calories vs someone eating good food at 2500 calories. When I trained for a Combine I weighed 184 and 26% body fat in October and 194 and 14% in May for the combine. 3200 calories a day of solid food (one Dairy Queen blizzard each Saturday) yielded some amazing results. Basically 48lbs of fat when I started and 27lbs when the comp came up. Gained 32lbs of muscle also. Had I ate garbage I know my results would no where near that good. I was 30 years old when I did that. Even now when I have dieted if I eat garbage my results are lack luster. So train right and eat good for best results.

Nice to see football players climb too!

For me, my story is slightly different.

October 2014, I fell 50ft while free soloing, without a helmet. I broke my skull, a vertebrae in my neck and left shoulder. About a year before that is when I started. I was leading 5.6-5.7 sport routes and had never done any trad.

Then I fell. And my life changed....

For me, it's been about relearning the proper way after I moved back to CA for recovery/rehab. Knowing what I do now, I felt I wasn't taught with emphasis the essential fundamentals(footwork, anchor building etc.) It was just tie in, grab quickdraws, belay device and climb. Look for the bolts and that's your route. A year "aniversary" from my accident, I followed my partner on a 5.10a/b, 2 pitch trad route. 3 years ago, I could've only dreamt of climing that hard. The other day, I fuckin' did it!

So, I totally sucked by not checking my ego(i should've read Rock Warriors Way, damnit!), sustaining severe, life threatening injuries and not learning more fundamentals properly. And what made me better was, having a 2nd chance at life, a new, much more experienced partner/friend whos taught me 1,000% more and a much different perspective on what it means to climb for me. It's my escape, not just something I do for fun.

This is a great thread and really resonates with me. Here are a few disconnected thoughts and observations from my own life. I'm writing this for myself as much as for the thread. I have a lot of experience after climbing, sometimes inconsistently, for well over 15 years. There have been 6-12 month periods where I've done very little, very irregularly. I've gotten back into climbing after time away on more occasions over the years than I can count.

-The inevitable comparing of myself to others, at least to some degree, is tough. I've seen friends, acquaintances and strangers take to climbing so much more quickly than I ever have, progressing through the grades and climbing harder than me in short order. Watching newbies walk up to a V4 in the gym and flash it, that I can't even send after working the moves, can be incredibly frustrating. But I have a lot of decent technique and the desire to climb in control; wild thrashing and hulking up something isn't appealing, but I still wish I was sending.

-When getting back into the game I try to focus on my strengths. Personally, crack climbing comes more naturally to me than some people. Watching a 5.12 sport climber flail on a 5.10 in Indian Creek, that I can send with some ease, is comforting, given that I struggle on a 5.9 sport climb. I'm also a pretty good trad climber and very comfortable above gear. Seeing a 5.11 climber nervous on 5.7 trad reminds me that we all have our battles.

-A solid lead head is worth AT LEAST 3 grades for me. If I'm climbing in a relaxed and confident way, not over-gripping and breathing well, it seems strength for me doesn't play all that much of a role. A good head day might be 5.9 as opposed to a bad head day at 5.6.

-When getting back into it, play to your strengths. Eldo is scary for me when I haven't been climbing there much. I've had the EXACT same experience on Wind Ridge. Instead of jumping on that, go to a well or even over-bolted sport crag and send a bunch of easy stuff on lead. Choose areas and climbs with low fall consequences (that first move on Wind Ridge being a great example of what not to do). I am far more inspired to challenge myself crack climbing than other things, and for some reason Vedauwoo is my magic place. The amount of lead-head confidence I can earn from climbing short, adventurous and well-protected solid rock is invaluable. That's not the case for everyone, but it plays to my strengths. I always walk away with such a huge smile on my face from a day there.

-Be patient and give yourself time and mileage before you push things in terms of grade, climbing style and/or head challenge (ie: longer routes, more runout climbs, trad, etc.) Lots of small successes add up in a profound way for me.

-Try to be nice to yourself and okay that there are bad head and high-gravity days. Two weeks ago I led all of Royal Flush and rocked it. It was my best day of climbing in probably a couple of years. I had this focus and boldness in my climbing and was really proud of myself for dealing with the run outs and having smooth flow through cruxes. Then yesterday I had a weird head day and was a mess in Clear Creek on super well-bolted routes with zero run-outs. I have a hard time reconciling those two days but am trying to be nice to myself about it. At least I tried and worked through it, despite being a messy bundle of nerves.

-Fall in the gym. A lot. Only a year ago did I learn how to do this correctly. Simply letting go is completely unnatural and scary. Instead, make a big move or aim for a crappy hand hold that you know you probably won't stick. Start falls with the bolt at your waist, and gradually work up to bigger and bigger falls.

-Get some coaching. A couple of years ago I decided on a whim to sign up for a class at Earth Treks. Even after nearly 20 years of climbing, I thought what the hell? At the very least it would get me to the gym 2-3x/week regularly. It did just that, but turned out to be amazing. I couldn't believe how much I learned. The whole gym culture has really refined coaching in an amazing way. Most people like us started climbing by just doing it and figuring things out along the way. Now I have a whole stable of techniques that I practice and know how to put together a basic training regimen with some supervision.

I just wrote all of this as a message to myself more than anyone else. After a month of some big highs and lows, it's good to remind myself what I already know. I'm kind of dense that way. :)

Thanks to those in the thread who said, in one way or another, that it's awesome to simply be out climbing. Whatever we're doing, a day on the rock is a win.

Shawn, also, remember that you can simply work an old route you used to climb clean until you have it so rehearsed it goes down with very little effort. This helps the ego immensely.

Heck. You were doing walls as a teen, and did the Diamond a few years ago, and don't think you were ever a good climber. Tough crowd. Sounds pretty good to me.

But I relate to this thread. Having had both shoulder surgery and hand surgery in this last year and now trying to get back on the horsie, and it's like "Dang. I really SUCK!" Right now that West Ridge move would be a little much, and I don't even have the excuse of gaining 30 lbs. So you're not alone.

I'm 57, but age is no excuse IMO. At least I should be able to do 5.9 trad I figure. But I think it's going to take consistent action, might even call it training if 50 somethings can actually do that. Baby steps. And I have to re-evaluate why I climb (or try to), and it becomes less about performance, and more about the joy of movement, the view, all that ancillary stuff. I'm going to concentrate on that. You can enjoy it without necessarily rocking it.

Shawn Mitchell wrote:Looking for rehab and redemption stories. I failed today on Wind Ridge in Eldo. Classic easy that I’ve dragged numerous beginners up. Couldn’t get on the climb because I couldn't throw to the top of the (soft rated) entry move 5.8 flake. Fell once, twice, tried the 5.7 edge out right, and fell again. Disgusted, discouraged, and panting, I shouted to my partner, (classy and patient John Schroyer who writes for some marijuana industry newsletter) that I was going to hike down to the mob under Calypso and recruit someone to finish and clean the pitch. Thank you, Alex visiting from Connecticut. A little background before I ask for your input. I’ve never been a “good” climber, but I’m an experienced and in memory, a strong climber. Been climbing almost 40 years. Big walls when I was a teen; Casual on Longs a few years ago; get off the couch and grunt up 5.9/10. On my 48th birthday, I soloed the first three Flatirons in an afternoon. I think of myself as a should be 5.10/11 climber who is out of shape. I’m 52 today, and a lot has changed. Became a depressed alcoholic. Sit at a desk too much. Don’t work out enough. Gained 30 pounds. 185 is lean and strong. I weigh 215. Since I’ve surely lost at least 10 pounds of muscle, then I’m carrying 40 pounds of fat. Don’t look obese. Just not slim. I haven’t climbed in two years. I think I’m a climber, I just don’t get out. But freaking Wind Ridge? A silly little boulder move I’ve done 20 plus times? Have you ever discovered yourself totally out of your game? Like, what the hell, how can I be this lame? Did you recover and get back on your game? What was the path like?

Climbing friend,

The life is a short. Do not focus on this unflash! Do not drink the alcohols. It would not be worth it. Perhaps become a radical vegan activist. Get yourself out to those boulders or air conditioned climbing rocks of plastic, few times per week for hard punishing, and you will have crushing grip of iron fist back in no time and feel most excellent, climbing friend, with the strength, the power and the wellbeing coursing through your well defined veins! And you likely even experience considerable increase in neck and back meat volume for pulling power max! myah!

Started climbing and two months in, dislocated my shoulder on a 5.8 slab climb. Took the PT route and am back climbing about 3 months, sent my first 5.10 outdoors a couple of weeks ago and am super stoked to be back.

This is a good thread.Thanks to all posting! Currently out with a blown disk in my neck and looks like surgery ahead. I cant move my right arm correctly and its very painful. The last time I had a bad injury was 6 years ago. Then I threatened to sell my gear and never return to climbing or skiing. This time I've been working on a recovery and rehab plan since day one of the injury,even before I could get a treatment plan. Started with walking to hiking easy grade to recumbent bike at the gym. Heading to squats and leg presses. Doing calorie and nutrients counts to avoid as much muscle loss and fat gain as possible. I'm not going to give up or give in. 99% of what people call 'aging' is really a fitness issue. Encouragement and strong vibes to all of us.

dylan grabowski wrote: Nice to see football players climb too!

Good catch, Dylan. My partner on Mescalito in 1981 was a high school football lineman, Rick Lynsky. Los Alamitos? Seal Beach? I've lost track. He had a cool scar on his chin from a fall in Joshua Tree and a great story about making up a different reason for that injury because he was afraid his coach would be pissed that he was climbing.

Rick went on to be a paramedic then firefighter then fire chief and Firegod in Redlands California and Park City, Utah. I think he was part of the preparations and security for the Winter Olympics in Park City. Not sure exactly what he's doing now. We should catch up with the people in our lives.

One of Rick's best friends, and one of the nicest humans I've known was a guy named Curt Minnis who was on the same football team I think. When I took my younger brother climbing to J Tree, Curt was as nice to him as anyone could ever be. Little bro Randy mentioned it for years. Curt has a great story about the high school coaches setting up a death marathon of lifting, running, field drills, obstacle course stuff, continuing endlessly until everyone dropped out and only one man was left standing. Rick and Curt were nauseaus with dread and competitive anticipation. The school principal learned of the event and canceled it.

Rick and Curt later climbed Half Dome Direct Northwest Face (not the Regular). So those are two football climbers I know. :) Rick and a smaller non football type named Quinn McCleod also did a bunch of El Cap Routes, not sure which all, but they include Lurking Fear and Muir Wall. Then they became Canadian Alpine climbers and I lost track of them... Quinn became a firefighter in Colorado. We climbed once or thrice here in Eldo. Oh, and Rick and I climbed Leaning Tower and Quinn and I climbed The Prow on Washington Column.

Sometimes reflecting reminds you (me) it's a wonderful community in climbing.

I think it can just be a matter of will sometimes. I got cancer two years ago at 56 years old and didn't do anything for almost two years. Went down to 110 lbs., which is about 35 pounds below my natural weight. After getting through treatment, I pounded protein shakes to the tune of 3,000 calories a day. I thought I'd never get my weight back until one night in bed, I looked down and saw fat on my stomach. Got a gym pass the next day (6 weeks ago) and figured anything I climbed was a bonus after what I'd been through.

I've diligently hit the gym the last six weeks and I'm hitting the 11s and starting to hit V5. Got out for the first time this weekend, led 8 routes, mostly easy 10s and thought, "How cool is this? Almost dead to out having a blast." I'm now 58 and climbing way below my old standards but at this point, who gives a shit?

Just get focused, find some folks to enjoy and appreciate whatever you get.

Frank

The standard cure is not just a good idea and does not just apply to intelligence/shoe size/etc.

It applies applies directly also to performance. 95% of the time performance is going to fall into the big part of the bell curve when we seem to throw down with business as usual.

There will be those days, however, when you are a real rockstar....and those days when you fail at everything easy (extreme ends of the curve).

You are human. Lick yer wounds and get after it again. Aside from cutting off any hipster hair/beard, persistence and patience with yourself will win in the end.

Ben Woods wrote: Aside from cutting off any hipster hair/beard,

And Shawn, stop racking biners in your ear gauges, that is bound to get you in trouble. A fanatic belief in global warming and a fixed gear bike might make you leaner though.