Wind River Canyon, Wy discussion

So I drive through the Wind River Canyon (between Shoshone and Thermopolis, Wy) frequently for my job. The majority of the canyon is part of the Wind River Indian Reservation and, according to the info here it is illegal to climb in. Now this sucks because there are well over ten quality looking ice routes and easily hundreds of quality rock routes throughouth the length of the incredible canyon. Does anyone know of the process one would have to go through to get permission to climb there? Has anyone done it? I wonder which have been climbed (legally and illegally) and how many are named/greded. Is there any record of FAs for the canyon?

The outlook for any climbing in WRC is bleak. I have it on good authority (after discussion with a couple of enrolled Shosoni tribal members who are also climbers) that there are supposed burial grounds in and among the cliff bands. How much of this is true and how much is lore is debatable, but the tribal council's stance is that they don't want anyone going up there, especially people climbing and disturbing culturally sensitive and spiritually important sights. While being a climber myself and drooling over the cliffs there repeatedly, I can understand the council's view. The US and state governments have not always been on the best of terms with the tribal government in regards to land and water rights issues. I don't know if it would ever be possible to even get limited climbing access there, so the illegal option is probably always going to be the only one. Sorry, I don't know of any recorded routes there except for a pinnacle overlooking the road that goes at 5.7.

Maybe the Access Fund or some other group could do something that a private citizen could not. I don't hold much faith in that due to WRC being in a remote area of a sparsely populated state. WRC would hold THOUSANDS of routes from 5.6 to 5.15 (you should take a look at the big cave across the river in a side canyon which is just visible as you are driving toward Thermopolis). It does suck, but I don't think there's anything to be done.

There is a bit of hope for climbing on the rez. Some of the cliffs around Ft Washakie reportedly do not have burial or other sacred sights. The aforementioned climbers from the Shosoni tribe have expressed a lot of interest in developing these areas, but still would need approval of the joint tribal council.

A shame, that canyon is amazing. Although remote, it would be a destination for sure.

It is a beautiful place.

But we should respect the wishes of the tribe. There's
plenty of rock & ice all around that we don't need to
deface their holy places.

I drove through the WRC yesterday, a quick google search brought me to this discussion. I'm not surprised that I'm not the only one to pull my truck over several times on the way through so I can gawk at the cliffs.

It's disappointing that the prospect of opening a climbing area there is so bleak. The Indians have every right to say no, but they also stand to gain money and ouside appreciation of their heritage if they open up the land. Given how far away WRC is from any major population center, I think that land degredation is not a big risk, since it would be exclusivly climbers visiting and climbers are a pretty respectful group of ladies and gents.

It might be hopeless, but I think at the very least this topic deserves a bump. BUMP.

Ryan Derrick wrote:I drove through the WRC yesterday, a quick google search brought me to this discussion. I'm not surprised that I'm not the only one to pull my truck over several times on the way through so I can gawk at the cliffs. It's disappointing that the prospect of opening a climbing area there is so bleak. The Indians have every right to say no, but they also stand to gain money and ouside appreciation of their heritage if they open up the land. Given how far away WRC is from any major population center, I think that land degredation is not a big risk, since it would be exclusivly climbers visiting and climbers are a pretty respectful group of ladies and gents. It might be hopeless, but I think at the very least this topic deserves a bump. BUMP.

I think it more comes down to historically *very* bad interactions resulting from white folks taking the pick of the lands on the reservation (the entire city of Riverton was formed that way).
My outlook has been (and continues to be) that Wyoming is such a big place with so much untouched rock and ice that losing 15 miles of canyon just doesn't upset me that much.

I was "busted" about 30 years ago climbing ice in WR Canyon. We did 2, maybe 3 of the climbs before we had any trouble, and yes they are very good ice climbs. The Bureau of Rec police called us down while we were on one of the climbs, and we actually finished the pitch in order to recover our gear. They were friendly, and didn't actually arrest us, but they made it very clear after taking our drivers' license and information that if we came back we would go to jail. This was back in the day when it was a lot easier to play stupid as there were relatively few ice climbers back then.

My attitude has changed since then, and to tell you the truth, it's their land, and they have been screwed throughout history. My feeling is if they don't want climbers in the canyon, there is nothing to do but respect their wishes.

Long time ago, I used to cross the reservation to get into a remote area in the wind river mountains. I would get way back in the wilderness to a lake that had a canoe left on the shore for anyone to use. It was a mystery how the canoe got there because the hike in was steep, rugged, and didn't follow any trails.

One day, I got talking to a local who knew the area and the origin of the canoe. The story goes that NOLS used a snowmobile to drag the canoe into the wilderness in the winter. However, the reservation got word of the incident and banned NOLS from using the reservation as access.

This was about the same time that I was informed by a reservation official that I could no longer cross the res to get to the wind river wilderness unless I hired a guide for about $400 to get me across.

I appreciate the tribe's stance on prohibiting climbing in the canyon, but I think with the right management strategy, they could stand to gain from development of climbing. I think of some of the East coast climbing area models that could be applied to an area like the WRC. Have limited camping options that charge a fee (like the private camping around the New River Gorge), charge a reasonable fee for climbing/parking access, and use clear signage and develop clear and well-constructed trails to minimize the effects of usage. The New River Gorge is a remote and awesome climbing area that has employed a few of these tactics to support sustainability and the local economy. The Gunks comes to mind too as an area on tribal land that is managed to the benefit of the tribe that owns the land.

I'm not into the idea of tromping all over sacred ground, so I respect the tribe's position, but I do like the idea of mutually beneficial solutions to climbing access issues.

Really dude?

Shit like that just indicates to res government that even if they worked with us to have a reasonable climbing plan in place, we'd just do whatever regardless.

But I guess your couple of pitches of glory, iconoclast self-image, and selfie game are worth fucking over all future climbers.

Robert 

When/if this happens, you know as well as I know that Wyoming will be a fucking climbing mecca on the same scale as Yosimete. 

I sure as hell hope WY doesn't become like the valley.

A bold statement but it's old news that the state is stacked with great climbing.  I would be happy to see access in WRC but there is a lifetime of great climbing even without it.

Sorry for blasting you there, but you might lead with "first legal climbs in Wind River Canyon" or something.

As it stood, it looked to everyone who isn't intimately familiar with that canyon and it's property boundaries (so, including the res) that you're just another entitled jackass poaching climbs in an off-limits area. I'm not angry about you climbing. I'm angry that the pictures suggest a story that endangers any future negotiations.

Think about the work you've done to get here. Now imagine if some idiot saw your pictures, thought "it's ok, I won't get caught", and does something to get the BLM and the private property owner to close the area to climbers again.

That's why I'm angry.

Is it legal to run the river through the WRC?

Drew Spaulding wrote:

Is it legal to run the river through the WRC?

Not without a tribal guide.

Drove through this while heading to Ten Sleep. Wondered why I'd never heard of it. Not surprised to read this. Thought I'd post this highly relevant Climbing Gold episode. Yep, let's leave climbing here alone. climbinggold.com/episodes/c…

Sounds about like what I figured so I never asked or thought about it, but I have been through this canyon every year since I was a kid and I just love to drool at the beautiful thousands of route possibilities and the fantastic ice falls in the winter, bout crashed the damn car a few times lol.  The pinnacle looks sweet!