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TR Anchor with only 1 tree

Original Post
kday · · Burlington, Vermont · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 0

There's a route I found that I'd like to climb but there's not much in terms of building an anchor.

There's 1 giant tree near the edge (maybe 3 feet in diameter and only 2 feet from the edge) that would be great for the anchor, however there's nothing else.

I know the key is redundancy so I was curious if just using this one tree would be safe. I'm confident the tree is going nowhere :)

Also, since there's only one tree what's the recommended anchor to build on it? Could I rely on 1 static line for the anchor? I don't have anything long enough as far as webbing/cordellete to wrap around the tree.

george wilkey · · travelers rest sc · Joined Jan 2013 · Points: 235

although redundency is always better its pretty commen to use one tree for an anchor. just give it a good inspection beforehand.

i'd go with a double line(as in two seperate) around it.

and remember a wise saying i once heard:"it may have been there a long time but it won't be there forever."

kday · · Burlington, Vermont · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 0

Sorry. Not trolling. I'm still new to building anchors and have only been taught to make it redundant as possible - probably why I posted on the beginner thread.

doligo · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 264

Let's remember that it's a beginners forum - be nice.

Kenny, if the tree is alive and sturdy (not budging when you push it), it should be more than an adequate anchor. The best material to build an anchor would be a long static line. Just wrap it around the tree trunk a few times (the friction alone will keep the line in place) and close the loop whatever method you prefer (a biner, rabbit ears, BFK, double bowline).

kday · · Burlington, Vermont · Joined Mar 2014 · Points: 0

Thanks for the info. May need to think twice about posting here.

Anson Call · · Reno, NV · Joined Jan 2010 · Points: 45

Hey kday,

Sorry for all the attitudes here. You had a great question, and I think George and doligo have answered it well. Please stick around! MOST of us are happy to answer questions, even simple ones.

To those who responded sincerely, thanks for making this forum a great community of climbers.

Ben Warner · · NM · Joined Sep 2009 · Points: 5

I get asked about this a lot, and my typical response is something along the lines of: "if a three-foot diameter tree, near the top of my climb, fails, I will have more to worry about than the redundancy of my anchor."

That said, if you do plan to only rely on one anchor point, you should ensure that you agree with this perspective. And ultimately, you will probably be fine, just make sure your rigging and master point are redundant.

Travis Haussener · · Unknown Hometown · Joined May 2012 · Points: 60

I like the fist rule...if the width (diameter) is bigger than or equal to your fist your good to go. Aside from catastrophic failure in the soil etc.

Jason Halladay · · Los Alamos, NM · Joined Oct 2005 · Points: 15,153
Anson Call wrote:Hey kday, Sorry for all the attitudes here. You had a great question, and I think George and doligo have answered it well. Please stick around! MOST of us are happy to answer questions, even simple ones. To those who responded sincerely, thanks for making this forum a great community of climbers.
Hey kday, Anson has it right. The majority of folks on these threads are good people and happy to answer questions. Unfortunately there are a handful of folks that are more vocal and generally not as friendly (jerks) but learn to ignore them and don't even give them so much as a reply and we'll all be better for it. Internet forums, in general, have this problem so the ignoring skill will prove useful any many internet situations.

To answer your original question, Dolgio's advice is great. A big tree like that is bomber (assuming the tree is healthy-looking). The weight of climbers on the lowest part of the tree trunk, near the roots, will be easy on the tree. I'd still like two strands of static line just to make me feel better but in reality, if the edge of the cliff is not sharp (or you pad the edge well) a single strand would be plenty adequate.
Red · · Tacoma, Toyota · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 1,625

kday, I wanted to ask before I went into a long response. This website gets lots of trollers asking similar type questions. It looks like you've got a few good responses now. I suggest trying to find a climbing partner with lots of experience. It is really nice when you can find someone to "show you the ropes" while you're learning. Books and professional guides are other options.

Dave Holliday, why? I suppose I could if you do. If you frequent the forums here, you should understand that my question is not off basis. Lots of similar type troll posts by new users on this website.

edit to add: Am I missing something here? Is my inquiring the OP if he was sincerer really as bad as telling him he's "gonna die!"?

David Gibbs · · Ottawa, ON · Joined Aug 2010 · Points: 2

Generally speaking, a big living tree is absolutely bomber. The amount of force you can put on it, wrapped around near the base, is trivial compared to the amount of force a bit of wind through the upper branches will exert.

Where to consider redundancy, here, is in your own gear. And static chord is quite acceptable for anchor building in this, or any other, application, assuming it is appropriately strength rated.

doligo · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 264

^^ I didn't quote you, but since you asked I took your name out of my post.

I don't really care if we feed trolls with trivial questions like this - you have to remember that other beginners will come and read the same post and will take the advice to hearts. I'm glad that people like Kday ask questions and approach climbing conservatively, rather than nonchalantly like many do.

Re: finding experienced partners, mentors - easier said than done. As a beginner, you can't tell well if the "experienced" partner really does exercise the best practices. If anything, there are many oldschoolers out there stuck in their pre-SRENE ways. A lot of times people blindly entrust themselves into hands of mentors, don't ask any questions and develop a casual attitude about safety.

Red · · Tacoma, Toyota · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 1,625
doligo wrote: Re: finding experienced partners, mentors - easier said than done. As a beginner, you can't tell well if the "experienced" partner really does exercise the best practices. If anything, there are many oldschoolers out there stuck in their pre-SRENE ways. A lot of times people blindly entrust themselves into hands of mentors, don't ask any questions and develop a casual attitude about safety.
Very true and something I agree with. Since kday is asking questions now, it makes me think he'd also ask questions to people that show him new techniques outside. But likewise, as a beginner, you can't tell if randoms on the internet are giving the best advise either.
bearbreeder · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Mar 2009 · Points: 3,065
rescuedynamics.ca/articles/…

they have a part on tree anchors

best free anchoring resource on da intrawebs

;)
Craig Childre · · Lubbock, TX · Joined Aug 2006 · Points: 4,860

A live tree with a 3' trunk with a solid foundation is pretty much bomber in most books. Loose soil, or recent rainfall could destabilize the tree, so be sure to check it every time you set up. Seemingly bomber trees have failed, and they all eventually will. Climb safe.. better to ask this question now, rather than having to answer one like "what caused this accident?"

K R · · CA · Joined Jan 2014 · Points: 50

If you look in a broad area you may find a crack or another tree if you're really concerned. A long piece of webbing or static rope can extend your usable anchors to a wide area. E.g. I have a 60 foot piece so if there was a second tree 40 feet away I could sling it too.

Brian James · · Appleton, WI · Joined Jun 2012 · Points: 100

Is there a general consensus on the minimum diameter of a tree? I believe I read somewhere maybe in a guide book that it should be a minimum of 6 inches in diameter at the base. I would think it would also depend on the type of tree?

michael s · · Denver, CO · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 80

I would advise purchasing a book on anchor building (or 2) to get good information about your question and others that might come up along the way.

doligo · · Unknown Hometown · Joined Sep 2008 · Points: 264
michael s... wrote:I would advise purchasing a book on anchor building (or 2) to get good information about your question and others that might come up along the way.
Something tells me that the OP has read the book, hence the question.
Marty C · · Herndon, VA · Joined Aug 2008 · Points: 70

There was a paper presented at the ITRS (International Tech Rescue Symposium) in 2010 by Rick Weber - "How to Determine Tree Strength and Build Tree Anchors".

It was concerned primarily with rescue operations and such, but they did have some test results for tree strength that was interesting (bottom line, small trees are surprising strong)

The ITRS website is ITRSonline.org

michael s · · Denver, CO · Joined Apr 2012 · Points: 80
doligo wrote: Something tells me that the OP has read the book, hence the question.
I was not aware there was only one book on climbing anchors. Thank you for your helpful feedback. The pointlessness of my original suggestion has been made clear to me as a result.
Guideline #1: Don't be a jerk.

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