Verbage?
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I'm just curious as to what the general consensus is for an onsight. Basically, does knowing the grade of the climb and nothing else constitute an onsight? I was always under the impression that an nsight was just that, finding a cool line, knowing nothing about it and climbing it clean. I'm usually not too concerned about what I label my climbs and attempts ect but this has kind of been an ongoing argument/misunderstanding amoungst my climbing crew, and I'm curious to see what other people consider onsights. |
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On an onsight to me is not having climbed or rappeled the route prior to leading it. Doesn't matter if you do or do not know the name of the route or the rating or other such info. |
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My understanding is the same as could be found here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloss… |
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Casey Lems wrote:My understanding is the same as could be found here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloss… On-sight A clean ascent, with no prior practice or beta. Beta Advice and/or instructions on how to successfully complete a particular climbing route, boulder problem, or crux sequence. Flash To successfully and cleanly complete a climbing route on the first attempt after having received beta of some form. Also refers to an ascent of this type. For ascents on the first attempt without receiving beta see on-sight. So to be clear, I don't consider difficulty of a route to be beta.Question is what is beta? I don't think beta is a route description in a guidebook. Beta is first hand info move by move, perhaps? |
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See At first I felt the same way, knowing the grade is not beta, but the more I think about it knowing a grade tells you a lot about a climb and to me constitutes beta. basically, knowing the grade dictates whether I'm willing to lead it without any practice/beta. Every once in a while I'll walk up to a climb that looks fun and be ready to jump on and lead it until someone tells me its rating, then I start second guessing myself. |
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Devin C. wrote:See At first I felt the same way, knowing the grade is not beta, but the more I think about it knowing a grade tells you a about a climb and to me constitutes beta. basically knowing the grade dictates quite a bit if I'm willing to get on the sharp end without any practice/beta.If that is what an onsight is, then only a first ascent would be an onsight...which is highly doubtful. Old school onsight: I read a route description in the guidebook and climbed it without any other info. How would you know if the climb exists without knowing about it from some source? You'd at least know the grade, probably the number of pitches, descriptions of each pitch (or a topo). |
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Good point tradster, the only feasible scenario would be knowing of a crag but not having specific info about the climbs there. Going out finding lines you like and climbing them based only on your impression from the ground, which would make onsight claims much more rare. Like everything else in climbing it up to you individual feelings. |
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I don't consider knowing the grade of the route beta |
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so, this is from a Rock & Ice article (a friend sent me the link, I swear). the author uses the term "onsight flash" in this context: |
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Interesting article clip, I guess that seems to be a pretty good definition, it seems that i call all my "onsights" (Know rout name/grade) flashes, when their really both!! |
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All I know is that when you get past 50, an onsight is when you haven't been on the climb for at least a week prior. |
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As in, "Hey dear, how about an onsight?"? |
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Calirado wrote:As in, "Hey dear, how about an onsight?"?No, that's more like a flash. |
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And with a laborious, uncertain approach. |
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Devin C. wrote:Good point tradster, the only feasible scenario would be knowing of a crag but not having specific info about the climbs there. Going out finding lines you like and climbing them based only on your impression from the ground, which would make onsight claims much more rare. Like everything else in climbing it up to you individual feelings.Or you could just not read the guide book...... |
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Casey Lems wrote:My understanding is the same as could be found here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gloss… On-sight A clean ascent, with no prior practice or beta. Beta Advice and/or instructions on how to successfully complete a particular climbing route, boulder problem, or crux sequence. Flash To successfully and cleanly complete a climbing route on the first attempt after having received beta of some form. Also refers to an ascent of this type. For ascents on the first attempt without receiving beta see on-sight. So to be clear, I don't consider difficulty of a route to be beta.+1 Rating of a climb is not beta- its a guideline, which, like onsight and flash, also lies in the eye of the beholder, as guidelines are vauge. Rating tells you nothing about a specific climb- it merely suggests its difficulty. Hence, I agree, these definitions are correct. An onsight-flash, seriously? Is that like a second-first ascent? |
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+2 |
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Gosh I feel old. I've been using the term "flash" to mean climb with style, grace, or without apparent difficulty. I might have substituted the term "cruise." It was a description of aplomb, or better than expected where things cosmically flowed together, as in "I flashed the climb." The opposite might be, perhaps, "thrashed." I'm sure glad I don't have to characterize my climbs to anyone else (I'm still not clear on the red- or pink-point to where I'd use it in a sentence). |
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Richard Radcliffe wrote:All I know is that when you get past 50, an onsight is when you haven't been on the climb for at least a week prior.Richard, that is hilarious and I certainly can relate. LOL! |
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You guys are funny. |
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J C Wylks wrote:So if you're over 50, what's it called if you forget the beta while you are climbing? Senor Onsight?Alzheimer's point. |